Lennox Lewis Or Sonny Liston?

[StarshipTrooper]

Maybe I like Ruiz because so many hated him. But the kid had heart and fought some good fighters. I wish he had that go for it mentality earlier in his career that he showed in the Haye fight, he would be viewed differently if he had. Classy guy though, I hope retirement treats him well.

He's a likable guy and not a bad fighter per se, just not what I'd call a championship calibre fighter and he was unwatchable. I think is stay at the "top" was more do to Don King's string pulling than anything else. I thought he showed balls against Haye and like yourself would have liked to see him fight that way throughout his career and not just in his career finale.

Poet

[sonnyboyx2]

its `swings & roundabouts` here.. wether you like or dislike John Ruiz you have to accept that he put Evander Holyfield on the floor something Lewis never came near to doing in 2 fights, yes his fights was terrible to watch but so was many of Lennox Lewis fights.

[Postman prat]

What a ****in cowardly fraud Lennox Lewis really was.

Lol what a joke you are.You're the coward here ****.

[General Zod]

you must have a short memory...
Lewis was stripped of the WBA belt for refusing to fight the No1 contender John Ruiz, stripped of the IBF belt for refusing to fight No1 contender Chris Byrd and stripped of the WBC belt for refusing to fight Vitali Klitschko..

Lewis promised the world that he would face Vitali in a return fight yet waited unto 3 days before he was to be stripped of the WBC belt and announced his retirement.

Lewis was champion in 92 and throughout the 90s he avoided every other fighter who held a version of the heavyweight title. Holmes, Sanders, Jones Jr., Ruiz, Tyson, Foreman, Holyfield, Moorer, Wlad Klitschko, Bowe. Link below:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y0eins2DhSo

Lewis turned down $13.5 Million and a guaranteed world title fight to face Mike Tyson in 1996 when he was No1 contender for the WBC title, he accepted $4 million step-a-side money so that Tyson could continue to unify the title by getting Bruce Seldons WBA title.. Lewis knew that he stood little chance against that version of Mike Tyson or he would have said NO to the step-a-side money and went ahead and accepted a career highest purse and fought Tyson then himself fought Bruce Seldon..

Lewis spewed out all this propaganda about everyone was afraid to fight him when in fact the offers was always turned down by Lewis..if you believe that all the top fighters was afraid of Lewis then you must also believe there is fairies at the bottom of the garden.

Dude, you are still going on with this nonsense? Give it a break already. I have proved evey single one of this points wrong time and time again but you still hold on to them, why is that?

[General Zod]

why would Lewis step-a-side and do that other than he did not fancy his chances against that version of Mike Tyson... if Lewis thought he could beat Tyson he would have jumped at the chance of a career highest purse and a world title shot

This is nonsense, he accepted the money with the guarentee that he would get his shot after Tyson beat Sheldon.
Which would you take 13.5m or 16.5m? Tyson was stripped by the WBC for not fighting Lewis so how could you accuse Lewis of ducking him?

he would have beat Tyson for the title then beat Seldon & Moorer in unification fights, then beat Holyfield & again beat Tyson to make well in excess of $100 million and all the glory that went with it... not accepted a meagre $4 million step-a-side money while Tyson won another title from Bruce Seldon..

Teddy Atlas in on record as saying that he didnt want Moorer to fight Lewis, because Lewis was considered too dangerous
As for you other point see my post above

. The bottom line is that Lewis just never fancied the job against that version of Tyson or Holyfield for that matter

Holyfield didnt want to face Lewis in the early 90's it was the WBC that told him he had to face Lewis after he beat Bowe. Tyson was in prision in the early 90's and ducked Lewis when he came out of prision so you are wrong again.

just like he never fancied the job against Rid**** Bowe in 92 or 95 yet 4yrs later he spewed out all this rubbish to the British press that everyone was afraid of him, if that was the case why did he not say so at the time so that something could have been said and done about it

I followed the whole Lewis Bowe situation closely and I know what you are saying is completely wrong. I also like the way you never post any links to back up you fantasy stories.

[General Zod]

What a ****in cowardly fraud Lennox Lewis really was.

Everything you accuse Lewis of can be applied to other fighters you like, like Tyson, Jones, Hopkins and Pacquiao. You hate lewis for personal reasons maybe its because he beat up your precious Tyson or something like that.

You have never been a fighter so you have no place calling a fighter a coward either.

[-CANE-]

you must have a short memory...
Lewis was stripped of the WBA belt for refusing to fight the No1 contender John Ruiz, stripped of the IBF belt for refusing to fight No1 contender Chris Byrd and stripped of the WBC belt for refusing to fight Vitali Klitschko..

Lewis promised the world that he would face Vitali in a return fight yet waited unto 3 days before he was to be stripped of the WBC belt and announced his retirement.

Lewis was champion in 92 and throughout the 90s he avoided every other fighter who held a version of the heavyweight title. Holmes, Sanders, Jones Jr., Ruiz, Tyson, Foreman, Holyfield, Moorer, Wlad Klitschko, Bowe. Link below:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y0eins2DhSo

Lewis turned down $13.5 Million and a guaranteed world title fight to face Mike Tyson in 1996 when he was No1 contender for the WBC title, he accepted $4 million step-a-side money so that Tyson could continue to unify the title by getting Bruce Seldons WBA title.. Lewis knew that he stood little chance against that version of Mike Tyson or he would have said NO to the step-a-side money and went ahead and accepted a career highest purse and fought Tyson then himself fought Bruce Seldon..

Lewis spewed out all this propaganda about everyone was afraid to fight him when in fact the offers was always turned down by Lewis..if you believe that all the top fighters was afraid of Lewis then you must also believe there is fairies at the bottom of the garden.

First off nice thread and good discussions going on here.


Sonny i'm afraid we both disagree here and are not going to change each others mind, but I respect your knowledge and also like you I followed big Lens career closely and went to several of his fights. I wasn't a fan at first just curious but after seeing him live for the 4th time against Ruddock he started to convince me.

Forget who earlier in the thread made a reference to the two very different types of prime for Lewis. His athletic prime when he fought Ruddock and his technical prime came much later after being with steward. It's something i've made reference to in the past when talking about Lewis and his prime which one was it. Shame Lewis never had steward from the start can you imagine how good a Lewis who fought Ruddock would of been if he was as technically brilliant as he was later in his career. You could say the same about any boxer George Foreman for instance. I had to comment on this as i've never seen anyone else mention this.


Back to Sonny, I feel the same as Jab and that stepping aside made more sense financially and no disrespect to other fighters out there but Lennox was far more intelligent than most. He knew what he wanted to do and how he wanted to do it and make the most money possible. And before you say it no it was not for as little as risk as possible.

I believe their to be two myths about Lennox Lewis, one is he ducked fighters and the other is he had a glass jaw. Now as I said earlier I respect you and you are definitely an intelligent young man so why does someone with your intelligence actually make such a big thing about him being the only heavyweight champion to be stripped of all his belts and make out like it's a bad thing.

I think as much as everyone disagrees about one thing or another surely every boxing fan must be in agreement at what a joke all of the organizations are and how rankings and no.1 spots are all manipulated to suit certain people get richer is a joke. Boxing needs a worldwide commitee running it, one organization and one title. Nearly ever major sport in the world is run this way but not boxing.

So you can say he was stripped, here are links proving he ducked this fighter or that fighter and he was a coward but it don't hold no water with me.

We can argue all bloody day about he never fought John Ruiz, Michael Moorer, Rid**** Bowe, Buster Douglas, Corrie Sanders, Colonel Sanders and Ronald 'fucking' McDonald and apply the same logic to any other fighter out there. You are never going to be able to fight everybody and whether it's another champion or just a rated contender that you never fought someone is always going to point out that they ducked them.

All you can do is look at what they did do and who did they actually fight and make your conclusions from that. Also how were the fighters he fought actually perceived at the time he fought them is another good indication.

Ruddock, Tucker, Bruno, Morrison, Mercer, McCall, Golota, Briggs, Mavrovic, Holyfield, Grant, Botha, Tua, Rahman, Tyson, Klitschko.

Now is that a resume of a coward, a fighter who was afraid to fight Ruiz or of a champion who was willing to fight the best whenever he could. To me that is a great champions resume and how many champions have fought and beat such a talented amount of fighters in title fights. Notice how many big dangerous punchers he faced and took their punches.

I'm sorry my friend but you are going to have to do a lot more to convince me that Lewis is a coward and ducked people.

[wmute]

I stayed away up to this point, because I cannot really make up my mind. Any consensus so far?

(I mean besides the idiots saying "it's not even close" which you can find in any thread)

[TBear]

I would lean towards Lewis here

[sonnyboyx2]

This is nonsense, he accepted the money with the guarentee that he would get his shot after Tyson beat Sheldon.
Which would you take 13.5m or 16.5m? Tyson was stripped by the WBC for not fighting Lewis so how could you accuse Lewis of ducking him?

Teddy Atlas in on record as saying that he didnt want Moorer to fight Lewis, because Lewis was considered too dangerous
As for you other point see my post above

Holyfield didnt want to face Lewis in the early 90's it was the WBC that told him he had to face Lewis after he beat Bowe. Tyson was in prision in the early 90's and ducked Lewis when he came out of prision so you are wrong again.

I followed the whole Lewis Bowe situation closely and I know what you are saying is completely wrong. I also like the way you never post any links to back up you fantasy stories.

i have produced sources and links to verify my case.. can you do the same? or is it all just your opinion?