A Ready to Roll James Toney vs Roy Jones

[BKM-]

Wow.

Yeah mate he hurt my feelings so badly.

I literally do nothing but point out facts about James Toney, that’s it. I’m objective, break it down for what it is and well open for debate.

Fanboys don’t like that, but it is what is.

Nothing I say about James Toney isn’t true.

Yeah, no. That's not gonna cut it. You gotta do better than "all I do is point out factz" to justify your obsession of the man because everybody except you can clearly see that there is something deeper there.

I rant a lot about Mike Tyson but I can freely admit that he irks me because of his behavior in and out of the ring, and what he represents in the worst type of boxing fans and is worshipped for. Two things though, 1-I talk about many boxers and 2-I don't go out of my way to zero in on Tyson because he is THE most talked about boxer here, I couldn't avoid him if I tried so to speak.

I can see why the gentlemen here say they could never figure out what Toney did to you, how he hurt you.

[IronDanHamza]

Yeah, no. That's not gonna cut it. You gotta do better than "all I do is point out factz" to justify your obsession of the man because everybody except you can clearly see that there is something deeper there.

I rant a lot about Mike Tyson but I can freely admit that he irks me because of his behavior in and out of the ring, and what he represents in the worst type of boxing fans and is worshipped for. Two things though, 1-I talk about many boxers and 2-I don't go out of my way to zero in on Tyson because he is THE most talked about boxer here, I couldn't avoid him if I tried so to speak.

I can see why the gentlemen here say they could never figure out what Toney did to you, how he hurt you.

Are you actually under the impression that I don’t talk about many boxers on this website? Check my post history, I don’t even post often about James Toney If there’s a thread about Toney then sure I’ll post in there.

Oh look we have a psychiatrist on our hands here How much do you charge? There’s nothing “deeper” here I don’t even dislike Toney, in fact, I like his style. His style of fighting is appeasing to my eyes. I just combat the fantasy world that his fanboys live in and point out facts around his career and performances.

I’m open to disliking fighters. I Dislike Joe Calzaghe, I dislike George Groves, I dislike Muhammad Ali, I dislike Rocky Lockridge. I dislike loads of fighters over the years. What I am is objective about all of their careers just as I am Toney’s.

James Toney gets posted about more because there’s no delusion around any of the other fighters listed above and they don’t have massive internet fanbases spouting nonsense regarding their careers.

Maybe Calzaghe does, and you’ll see me in pretty much every thread involving him too when the same happens with him.

It’s hilarious that you think that has to be a “deeper” meaning to this, Doc. It’s boxing it is really not that serious.

[Rockin']

What I was saying with the title of this thread was if James had been 100% we could have easily witnessed a fight of the century type of thing.

I am not saying that James would beat Roy. Just as I am not saying that Roy beats James at 100%. What I am saying is it would have been great to see. But it happened like it happened, a W for Roy and an L for James...……...Rockin'

[BKM-]

Are you actually under the impression that I don’t talk about many boxers on this website? Check my post history, I don’t even post often about James Toney If there’s a thread about Toney then sure I’ll post in there.

Oh look we have a psychiatrist on our hands here How much do you charge? There’s nothing “deeper” here I don’t even dislike Toney, in fact, I like his style. His style of fighting is appeasing to my eyes. I just combat the fantasy world that his fanboys live in and point out facts around his career and performances.

I’m open to disliking fighters. I Dislike Joe Calzaghe, I dislike George Groves, I dislike Muhammad Ali, I dislike Rocky Lockridge. I dislike loads of fighters over the years. What I am is objective about all of their careers just as I am Toney’s.

James Toney gets posted about more because there’s no delusion around any of the other fighters listed above and they don’t have massive internet fanbases spouting nonsense regarding their careers.

Maybe Calzaghe does, and you’ll see me in pretty much every thread involving him too when the same happens with him.

It’s hilarious that you think that has to be a “deeper” meaning to this, Doc. It’s boxing it is really not that serious.

Clearly it is that serious to you otherwise you would not be ranting and raving like an obsessed man about that man. 10 out of 10 Toney threads(I don't even have half that percentage when it comes to Tyson and I told you I have 2 good arguments why) will have you in it with the same dedication and intensity and you're telling me it's actually meaningless to you? LOL

Not a chance. You're not gonna be honest with me here so there's no use continuing this. If you ever want to tell me what James Toney did to break your heart, PM any time. I'm here for you.

[BKM-]

I could never speak to Hammy's understanding... But regarding Toney the guy shows skills in the ring. You can literally watch film of Archie Moore and James Toney and see many of the same skills used. Toney with all his foibles always has been game, and yes, had some very impressive outings. but what perhaps really alludes some of Toney's critics, including Hammy, is how natural James is in the ring... How he can fight up, or down and adapt so well to the differences. Certainly this includes inconsistent outings, but Toney also was the type who would take a fight tomorrow lol.

Rein wrote about Toney and in an omage to James he described Toney as transforming: coming into the ring a hip hop laden, braggert, and when the fight starts, looking like he lives in the ring 24/7, doing so many things well, and doing them as second nature. Really showing the beauty of the Sweet Science.

There are different ways to judge a fighter, not everything is in the win loss column, or even the competition beaten. Tony certainly had his moments this way, but other aspects like how Toney went into the midst of the heavyweight division and was more than competative against the guys at the top, are impressive accomplishments that don't necessarily show up empirically. Much like the guy he seems to have studied (Archie Moore) Toney fought in many weight classes, and was always a dangerous opponent.

I tend to discount judges and decisions under certain circmstances... It certainly is fair to say that no judge was needed to confirm Jones had his way with James, but what about (despite the judges) how Toney gave a boxing clinic fighting Rahman and Sam Peter? Sure it can be said that the version of Holly he beat was lacking, but he showed it was no fluke imo in these heavyweight fights.

I know what you mean especially about him being a natural. What also really struck me about Toney was how calm he was in the ring, even under massive fire. Never flustered, never panicked(reminds me of MMA's Gegard Mousasi). The only exceptions I can think of is when Roid knocked him off balance.

Truly born to fight. Which is why it's too bad that his main weakness was his discipline and that's atleast a good reason for his criticsm(not something like Hammy where an autograph attempt with Toney went awry). He could have been greater if he had that sorted out. With his natural abilities and well roundedness? Like I said, very few guys were that gifted.

[billeau2]

I’ve never disputed that Toney is a natural when it comes to fighting. If anything that’s exactly what he is, a natural.

Obviously Archie Moore have similarities, Toney clearly took parts of Moore’s game and adapted his own version, the same way Adrien Broner clearly did the same with Toney.

Difference is Broner ain’t no James Toney and James Toney ain’t no Archie Moore.

Toney didn’t school Peter or Rahman under any stretch of the imagination. In fact, Toney didn’t really school anyone. “Schooling” is not something that Toney did. He competed with top level guys, beat some, lost to some, and struggled to clearly beat any of them.

The only “schooling” of Toney’s career was when Roy Jones schooled him. That’s a real schooling.

Could also say Reggie Johnson schooled Toney for 6 rounds but of course fights aren’t 6 rounds for a reason.

he didn't struggle at heavy weight. Rahman claimed Toney schooled him BTW. Im not going to get into a whole thing with you Dan... Schooling is subjective. If I say Toney schooled Holyfield you claim Holy was ripe for the taking, If I say Toney schooled Rahman as stated by Rahman you will make some other claim to the contrary... YOU just do not like Toney. Its obvious to everyone here but you. And I don't know how you get any connection of Broner to Toney...Not saying its not there, I don't see it.

[billeau2]

I know what you mean especially about him being a natural. What also really struck me about Toney was how calm he was in the ring, even under massive fire. Never flustered, never panicked(reminds me of MMA's Gegard Mousasi). The only exceptions I can think of is when Roid knocked him off balance.

Truly born to fight. Which is why it's too bad that his main weakness was his discipline and that's atleast a good reason for his criticsm(not something like Hammy where an autograph attempt with Toney went awry). He could have been greater if he had that sorted out. With his natural abilities and well roundedness? Like I said, very few guys were that gifted.

Lol is that what happened? All this time I thought Toney raced ahead of Dan and grabbed the last shrimp roll off the buffet!

Its also just Toney's personality I think... Some fighters could fight on the drop of a hat. Toney relied on that attitude and naturally sometimes it failed him.

[billeau2]

Are you actually under the impression that I don’t talk about many boxers on this website? Check my post history, I don’t even post often about James Toney If there’s a thread about Toney then sure I’ll post in there.

Oh look we have a psychiatrist on our hands here How much do you charge? There’s nothing “deeper” here I don’t even dislike Toney, in fact, I like his style. His style of fighting is appeasing to my eyes. I just combat the fantasy world that his fanboys live in and point out facts around his career and performances.

I’m open to disliking fighters. I Dislike Joe Calzaghe, I dislike George Groves, I dislike Muhammad Ali, I dislike Rocky Lockridge. I dislike loads of fighters over the years. What I am is objective about all of their careers just as I am Toney’s.

James Toney gets posted about more because there’s no delusion around any of the other fighters listed above and they don’t have massive internet fanbases spouting nonsense regarding their careers.

Maybe Calzaghe does, and you’ll see me in pretty much every thread involving him too when the same happens with him.

It’s hilarious that you think that has to be a “deeper” meaning to this, Doc. It’s boxing it is really not that serious.

Lol with you on Calzaghe. Guy stepped up once...Everyone had talked up Lacy and Lacy was in his prime... And Lacy turned out to have many weaknesses.

[IronDanHamza]

Clearly it is that serious to you otherwise you would not be ranting and raving like an obsessed man about that man. 10 out of 10 Toney threads(I don't even have half that percentage when it comes to Tyson and I told you I have 2 good arguments why) will have you in it with the same dedication and intensity and you're telling me it's actually meaningless to you? LOL

Not a chance. You're not gonna be honest with me here so there's no use continuing this. If you ever want to tell me what James Toney did to break your heart, PM any time. I'm here for you.

He refused me a picture, Doc.

I’m still so cut up about it

[IronDanHamza]

he didn't struggle at heavy weight. Rahman claimed Toney schooled him BTW. Im not going to get into a whole thing with you Dan... Schooling is subjective. If I say Toney schooled Holyfield you claim Holy was ripe for the taking, If I say Toney schooled Rahman as stated by Rahman you will make some other claim to the contrary... YOU just do not like Toney. Its obvious to everyone here but you. And I don't know how you get any connection of Broner to Toney...Not saying its not there, I don't see it.

Broner’s just a very poor version of Toney I’d say. Stylistic simialires with no where near the skill, talent or heart.

Don’t dislike Toney. I like that style of fighting I like defensive fighters. I like Ian Napa too but if he had a rabid fan base talking nonsense I’d say the same thing. He just doesn’t obviously because he wasn’t very good.

Rahman said Toney schooled him? Where? Show me. I’d be interested to read or hear that.

Toney battered Holyfield’s corpse yeah. Don’t see the relevance to that?

Schooling isn’t that subjective. Roy Jones took James Toney to school. That’s a fact. I’m not sure who James Toney schooled. Past prime Iran Barkley but so did a number of people.