Roy Jones on his place in history

[Scott9945]

And we know this because of which high-quality Light-Heavy Moorer beat? Point is, how exactly can you judge how good a fighter is when they didn't fight anyone of note? Lots of fighters look phenominal against the Sisters of the Poor then come apart when they move up in class. Moorer didn't exactly have a sturdy chin either and Jones wasn't lacking in power.

Poet

The best lightheavy Moorer ever fought was Leslie Stewart, who had already been KO'd in his two previous title fights. Frankie Swindell had Moorer badly hurt. We just saw with David Lemioux how dramatic a step up in class can be for a killer puncher.

[StarshipTrooper]

Moorer's chin struggled against some big punchers at Heavyweight. Stewart, Holyfield, Tua, Cooper, Foreman...all had serious power of a sort Jones wouldn't muster. Moorer took a lot of good Heavy shots. I realize his Light Heavy dossier wasn't great but we know what kind of fighter he was in general. He's not an unknown commodity and he at least beat some solid guys at 75 (hell, Swindell and Stewart were on par with more than a few Jones challengers). I'd bet, based on having seen what it took to knock both guys out, that Moorer takes Jones shot a hell of a lot better than the opposite. Throw in a reach advantage, about four-five inches in height (Jones is really only about 5'10, Moorer 6'2 and change), and bombs in his hands, I stand by my take.

I mean the question can go back...we KNOW Moorer could punch and had a HIGH degree of skill to go with. What high quality KO artist did Jones ever beat? Who ever hit Roy with the sort of shot Moorer could to make anyone think Jones c ould take the blow?

The eyeball test only tells you so much: Who a fighter is doing it against has to be considered.....Especially when you're talking about matching him against a proven commodity like Jones. I wouldn't exactly consider Holyfield a big puncher either: A decent puncher sure, but a big hitter? Same with Cooper. Stewart's power is grossly overrated but that's food for another thread. Could Moorer take the shot that fractured Virgil Hill's vertabrae? Could he take the left hook that starched Montell Griffin? I'm inclined to doubt it.

Poet

[joseph5620]

Moorer's chin struggled against some big punchers at Heavyweight. Stewart, Holyfield, Tua, Cooper, Foreman...all had serious power of a sort Jones wouldn't muster. Moorer took a lot of good Heavy shots. I realize his Light Heavy dossier wasn't great but we know what kind of fighter he was in general. He's not an unknown commodity and he at least beat some solid guys at 75 (hell, Swindell and Stewart were on par with more than a few Jones challengers). I'd bet, based on having seen what it took to knock both guys out, that Moorer takes Jones shot a hell of a lot better than the opposite. Throw in a reach advantage, about four-five inches in height (Jones is really only about 5'10, Moorer 6'2 and change), and bombs in his hands, I stand by my take.

I mean the question can go back...we KNOW Moorer could punch and had a HIGH degree of skill to go with. What high quality KO artist did Jones ever beat? Who ever hit Roy with the sort of shot Moorer could to make anyone think Jones c ould take the blow?

You would a have a hard time finding even one of Jones title challengers on par with Swindell. And Stewart was beyond shot when Moorer beat him. But if those are the best Moorer has to offer at 175 that's pretty pathetic when comparing him to Jones at that weight.

[crold1]

You would a have a hard time finding even one of Jones title challengers on par with Swindell.

Ricky Frazier.

I win.



I'd also throw in Harmon, Gonzalez, Grant (coming up from Middle), and Kelly as on par with Swindell. Swindell versus any is a tough fight. and he beats Frazier.

[crold1]

The eyeball test only tells you so much: Who a fighter is doing it against has to be considered.....Especially when you're talking about matching him against a proven commodity like Jones. I wouldn't exactly consider Holyfield a big puncher either: A decent puncher sure, but a big hitter? Same with Cooper. Stewart's power is grossly overrated but that's food for another thread. Could Moorer take the shot that fractured Virgil Hill's vertabrae? Could he take the left hook that starched Montell Griffin? I'm inclined to doubt it.

Poet

Could Jones take the sort of shots Griffin landed, with relative ease, against Jones in the first fight? Jones would be Glenn'd. I saw enough about what Moorer was as a fighter at Heavyweight to feel safe guessing what he'd do, in shape and fully motivated as he'd be for that caliber foe, at 175. And Holyfield was a much bigger puncher, at Heavy, than Jones was at Light Heavy.

[joseph5620]

The eyeball test only tells you so much: Who a fighter is doing it against has to be considered.....Especially when you're talking about matching him against a proven commodity like Jones. I wouldn't exactly consider Holyfield a big puncher either: A decent puncher sure, but a big hitter? Same with Cooper. Stewart's power is grossly overrated but that's food for another thread. Could Moorer take the shot that fractured Virgil Hill's vertabrae? Could he take the left hook that starched Montell Griffin? I'm inclined to doubt it.

Poet

I've always believed that too.

[joseph5620]

Ricky Frazier.

I win.



I'd also throw in Harmon, Gonzalez, Grant (coming up from Middle), and Kelly as on par with Swindell. Swindell versus any is a tough fight. and he beats Frazier.

No possible way is Swindell on par with any of those fighters. Maybe you would like to explain how?

[StarshipTrooper]

I've always believed that too.

Who exactly did he KO anyway? David Jaco and Conroy Nelson? :hahahaha9:

[crold1]

No possible way is Swindell on par with any of those fighters. Maybe you would like to explain how?

I think he's competitive (pick em) on a good day with any of them. I am probably underselling Gonzalez of that crew; he was a warrior who could sneak up. I don't think too highly of most of the rank and file at 175 between the Spinks era and right now (I think the division has been on an uptick in the last five years or so).

And, hey, Frazier is the gift that keeps on giving.

[Steak]

Moorer fought nobodies at LHW. But based on his performances at HW, I think its pretty fair to say that he would have given Roy hell.