Ron Lyle vs Deontay Wilder

[billeau2]

He couldn't put Zelenoff to sleep.

Thats cause Zelenoff was slippery because of the piss and s h i t he was taking on himself as Wilder stood over him.

[BKM-]

Ron Lyle, that's one who makes a case for Wilder's legacy. Lyle fought in the golden era and made it very far with raw punching power and not much else.

[them_apples]

Ron Lyle, that's one who makes a case for Wilder's legacy. Lyle fought in the golden era and made it very far with raw punching power and not much else.

Yeah but honestly non of those guys were bad boxers. Lyle had pretty good boxing skills, and he was tough with a good chin.

When we speak of Wilder, this is the first champ ever that had next to 0 skills, I mean Carnera type heavyweight. Literally. Carnera was hyped in his day too.

[billeau2]

Yeah but honestly non of those guys were bad boxers. Lyle had pretty good boxing skills, and he was tough with a good chin.

When we speak of Wilder, this is the first champ ever that had next to 0 skills, I mean Carnera type heavyweight. Literally. Carnera was hyped in his day too.

Shavers and Lyle had ways of fighting when they were hit. They could take the fight inside, etc. Wilder shuts down when he is pressured enough. He has great resistance for sure, but he stands in front of his guy. This hasn't even worked so well. I mean if you look carefully at the Ortiz fights Wilder was very vulnerable.

I would love to see Wilder fight Ruiz... A pressure fighter. Judging from what I have seen I do not see wilder having success against Ruiz. Lyle could fight inside against a pressure fighter and Shavers had some mobility.

[BKM-]

Yeah but honestly non of those guys were bad boxers. Lyle had pretty good boxing skills, and he was tough with a good chin.

When we speak of Wilder, this is the first champ ever that had next to 0 skills, I mean Carnera type heavyweight. Literally. Carnera was hyped in his day too.

When Max Baer fought Carnera it was basicely two windmilling drunks at a bar, and both of those goofs held the title, they were from your beloved Joe Louis era and he supposedly boasts wins over them.

Anyway on Lyle, he was also a late starter in boxing and relied purely on his genetics/natural talents. He did not have boxing skills, that's just you sucking up to the old timers here as usual. He had the basics, he could jab and set up his attacks but his footwork was stiff and showed his late start in the game. No what he had was good punching selection and tremendous killer instincts and toughness.

He didn't have the size/strength to take it to Wilder inside, and he would get timed and sparked from the outside eventually.

But like I said, he really makes a case for Wilder. Sometimes a natural deadly puncher comes along and is a force to be reckoned with despite lack of experience. Most era's had guys like this.

[Rusty Tromboni]

Shavers and Lyle had ways of fighting when they were hit. They could take the fight inside, etc. Wilder shuts down when he is pressured enough. He has great resistance for sure, but he stands in front of his guy. This hasn't even worked so well. I mean if you look carefully at the Ortiz fights Wilder was very vulnerable.

I would love to see Wilder fight Ruiz... A pressure fighter. Judging from what I have seen I do not see wilder having success against Ruiz. Lyle could fight inside against a pressure fighter and Shavers had some mobility.

Is that thunder I hear, or Jerry Quarry in Heaven above laughing hysterically?

[them_apples]

When Max Baer fought Carnera it was basicely two windmilling drunks at a bar, and both of those goofs held the title, they were from your beloved Joe Louis era and he supposedly boasts wins over them.

Anyway on Lyle, he was also a late starter in boxing and relied purely on his genetics/natural talents. He did not have boxing skills, that's just you sucking up to the old timers here as usual. He had the basics, he could jab and set up his attacks but his footwork was stiff and showed his late start in the game. No what he had was good punching selection and tremendous killer instincts and toughness.

He didn't have the size/strength to take it to Wilder inside, and he would get timed and sparked from the outside eventually.

But like I said, he really makes a case for Wilder. Sometimes a natural deadly puncher comes along and is a force to be reckoned with despite lack of experience. Most era's had guys like this.

Max Baer was a good fighter, you just don't know what you are watching because you have never boxed. Same goes for Lyle, he's twice as skilled as Wilder. He throws balanced shots and places them. He changes his speed up, changes his rythm up. All textbook stuff. He doesn't do a 360 when he misses.

Baer was a very reckless fighter, but he had fighting skills. You don't know what you are watching that's the problem. You think skills are just who returns their hands back to the same position perfectly. Or if a fighter constantly keeps his stance perfect. It's really all just aesthetic bull**** that looks nice to someone who doesn't understand the sweet science. Boxing is all about timing and feints, a guy like gene Fullmer probably looks like a wild swinging bum to you, but he's actually a crafty and difficult fighter for anyone.

Maidana for all intents and purposes is a plodding wild swinging fighter, with crude but effective fighting skills that allowed him to contend with Mayweather, could have scored it a draw or a win in his favor.

I don't have old time bias, the games just changed. Fury exposed Wilder for the clown that he is. Fury uses old school tricks he copied from old fighters, textbook **** they all did. He understood Wilder was just a modern day hypejob clown who was putting on an act and really isn't a killer at all.

But that being said, this widestanced stilt legged 720 swinging helecopter Wilder still became a world champ today, so don't ever knock Max Baer, even by your own logic.

[Rusty Tromboni]

Yeah but honestly non of those guys were bad boxers. Lyle had pretty good boxing skills, and he was tough with a good chin.

When we speak of Wilder, this is the first champ ever that had next to 0 skills, I mean Carnera type heavyweight. Literally. Carnera was hyped in his day too.

What "good boxing skills" did Lyle have? In what fight(s) did he demonstrate them? What was his best performance? How do you explain away his loss to Quarry?

Carnera and Wilder fight nothing alike. Wilder is most like Johansson; who, with very limited experience, smoked Machen and Patterson.

[Rusty Tromboni]

What could Lyle do that Ortiz can't?

[them_apples]

What could Lyle do that Ortiz can't?

Lyle and Ortiz are similar in skill.

Ortiz is 45 though we don't know how good he was or could have been.

Lyles got a better chin and is more resilient, could be the age though.

Outside of skill though there are a whole world of attributes you are ignoring. A fighters heart on the big stage is a huge factor. We don't know the kind of level Ortiz fights to, we've only seen him fight Wilder lol. He might **** his pants if he got in with an ATG