Sandy Saddler

[IronDanHamza]

Very good fighter, Top 35 ATG for my money beat a lot of contenders and a good amount of Champs and HOF routinely went up and weight to fight Lightweights as a FW/JLW, although his title runs are quite disappointing his wins against top opposition make up for it and being the Lineal champion is 2 divisions is a very impressive feat. Had 2 handed punching power with a terrific left hook and right hand, it wouldn't be crazy to say he is a Top 10 P4P puncher.

Although Saddler lacks quality outside Pep and Flash Elorde. He really has alot of wins over Top ranked competition.

He's a great fighter. Definitely a great fighter.

[Barn]

Although Saddler lacks quality outside Pep and Flash Elorde. He really has alot of wins over Top ranked competition.

He's a great fighter. Definitely a great fighter.

Not that much lack of quality, Joe Brown, Billy Petrolle who were all HOF ., that's 4 wins over HOF opposition, not bad. Also numerous wins over previous and future world champs like Paddy Demarco.

[McGoorty]

Saddler beat at least 10 great fighters. He was dirty, but Willie Pep was just as guilty. As a featherweight I rate him easily top 5, there can be little doubt about it, I shudder to think of what he'd have done to Laguna, Famechon, Fenech, and many other FW champions. To beat WW Billy Petrolle, a body puncher of the most debilitating awesomeness (yeah, I got that word in somehow)..... as a lighter man is testament....... to beat Pep, even at that stage of Pep's career is simply great, I rate Pep as one of the top three fighters to ever live. ......... Saddler is very high on the all-time greats list well in the top 50.......... Sandy fought TALL better than any fighter under WW, and maybe well above. He had a similar p4p power as Tommy Hearns, similar builds too, which help make their reach add to their power,.... like a lead ball on the end of a whip. Yes sandy Saddler was great,,...... black, white or brindle,... boy's.... lets keep race out of this,,.. boxing is colour blind....... be freinds.

[IronDanHamza]

Not that much lack of quality, Joe Brown, Billy Petrolle who were all HOF ., that's 4 wins over HOF opposition, not bad. Also numerous wins over previous and future world champs like Paddy Demarco.

Ah I forgot Billy Petrolle. Pretty sure I highlighted to you in the other Sandy Saddler thread that he was a HOF'er

Joe Brown was very green at the time. Still a good win. But no where near the full article he became.

But back to the point. Considering how many fights Sandy Saddler had, the fact he only has 4 HOF'ers on his resume and one being a lower tier HOF'er with the other being very green just shows that his quality wasn't that great.

I mean, obviously it was good. Very good, he's a Top 35 ATG.

I just don't think his quality was that good. People tend to sleep on the amount of Top ranked opposition he actually fought, though.

[Barn]

Ah I forgot Billy Petrolle. Pretty sure I highlighted to you in the other Sandy Saddler thread that he was a HOF'er

True fax

Joe Brown was very green at the time. Still a good win. But no where near the full article he became.

Fair enough. But, then again people credit Johnson for his wins against Jeanette and McVea despite them being horribly green, just because they became great in the future, I think he should be given at least if not more the same credit than Johnson did for his Jeanette and McVey wins.

But back to the point. Considering how many fights Sandy Saddler had, the fact he only has 4 HOF'ers on his resume and one being a lower tier HOF'er with the other being very green just shows that his quality wasn't that great.

I don't feel people should be punished for having a bad ratio to be honest.
I mean, obviously it was good. Very good, he's a Top 35 ATG.

I just don't think his quality was that good. People tend to sleep on the amount of Top ranked opposition he actually fought, though.

I agree with the last statement. To be fair though you and many others(including myself just not to as big an extent) do rank Slapsie Maxie very high for the same reasons.

[IronDanHamza]

Fair enough. But, then again people credit Johnson for his wins against Jeanette and McVea despite them being horribly green, just because they became great in the future, I think he should be given at least if not more the same credit than Johnson did for his Jeanette and McVey wins.

Absolutely.

I give as much credit to Saddler for that win as I do Jack Johnson for his wins over those green opponents. Just enough.

I don't feel people should be punished for having a bad ratio to be honest.

Why not?

That's the main thing Saddler is usually critiszied for.

I think it's reasonable logic. He had so many fights but I just don't think the overwhelming quality is there.

Not that that makes him not great or is even his fault.

It just holds his greatness back a tad, for me.

I agree with the last statement. To be fair though you and many others(including myself just not to as big an extent) do rank Slapsie Maxie very high for the same reasons. .

I think Maxie Rosenbloom is rated so highly because not only does he have the most wins over top ranked opposition of all time but he also has alot of quality amongst it.

With wins over HOF opposition into the double figures.

Can't really see how that compares to Sandy Saddler's situation my friend.

[Barn]

Why not?

Ray Leonard beat about 4 HOF off the top of my head, the same as Saddler, I know Leonards were better but, say the weren't. He shouldn't get extra credit for those wins just because he didn't have as many other fights. If you understand what I'm saying.



I think Maxie Rosenbloom is rated so highly because not only does he have the most wins over top ranked opposition of all time but he also has alot of quality amongst it.

With wins over HOF opposition into the double figures.

Can't really see how that compares to Sandy Saddler's situation my friend.

I know it might not have been the best example but, people forget Slapsie lost a lot to his HOF competition.

I got 7 HOF's beaten for Slapsie after a bit of research I just did, please correct me if I am wrong.

If you count the amount of HOF beaten then you also have to take into account the loses. I ended up with a final tally of 16-14-4 for Maxies HOF record and Sandy;s 5-2-1. Yes he has 15 wins against HOF opposition(which is great I'm not saying) but, he has 14 losses whereas Saddlers record is better.

Anyways this is a whole different thread.

Sorry if this sounds weird and I'm coming across as picky, this debate has been good for me as I've got quite a bit of knowledge from the research.

[RubenSonny]

Thanks mate! Finally someone who has enough brains and logic to see the truth in my comments, instead of taking to some bs rhetoric.

LOL @ your circle jerk with that blatantly racist troll

[Barn]

LOL @ your circle jerk with that blatantly racist troll

[joseph5620]

LOL @ your circle jerk with that blatantly racist troll

Pastrano's happy because he found somebody here equally as racist as he is . Birds of a feather.........