The 25 GOAT.

[Elroy The Great]

The point I was trying to get across to you was that technique can look sloppy when applied and if one does not know what to look for it appears that no technique is being used at all.

and the opposite can also be said. after missing 50 punches a guy finally lands 1, that guy can say ''yeah, thats how we did it in training camp.''

i dont buy that.

[billeau2]

and the opposite can also be said. after missing 50 punches a guy finally lands 1, that guy can say ''yeah, thats how we did it in training camp.''

i dont buy that.

:*******: Oh I know you don't. Flat Earthers can't see certain things so they cannot be validated to exist... And the Earth is flat right? Because you cannot see how something is done, it must not exist. And because people half azz things somehow that invalidates my point?

Silly argument. But to each his own.

[Elroy The Great]

:*******: Oh I know you don't. Flat Earthers can't see certain things so they cannot be validated to exist... And the Earth is flat right? Because you cannot see how something is done, it must not exist. And because people half azz things somehow that invalidates my point?

Silly argument. But to each his own.

case in point; rocky fans dont see clumsy. they see planned, subtle moves. scientific angles and such.

to each their own indeed.

[ShoulderRoll]

As for me, I want to see men fight with Viking swords, not toothpicks. Any sword that kills instead of merely scoring a touch...

Another way to approach such a list is to include only those for whom extensive film evidence exists.

Either way, why didn't Joe Louis make it on your list?

[Elroy The Great]

Either way, why didn't Joe Louis make it on your list?

the TS isnt much of a host.....

[Elroy The Great]

This kind of precision reasoning is rare in boxing, by God. Like Ramanujan, my mind skips to the essence adroitly and without need of proof, later examination always bearing out my conjectures in detail.

The crossover term from chess is drawing master. Very few drawing masters make the GOAT list. Mayweather, Whitaker, Benitez, Locche, Mike Gibbons,...Pep, were all drawing masters who seldom beat the urine out of first class opponents but could spoil anyone's game down to an either-way decision. The choice of one drawing master over another for the list is arbitrary, as one is as good as another to me, but some people might want a list half full of drawing masters because of the high level of defensive skill on display As for me, I want to see men fight with Viking swords, not toothpicks. Any sword that kills instead of merely scoring a touch.

Some drawing masters have more pop than others. Some walk the line of even being a drawing master. Locche was the most pure drawing master ever seen by these eyes, though one has a su****ion that Mike Gibbons was equally elusive and feather-fisted.

On the other end of the spectrum one can reasonably contend it might be too easy for destruction machines to make it onto my list. The most obvious case is Tyson, with his little strip in time of brilliance.

Another way to approach such a list is to include only those for whom extensive film evidence exists.

It is not necessary to lay out every reason for every entry since most people on here understand most of the reasons on sight for any boxer. Such informal polls are opinion pieces, not phd dissertations.

how much worth does an ACTUAL RESUME hold ?!?!?!?

how can a guy be rated if he has no or almost no fights to view ?!?!?!?

i understand you like a certain style of fighter but, in the end, the quality of ones ACTUAL RESUME should trump all.

[The Old LefHook]

If a man applies at my corporation for work, according to you I cannot hire him. Instead, I must excuse him with the line: "Sorry, mister, you have a great resume, but since I have never seen you work, I cannot hire you."

Looking at a man's resume is not to see him work, sir, but to appreciate and appraise what he has done anyway. Very few people who get hired have been seen in action by their new boss. They got hired on the basis of evidence that was written on a piece of paper.

All corporation owners would like to see those they hire in action before they are hired. Unfortunately, it does not work that way, in business because it is impractical and in boxing lists because time is a one-way arrow.

[BM dnobagaV]

:*******: Oh I know you don't. Flat Earthers can't see certain things so they cannot be validated to exist... And the Earth is flat right? Because you cannot see how something is done, it must not exist. And because people half azz things somehow that invalidates my point?

Silly argument. But to each his own.

Actually a common myth, nobody believed the Earth was flat. They just believed that there was no Western Hemisphere, I.e. The America's.

Thousands of dollars university education comin' at you homie.

[RedZmaja]

All those TOP 10 / TOP 25 etc lists in boxing always look ridiculous to me. Guys from all kinds of eras and weight classes mixed up with no coherent criteria.

Personally I think we can only compare guys from the same era, boxing just changes way too much, especially since the only way you can compare modern guys with some of the old boxers is by looking at resumes since the footage is so limited and you can't compare them skill by skill.

While the rules don't change the entire format around the game has changed dramatically so it's impossible to compare resumes from entirely different eras. I mean look at Marciano fighting journeymen with 0.500 type of records in his prime. His 49-0 resume is completely different from Floyd's 49-0.

Modern boxers simply box in a different format of competition now with the A-side and the B-side, the weight classes, the PEDs, the catchweights, the ABC belts, the long training camps, the ducking, protecting the 0 etc. When you focus on resume you have to have that in mind.

I guess you can compare best wins and losses but those wins and losses happened in different circumstances. Sugar Ray Robinson lost to LaMotta and won the rematch in the same month. How would Kovalev's and Ward's resume look if they got to rematch each other in the space of a month? We'll never know.

If Ward and Kovalev fought each other 5 times and one of them won 4 of those fights his resume would look insanely good. And the other guy's resume would also be enhanced because he would have that one win against the guy who now looks insanely good. That's why I think a lot of those old fighters have such overrated resumes. They just had so much more opportunities to rack up quality wins and everyone forgives them their losses. But how well would they look if they had to be carefully managed and then fight only few elite fighters in their career and those fights would only happen after months of specific training camps?

[Elroy The Great]

If a man applies at my corporation for work, according to you I cannot hire him. Instead, I must excuse him with the line: "Sorry, mister, you have a great resume, but since I have never seen you work, I cannot hire you."

couldnt go any further.......

IF they even HAD a great resume !!!!!!!!!!

omg 82 straight bums........not many ATGs RESUMES can boast that level of greatness !