Lennox Lewis Or Sonny Liston?

[General Zod]

Just like i expected of you, not a single shread of evidence to prove me wrong, not a link or a source nothing at all.

Richard Hall’s astonishing claims – that Roy Jones, possibly the greatest fighter in ring history – tested positive for steroids after their May 2000 fight, have now been confirmed today by Jacob Hall, the Commissioner of Indiana Boxing.

http://www.boxingin$ider.com/headlines/flashback-when-roy-jones-tested-positive/
How about this?
People in glass houses shouldnt throw stones.

Ruddock had his jaw, cheeckbone & eye-socket smashed against Tyson and he was also a one-handed fighter who had been KOd by a journeyman

Wasnt it the WBC which mandated this fight, so the winner could get a shot at the champion.

Bruno got stopped by Lewis after he had given Lewis a lesson in jabbing and boxing skills, Lewis was well behind on all scorecards when he landed what can only be described as a `Lucky punch`which tagged Bruno on the chin... Bruno was a Class C fighter yet Lewis was no better than him

Isnt this the same Bruno who hurt Tyson badly in thier first fight?

Morrisons post-fight blood test showed he was HIV so its fair to say that he was knowhere near in peak condition, also Morrison himself claimes he contacted HIV from steroid abuse

Let me guess on any other day he would beat Lewis right? Isnt this the same guy that got blasted out by Mercer and Bentt?

Mercer v Lewis you say was a draw yet if thats the case how could you envisage Lewis beating Tyson at that time if he could not get past Mercer in your own opinion

Triangle theory?

i dont hate Lewis.. i thought he was unlucky to only come away with a draw in his first fight with Holyfield and i thought as most ringside commentators thought that Holyfield was robbed in their 2nd fight, even the british judge Larry O`Connel scored their 1st fight a draw and he sticks by his decision to this day.

Alot of people thought that Pac lost JMM II, can I assume you are going to go on and on about that? Alot of people thought that Jones lost Tarver I, can I assume you are going to go on and on about that? Tyson should of got dqed in the botha fight, can I assume you are going to go on and on about that as well?
Why dont you just that Lewis clearly won the first fight?

yes the same McCall who poleaxed Lewis is the same one who was nothing more than a sparring partner for Mike Tyson, if you claim that he dropped Tyson in sparring then i take your word that its correct

My mistake it was the legendary bin man Greg page, who did the deed, which is even worse

just like John Ruiz dropped Lewis in sparring in 94 in London.

link?

The Lewis camp knew all about John Ruiz and his grappling-hook style after using him as chief sparring partner in 1994 for the McCall fight,

Link?
Also why dont you post some vids of Ruiz pre Tua using the hook and hold style?

they got rid of Ruiz services after 3 days because they could not handle his style, when 5yrs later Ruiz had fought his way to be No1 contender for Lewis WBA title Lewis rufused to fight the man he knew he could not handle.,

Link?

Rahman was KOd in the rematch with Lewis, but that was nothing new because Rahman had been poleaxed previously by Oleg Maskaev getting knocked right out of the ring and laying unconscous for 10 minutes or more, Maskaev completed the double over Rahman a couple of years later when he poleaxed him in similar fashion to Lewis did yet Maskaev was a not a big puncher.

He avenged his loss. When is Jones going to fight Tarver, Green and Johnson again?

McCall was in a drug-rehab when he signed to fight Lewis in their return fight, he remained in the rehab up unto 3 days before fight night and entered the ring without a single days training behind him, he was not in a fit state to be in a boxing ring never mind fight for a world title yet Lewis fanboys count this as one of Lewis greatest victories and claim he avenged his loss to McCall... Lewis was so terrified of McCall that he would not go in for the kill even though McCall was holding his arms by his side.

If a fighter doesn't prepare for a fight properly then its there own fault and has nothing to do with the final result. Let me guess Jones was weight drained when he lost to tarver, right?

Tyson you claim is not an All Time Great... laughable!.

The best fighters he fought were Lewis, Holyfield*2 and he lost both of those
His best win is Tucker, fat Holmes and a lhw Spinks. This is the resume of an ATG to you?

if Tyson aint an ATG then Lewis aint a Top 20 ATG heavyweight because Tyson will always be rated far higher & greater than ever Lewis will be

lmao
common opponents:
Tony Tucker
Tyrell Biggs
Frank Bruno
Donovan Ruddock
Evander Holyfield
Andrew Golota
Francois Botha
Remind me again who beat all these guys and who lost to Evander again?
Lewis will always be rated highter than Tyson

Holmes beat Mercer for the WBO title beating him far easier than Lewis could beat him.

Evander also beat Mercer, I wonder what happened when he fought Lewis?

i notice how you have repeatedly mentioned Roy Jones in your comments even tho he has nothing to do with the topic and after checking your list of threads you started more than half of them are to try discredit Roy Jones..you cannot be taken seriously.

Its to highlight your double standards, tell me how many times did Lewis test positive for steroids?
If Lewis said you should duck your dangerous mandatories I bet you would be going on about that as well

In a recent interview with BoxingScene.com's Bill Emes,
former four-division champion Roy Jones Jr. said that he issued a warning to promoter Lou DiBella to have then middleweight champion Jermain Taylor stay away from fighting his mandatory, Kelly Pavlik.

http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=10987
Maybe Lewis was following Jones's advice, I wonder what happened with Nunn again back in 1997? What about Tarver in 2000? You are holding Lewis up to standards which you refuse to apply to other fighters you like.

post up some links to back up your claims

I have, when are you going to post some?

[sonnyboyx2]

Sonny I don't think even the biggest Klit fans are clinging on to the headbutt scenario.
Did used to read that a lot and remember watching the fight a while back with that in mind, the cut was caused by a punch. Without looking again and relying on memory a right in the second I believe.
Sonny as you know I don't agree with you re Lewis and we have done this argument more than once so we'll agree to differ.
But I will say I think you are in danger of totally obscuring your argument by never giving Lewis credit for any win.
I think your arguments might carry some weight if you put your hands up and said yes so and so was a good win but....?

i often do give Lewis credit, i have always said i thought Lewis beat Ray Mercer yet his hardcore fans like General Zod dont even think Lewis won that fight.. for the record i dont think Lewis was winning against Vitali Klitschko and i dont think he beat Holyfield in their rematch just like the majority at ringside did not think Lewis won... link below:

http://www.boxing-monthly.co.uk/content/9912/one.htm

[res]

Just like i expected of you, not a single shread of evidence to prove me wrong, not a link or a source nothing at all..

Ruddock had his jaw, cheeckbone & eye-socket smashed against Tyson and he was also a one-handed fighter who had been KOd by a journeyman

Tucker it was well documented about his drug problems and he looked a shadow of the fighter who fought Douglas & Tyson years earlier.

Bruno got stopped by Lewis after he had given Lewis a lesson in jabbing and boxing skills, Lewis was well behind on all scorecards when he landed what can only be described as a `Lucky punch`which tagged Bruno on the chin... Bruno was a Class C fighter yet Lewis was no better than him

Morrisons post-fight blood test showed he was HIV so its fair to say that he was knowhere near in peak condition, also Morrison himself claimes he contacted HIV from steroid abuse

Mercer v Lewis you say was a draw yet if thats the case how could you envisage Lewis beating Tyson at that time if he could not get past Mercer in your own opinion

i dont hate Lewis.. i thought he was unlucky to only come away with a draw in his first fight with Holyfield and i thought as most ringside commentators thought that Holyfield was robbed in their 2nd fight, even the british judge Larry O`Connel scored their 1st fight a draw and he sticks by his decision to this day.

yes the same McCall who poleaxed Lewis is the same one who was nothing more than a sparring partner for Mike Tyson, if you claim that he dropped Tyson in sparring then i take your word that its correct just like John Ruiz dropped Lewis in sparring in 94 in London.. The Lewis camp knew all about John Ruiz and his grappling-hook style after using him as chief sparring partner in 1994 for the McCall fight, they got rid of Ruiz services after 3 days because they could not handle his style, when 5yrs later Ruiz had fought his way to be No1 contender for Lewis WBA title Lewis rufused to fight the man he knew he could not handle.

Rahman was KOd in the rematch with Lewis, but that was nothing new because Rahman had been poleaxed previously by Oleg Maskaev getting knocked right out of the ring and laying unconscous for 10 minutes or more, Maskaev completed the double over Rahman a couple of years later when he poleaxed him in similar fashion to Lewis did yet Maskaev was a not a big puncher.

McCall was in a drug-rehab when he signed to fight Lewis in their return fight, he remained in the rehab up unto 3 days before fight night and entered the ring without a single days training behind him, he was not in a fit state to be in a boxing ring never mind fight for a world title yet Lewis fanboys count this as one of Lewis greatest victories and claim he avenged his loss to McCall... Lewis was so terrified of McCall that he would not go in for the kill even though McCall was holding his arms by his side.

Tyson you claim is not an All Time Great... laughable!
if Tyson aint an ATG then Lewis aint a Top 20 ATG heavyweight because Tyson will always be rated far higher & greater than ever Lewis will be

Holmes beat Mercer for the WBO title beating him far easier than Lewis could beat him.

i notice how you have repeatedly mentioned Roy Jones in your comments even tho he has nothing to do with the topic and after checking your list of threads you started more than half of them are to try discredit Roy Jones..you cannot be taken seriously.

post up some links to back up your claims

Roy Jones didn't get Koed plum in the middle of his prime (like Lewis did with McCall). Roy went 13 years without one legit loss, and then, past his prime, lost 3 bouts to mediocre fighters.

[General Zod]

after checking your list of threads you started more than half of them are to try discredit Roy Jones..you cannot be taken seriously.

I take it maths isnt your strong point?

[sonnyboyx2]

http://www.boxingin$ider.com/headlines/flashback-when-roy-jones-tested-positive/
How about this?
People in glass houses shouldnt throw stones.

Wasnt it the WBC which mandated this fight, so the winner could get a shot at the champion.

Isnt this the same Bruno who hurt Tyson badly in thier first fight?

Let me guess on any other dayhe would beat Lewis right, isnt this the same guy that got blasted out by Mercer and Bentt?

Triangle theory?

Alot of people thought that Pac lost JMM II, can I assume you are going to go on and on about that? Alot of people thought that Jones lost Tarver I, can I assume you are going to go on and on about that? Tyson should of got dqed in the botha fight, can I assume you are going to go on and on about that as well?
Why dont you just that Lewis clearly won the first fight?


My mistake it was the legendary bin man Greg page, who did the deed, which is even worse

link?

Link?
Also why dont you post some vids of Ruiz pre Tua using the hook and hold style?

Link?

He avenged his loss. When is Jones going to fight Tarver, Green and Johnson again?

If a fighter doesn't prepare for a fight properly then its there own fault and has nothing to do with the final result. Let me guess Jones was weight drained when he lost to tarver, right?

The best fighters he fought were Lewis, Holyfield*2 and he lost both of those
His best win is Tucker, fat Holmes and a lhw Spinks. This is the resume of an ATG to you?

lmao
common opponents:
Tony Tucker
Tyrell Biggs
Frank Bruno
Donovan Ruddock
Evander Holyfield
Andrew Golota
Francois Botha
Remind me again who beat all these guys and who lost to Evander again?
Lewis will always be rated highter than Tyson

Evander also beat Mercer, I wonder what happened in their first fight

Its to highlight your double standards, tell me how many times did Lewis test positive for steroids?
If Lewis said you should duck your dangerous mandatories I bet you would be going on about that as well

http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=10987
Maybe Lewis was following Jones's advice, I wonder what happened with Nunn again back in 1997? What about Tarver in 2000? You are holding Lewis up to standards which you refuse to apply to other fighters you like.

I have, when are you going to post some?

what has Roy Jones to do with anything... i anit no huge Roy Jones fan....But i can recall Lennox Lewis turning down the largest purse offer in sports history a staggering $35 million + PPV to fight newly crowned WBA champion Roy Jones.. Lewis claimed he had nothing to prove by fighting a former middleweight ... Lewis just never fancied the job, he thought he could not beat the then undefeated Jones otherwise he would have jumped at the offer, instead he fought a completely shot Mike Tyson who was more than 11yrs past his best, Lewis even tried to take Tyson to court to make him fight again which was laughable...

i have put links up to back up everything i have claimed.. where is your links?

Lewis baulking out of fighting Bowe in 1993
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y0eins2DhSo

Lewis baulking at fighting Tyson in 1996 for $13.5 million
http://www.nytimes.com/1996/07/04/sp...l?pagewanted=1

Lewis running scared of John Ruiz
http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1P2-4529125.html

Thats Greg Page putting down Tyson in sparring not McCall like you claimed

[General Zod]

what has Roy Jones to do with anything... i anit no huge Roy Jones fan....

Of course you are, thats why you were looking up my post history

But i can recall Lennox Lewis turning down the largest purse offer in sports history a staggering $35 million + PPV to fight newly crowned WBA champion Roy Jones.. Lewis claimed he had nothing to prove by fighting a former middleweight ... Lewis just never fancied the job, he thought he could not beat the then undefeated Jones otherwise he would have jumped at the offer

Griffin I

Then came Lennox Lewis, we offered him $25,000,000 to fight us, and when he realized it was real, he wanted to get rid of his mandatory (Klitschko) to fight Roy Jones Jr,, but after he put on that poor performance. he doesn't know if he should retire or fight Klitschko again, so Roy was left out in the cold.

Still, negotiations have commenced. Lewis` camp insists the big man seeks at least one more major fight before retirement. If so, here`s a wrinkle: Jones wants the bigger purse. He`s hinted at $100 million. "These guys are different animals," said Jones, who earned more than $10 million for fighting Ruiz. "That`s why I got to be paid three times the money in order to do it. It`s ******. Why would I go in there and not make a major, major payday? One lick could be the end of me. One lick from me ain`t going to end their career."

http://www.aussiebox.com.au/jones.html

instead he fought a completely shot Mike Tyson who was more than 11yrs past his best, Lewis even tried to take Tyson to court to make him fight again which was laughable.......

Im sure Lewis also forced Tyson to take his 20m paycheck as well

Lewis baulking out of fighting Bowe in 1993
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y0eins2DhSo

Brain damaged wife beaters are known for thier honesty arent they?

Three months after leaving Marine Boot Camp he was accused of battering his sister. Three months after that, assault and battery on his wife.[13] Bowe then was convicted of kidnapping his wife and children after Bowe went to his wife's Charlotte, North Carolina home and threatened her with a knife, handcuffs, duct tape and pepper spray. He forced her and their children into a vehicle and set out for his Fort Washington, Maryland, home.[14] Bowe was initially sentenced to only 30 days as a result of a lenient sentence due to brain damage claimed by Bowe's defense. Indeed, tapes of Bowe talking before and after his brutal fights with Golota show a man with very slurred speech.[14] This sentence was later overturned and Bowe served 17 months in federal prison.[15
In 2001, Bowe was arrested in Long Island after a domestic dispute with his wife. Bowe allegedly dragged his wife and left her with cuts on her knees and elbows.[16]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rid****_Bowe

Lewis baulking at fighting Tyson in 1996 for $13.5 million
http://www.nytimes.com/1996/07/04/sp...l?pagewanted=1

The World Boxing Council wants Tyson to defend against Lennox Lewis of England, a former champion and now its No. 1 contender. Lewis turned down a $13.5 million guarantee to fight Tyson. Lewis then accepted $4 million from King to step aside and allow Tyson to fight Seldon, with the proviso that Tyson, assuming he beat Seldon, would fight Lewis next. Tyson is expected to receive $30 million for fighting Seldon.

Now Lewis's handlers say they will guarantee Tyson $45 million to fight Lewis, but Tyson seems more interested in fighting Evander Holyfield, a former champion. If Tyson bypasses Lewis, the W.B.C. will strip Tyson of his title for refusing to fight its top-ranked contender.

This really supports your claim doesnt it?

Lewis running scared of John Ruiz
http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1P2-4529125.html

Thats not even a complete article, cant you do better than that?

Thats Greg Page putting down Tyson in sparring not McCall like you claimed

Which is what I said, which makes it even worse

[General Zod]

Thats Greg Page putting down Tyson in sparring not McCall like you claimed

How about this as well?

Boxingin$ider.com: You sparred hundreds of rounds with Tyson, right?

Oliver McCall: “I guess I sparred more than 300 rounds with Tyson and he never knocked me down once. But I put him down once. We had a hell of a battle every time. That’s why he paid me $2,000 a week.”

http://www.boxingin$ider.com/interviews/interview-with-oliver-mccall/

[GJC]

i often do give Lewis credit, i have always said i thought Lewis beat Ray Mercer yet his hardcore fans like General Zod dont even think Lewis won that fight.. for the record i dont think Lewis was winning against Vitali Klitschko and i dont think he beat Holyfield in their rematch just like the majority at ringside did not think Lewis won... link below:

http://www.boxing-monthly.co.uk/content/9912/one.htm

I don't thnk Lewis was beating Vitali either I agree with the judges 4-2 Vitali you could argue that because Lewis won the last 2 rounds he had the momentum and the fight was only half done. But Lewis was awful that night, very out of shape. But you can't call it a robbery, Vitali might have been winning but he was stopped so Lewis won.
I think Lewis won the Holyfield rematch, it was certainly closer than the 1st though. Given the result of the first fight, Lewis for some mad reason decided to cruise through the latter rounds but he still did enough to win IMO.

[General Zod]

Lennox Lewis is a Canadian/British thing.. so its understandable

Let me guess all British fighters are crap and all American fighters are great, right?

[CarlosG815]

Now everyone nows why you hate Lewis.

He's simply referring to the fact that british/canadian huggers are among the most rabid on this site.

I feel for Sonny having to deal with your back and forth bull****, such as what you posted above. You keep repeating the same opinion, and the other 90% of your long winded post is just twisting his words even though you know what he's saying (unless you really are as ****** as I believe you to be).