How about a list of draws from fighters?

[Dr Z]

So let's talk about Jeffries draw against Choynski who he outweighed by over 50lbs. Isn't that the same guy Johnson stopped less than 3 years later? My point being there are all sorts of reasons for draws. You seem to want to focus as much negativity on Johnson as you can though. This is just another bait thread, and it's old, and it will probably get deleted like your other Johnson thread because you refuse to have a productive conversation when it comes to old JJ.

Ivich gets threads deleted. The mods took care of his disherara. You never know, I just might be friends with one of them. Just kidding... or not. The Jeffries vs. Choynski match was a man in his prime vs. a novice. Jeffries said he produced multiple knockdowns and Choynski ran the entire 2nd half of the fight. It was ruled a draw. No shame there. Have you read anything about the fight?

[JAB5239]

Ivich gets threads deleted. The mods took care of his disherara. You never know, I just might be friends with one of them. Just kidding... or not. The Jeffries vs. Choynski match was a man in his prime vs. a novice. Jeffries said he produced multiple knockdowns and Choynski ran the entire 2nd half of the fight. It was ruled a draw. No shame there. Have you read anything about the fight?

I misspoke about the Chiynski fight. Was looking at boxrec and quoted the wrong fight.

All Johnsons draws early in his career were against guys more experienced than himself. They probably weren't giving up 60lbs either. The draw against Dunning is don't know much about but don't give much credence to. The draw came from the Boston Globe, for an Irish fighter. If you dont know about Boston it was and still is a very racist city. You're still missing the point though. You can tear apart any fighters resume if you really want to.

The other threads got deleted because (I'm guessing) you kept threatening to snitch, and Bronson kept hitting back. Just like I imagine this thread will go no where, that thread was going nowhere either. Bronson isn't a mod and has no authority to delete anything.

If you want threads to be left alone than stick to boxing and stop making it personal when someone (he) disagrees with you.

[Dr Z]

I misspoke about the Chiynski fight. Was looking at boxrec and quoted the wrong fight.

All Johnsons draws early in his career were against guys more experienced than himself. They probably weren't giving up 60lbs either. The draw against Dunning is don't know much about but don't give much credence to. The draw came from the Boston Globe, for an Irish fighter. If you dont know about Boston it was and still is a very racist city. You're still missing the point though. You can tear apart any fighters resume if you really want to.

The other threads got deleted because (I'm guessing) you kept threatening to snitch, and Bronson kept hitting back. Just like I imagine this thread will go no where, that thread was going nowhere either. Bronson isn't a mod and has no authority to delete anything.

If you want threads to be left alone than stick to boxing and stop making it personal when someone (he) disagrees with you.

Ivich is misbehaving and if he keeps it up he risks being 86'd, but he has used other names here before. He now goes under Bronson, I suppose " Ivich " was banned at Boxing Scene. So...


Not all of Jack's draws were vs. fighters with more experience. Where is your proof, or did you misspoke again. No sir, you are mistaken.


I am here for boxing talk, but some people lie, welch and call other names. I prefer not to spend my time on it. I like to bury the hacket before he expires, but that is not my call.

[JAB5239]

Ivich is misbehaving and if he keeps it up he risks being 86'd, but he has used other names here before. He now goes under Bronson, I suppose " Ivich " was banned at Boxing Scene. So...


Not all of Jack's draws were vs. fighters with more experience. Where is your proof, or did you misspoke again. No sir, you are mistaken.


I am here for boxing talk, but some people lie, welch and call other names. I prefer not to spend my time on it. I like to bury the hacket before he expires, but that is not my call.

Haynes 24 fights, Johnson 8.
Scanlon 34 fights, Johnson 10
Stift 40 fights, Johnson 12
Everett 41 fights, Johnson 13
Griffin 33 fights, Johnson 15
Griffin 34 fights, Johnson 18
the Dunning fight I've already spoken about.
Jeanette would go on to be an all time top 50 heavyweight.
Obrien a ton more experience and an all time great at that time.

6 out of the 8 draws Johnson fought more experienced fighters. Am I mistaken?

Don't act like you're some innocent bystander and Bronson just comes in and ruins your threads. We can all see what happens. He disagrees, shows proof and argues his point and you initiate trouble by calling him a free mason or making some sideways comment and then threaten to snitch on him. Its all in black and white for everyone to see. Youve told him he could put you on ignore, right? Why dont you heed your own advice and put him on ignore if you think he is that much of a problem?

[Bundana]

Young Farrell 97
Kid Beebe 82
Young Papke 72
Dave Shade 62
George Dixon 61
Sam Langford 53
Young Erne 52
Jack (Twin) Sullivan 46
Jack Britton 45
Johnny Dundee 45
Willie Meehan 42
Memphis Pal Moore 39
Jackie Clark 39
Battling Levinsky 38

[Dr Z]

Haynes 24 fights, Johnson 8.
Scanlon 34 fights, Johnson 10
Stift 40 fights, Johnson 12
Everett 41 fights, Johnson 13
Griffin 33 fights, Johnson 15
Griffin 34 fights, Johnson 18
the Dunning fight I've already spoken about.
Jeanette would go on to be an all time top 50 heavyweight.
Obrien a ton more experience and an all time great at that time.

6 out of the 8 draws Johnson fought more experienced fighters. Am I mistaken?

Don't act like you're some innocent bystander and Bronson just comes in and ruins your threads. We can all see what happens. He disagrees, shows proof and argues his point and you initiate trouble by calling him a free mason or making some sideways comment and then threaten to snitch on him. Its all in black and white for everyone to see. Youve told him he could put you on ignore, right? Why dont you heed your own advice and put him on ignore if you think he is that much of a problem?

Not all of Jack's draws were vs. fighters with more experience. Check the full record of draws ( you did not ), and you will see I am correct. In several fighters he had the edge on experience. I did not list all of his draws....

I said I would like to bury the hatchet with him while he has some time left to live, and you are just fanning his flames. Be careful when a moth is drawn to a flame. You might burn him, with the illumination.

Nothing I said is untrue. He is a freemason, not the 33rd type with the secrets. That cult like pyramid worships you know who. He has donated money to a terror org. So says the USA gov't. He likes to blow the heads off rabbits. And he lies and bet on welches. All of which is proven true over the years. Honest. You can PM him if you must to check on this.

Enoguh on this. Which one of the draws do you want to talk about and please do not say last night!

[JAB5239]

Not all of Jack's draws were vs. fighters with more experience. Check the full record of draws ( you did not ), and you will see I am correct. In several fighters he had the edge on experience. I did not list all of his draws....

I said I would like to bury the hatchet with him while he has some time left to live, and you are just fanning his flames. Be careful when a moth is drawn to a flame. You might burn him, with the illumination.

Nothing I said is untrue. He is a freemason, not the 33rd type with the secrets. That cult like pyramid worships you know who. He has donated money to a terror org. So says the USA gov't. He likes to blow the heads off rabbits. And he lies and bet on welches. All of which is proven true over the years. Honest. You can PM him if you must to check on this.

Enoguh on this. Which one of the draws do you want to talk about and please do not say last night!

I never said all. Don't we know besides a shadow of a doubt these weren't distance fight (obviously not every case) that weren't declared a draw because there was no ko? Different rules applied at that time.

[Willie Pep 229]

I never said all. Don't we know besides a shadow of a doubt these weren't distance fight (obviously not every case) that weren't declared a draw because there was no ko? Different rules applied at that time.

Yeah! The thread is weird.

Prize fighting went through so many stages of development in scoring that Boxrec's attempt to apply the basic 'win, loss, draw' logic, to early fights, is not going to tell is the correct story about these fights.

If we tried to list all the different ways, different circumstances, these fights were staged under we would probably need a dozen categories.

The only real adjustment Boxrec has been able to deliver is the separation of PTS vs. NWS fights.

At least that is something.

But there has to be many more adjustments that need to be made and I'll bet these early 'draws' come in many colors.

[Bundana]

Langford 38 draws

I count 53 draws for Sam - but I see, you're not counting ND/Newspaper decision fights for him (or any of the other boxers you have mentioned). Just curious to know why?

[Bronson66]

Archie Moore had 10 draws. Guess he wasn't great.

Carlos Monzon had 9 he must have been rubbish too.lol This thread is just another blatant attempt to disparage Jack Johnson.
Haters got to hate.