The Most Complete Boxer Ever

[Anthony342]

leonard would always have beaten hagler and he did that after 1 fight in 5 years and being smaller by 2 weight divisions ...hagler .actually even conceded 12 rounds because he wanted a bigger purse and he thought he would have knocked leonard out and only complained about the rounds after he lost to leonard....never mentioned it when he had victories over Hearns and mugabi lol
Look ant your a hagler man and I’m a leonard man and my guy beat your guy and if leonard never sustained his injury it would have happened for sure in late 1982 or early 1983 but it didn’t.
Leonard was also nowhere near his best in 1987
Leonard has actually said that he should have evaluated it more when taking a knee jerk reaction after his fight with Howard and he should have weighed it up more but he said he was under enormous pressure from his wife and his expectations on how he should perform.
But we are not him and we don’t know what was going through his mind and that’s why he hit the bottle and ******* after big time.
I’ve seen this video many times and I know what leonard said and although he said hagler had slipped so had leonard so in my book it was pretty even terms

I'm not a Hagler or a Leonard man, I like both guys. I'm just saying in this case, Leonard pulled some gamesmanship. Hagler was more shopworn by 87 than Leonard, who had more time off too, so Leonard hadn't slipped as much. And like I said, I haven't been critical of the rest of his resume and still regard the Hagler fight as a good win for Leonard, just not a great one, like his wins over Hearns, Duran and Benitez.

[The plunger man]

You're forgetting that the fights with Hearns and Benitez took place at 154 and Hagler at 160, 3 and 4 divisions above Duran's natural weight.

I know bud....look I’m a massive fan of Duran and it’s not about me downplayeing him....he just had an Achilles heel with fighters who showed movement and good defence ...even Kirkland Laing beat him and that was welterweight.
Durans record against slick fighters was not that clever fella

[HOUDINI563]

I was never a huge fan of either fighter but certainly respected their skill sets.

Leonard always had the style advantage over Hagler. Excellent quick lateral movement and top tier hand speed and boxing ability. He was just so much quicker than Hagler. In a 12 round fight odds are Leonard’s slick boxing keeps him away from excessive punishment.

In a 15 round bout I’d still pick Leonard but their is now more time to wear down and stop Ray. Ray also now needs to pace himself so a more static Leonard at certain points in the bout....and an easier target.

[louis54]

Robinson first probably.... But benny leanord, duran, tunney , gans etc are up there for sure

[The plunger man]

I'm not a Hagler or a Leonard man, I like both guys. I'm just saying in this case, Leonard pulled some gamesmanship. Hagler was more shopworn by 87 than Leonard, who had more time off too, so Leonard hadn't slipped as much. And like I said, I haven't been critical of the rest of his resume and still regard the Hagler fight as a good win for Leonard, just not a great one, like his wins over Hearns, Duran and Benitez.

it wasn’t gamesman ship because he was the champion and Leonard was not even a mandatory so hagler didn’t have to fight leonard ...he held the title and cards and people forget that

[Willie Pep 229]

it wasn’t gamesman ship because he was the champion and Leonard was not even a mandatory so hagler didn’t have to fight leonard ...he held the title and cards and people forget that

No Hagler didn't hold the cards, Leonard did, because he was Sugar Ray.

The only shot Hagler had at a mega payday was with Leonard, and Leonard and the public knew it. When it went down back in '86-'87 we all knew Hagler was all-in, but Leonard made us wait.

To the casual fans, who's interest is mandatory if there is to be a million dollar payday, the MW Title didn't mean much when compared to the other guy being "Sugar Ray."

[The Old LefHook]

The Hag gave away a lot of advantages just to scoop up money against Leonard--glove size, ring size, fight length. What did Hagler make, only about $6 million?

[The plunger man]

No Hagler didn't hold the cards, Leonard did, because he was Sugar Ray.

The only shot Hagler had at a mega payday was with Leonard, and Leonard and the public knew it. When it went down back in '86-'87 we all knew Hagler was all-in, but Leonard made us wait.

To the casual fans, who's interest is mandatory if there is to be a million dollar payday, the MW Title didn't mean much when compared to the other guy being "Sugar Ray."

hagler had a choice he was set for life and had made big money fighting hearns and Duran and if he felt that he could not beat leonard he should have retired.
No casual no mandatory so what you talking about....in fact that’s why hagler lost his WBA title because leonard was not there mandatory.
You have Avery cloudy memory of actually what happened with this fight....it was hagler who said he will sit back and lick his chops.
The pint I make is people blame Leonard for taking on a fighter who wanted a bigger purse for less rounds and then blaming him for stepping in the ring....against a fighter that was smaller by 14lbs , had not boxed for over 3 years and had a repaired detached retina.
Hagler got over confident because he thought he would stop leonard and when he didn’t that’s when all the excuses came pouring out from him and his fans.
Leonard also offered hagler a fight a year later and hagler said no and yet leonard would not give him a rematch according to him and his fans

[The plunger man]

The Hag gave away a lot of advantages just to scoop up money against Leonard--glove size, ring size, fight length. What did Hagler make, only about $6 million?

12 million and Leonard got 11 million...hagler also got percentage of all closed circuit and ppv in the Washington , New York and Boston areas.
Leonard was also surprised that hagler gave in so easy to his request for 12 rounds for an extra few million in the purse but Leonard said if hagler said no he would have been fine with 12 rounds....tell me lefty ....if the the hagler vs mugabi and hagler vs hearns were both 12 round fights what was so different to hagler vs Leonard fight....the ring was 24ft and it was the same size as when hagler boxed hearns

[The plunger man]

The Hag gave away a lot of advantages just to scoop up money against Leonard--glove size, ring size, fight length. What did Hagler make, only about $6 million?

not sure what the rules were for size gloves in 1987 but I know it’s 10oz gloves for fighters above 154lbs in pro boxing now and they did wear 10oz gloves for the hagler vs Leonard fight ..the only negotiating on gloves Leonard did was he insisted on attached thumbs because of his eye injury and didn’t want to get thumbed.
As I said I cannot find out what size middleweights wore in the 80’s I just know there 10oz now