I might be wrong is suggesting this

[JAB5239]

Ah so those are boxers he actually likes? Interesting, I thought in his shtick he doesn't like any boxer that lived ever.

There are boxers, especially eastern european that he'll defend tooth and nail, even going so far as to make things up. But the ones he doesn't like......there is no low for him.

[GhostofDempsey]

There were some good HWs in his era but they all stood in the shadows of the 70s era HWs, Holmes included. Larry never had that signature rival to raise his stock. Ray Leonard stole the boxing spotlight during this time.

[Willie Pep 229]

There were some good HWs in his era but they all stood in the shadows of the 70s era HWs, Holmes included. Larry never had that signature rival to raise his stock. Ray Leonard stole the boxing spotlight during this time.

SRL brought the multi-million dollar paydays to the lightweight divisions. Change the $ landscape of the game.

I think he would have still done it even if there was a popular HW champion.

But not 100% sure. Maybe had there been a late 80s 'Tyson level popular HW' he would have stifled Leonard's popularity.

I wonder.

[QueensburyRules]

Larry Holmes' resume is what I would call 'solid'. It's not exceptional, it's not bad either because most of his opponents were talented boxers with potential. That very long title streak puts him ahead of a lot of other all time greats though. In contrast I would say he has a better resume than Louis who also had the very long title reign but fought a lot of opponents way below his level. He mopped the floor with them but then struggled with the very best opponents he faced.

I also have to give Larry Holmes credit he usually doesn't get for his performances as an old man in a new era. It is honestly very impressive what he did in the 90s. You gotta understand he had a young man's style, swift movement sticking out that long jab etc. And he made it work even when he was old. Beating Mercer, possibly robbed against McCall and giving a good account of himself against prime Holyfield. And nobody stopped the old man other than Tyson because he gave himself very little time to prepare coming out of retirement.

Him and Foreman really proved how damn good the Golden era Heavyweights were judging by their performances in the 90s.

- - Dude let Rocky's jockstrap shatter his ugly feets.

Joe guts him both stylistically and popularity. N'er beat a standing champ holding a belt won in the ring all perfectly arranged by he Daddy Don. Now that's some kind of light in the loafer boxer that the usual ninnies fawn over.

When he passes, he'll reincarnate as a Rattlesnake...yeah!!!

[BKM-]

- - Dude let Rocky's jockstrap shatter his ugly feets.

Joe guts him both stylistically and popularity. N'er beat a standing champ holding a belt won in the ring all perfectly arranged by he Daddy Don. Now that's some kind of light in the loafer boxer that the usual ninnies fawn over.

When he passes, he'll reincarnate as a Rattlesnake...yeah!!!

What was that buddy?

[The D3vil]

"Tubby Lar" as some of you call him probably should've lost to Tim Witherspoon & Carl Williams & had a shorter reign.

There were some legitimately talented dudes in the '80s, but most of them got hooked on c0ke & Mike Tyson demolished the rest of them. zz0.yo9ctyrpzpszz

[Anomalocaris]

SRL brought the multi-million dollar paydays to the lightweight divisions. Change the $ landscape of the game.

I think he would have still done it even if there was a popular HW champion.

But not 100% sure. Maybe had there been a late 80s 'Tyson level popular HW' he would have stifled Leonard's popularity.

I wonder.

I think the Kings would have still transcened the sport. I remenber Mam &Dad (RIP) but no boxing fans eagerly waiting for their next clash. It was a meeting of supernatural forces (I think Tommy is vastly underrated).

[BKM-]

"Tubby Lar" as some of you call him probably should've lost to Tim Witherspoon & Carl Williams & had a shorter reign.

There were some legitimately talented dudes in the '80s, but most of them got hooked on c0ke & Mike Tyson demolished the rest of them. zz0.yo9ctyrpzpszz

There is only one person here who calls him that.

[Marchegiano]

- - Another prime Noob is it yet again?

Tubby Lar who used to be skinny is my fav punching bag. He spent the entire year before their fight attending Tyson's epic Title Collection fights savaging him in interviews while calling him out. He trained the entire year at the gym he built on his estate expressly to prepare him to fight Tyson.

Tyson whomped him so easily that Lar freshly neutered fans are still squealing in soprano to this day.

Irrepressible Factoid is Lar a single belt holder in a multibelt era he helped create is 0-2 against Champions having won their titles in the Ring.

Gitteth thee to an all Squealing Soprano Forum for Lar fannyboys to squeal in harmony...yeah!!!

and

Kiss my ass youse guys, this is a great post with fair points raised.


Larry cleared out the old men and then did **** all nothing. Got favored pretty much as much as any champion can. Prototyped the degrading of the bodies and belts. Was the first princess to be handed a belt without a fight in the modern era. And his ATG resume is only so-so because he waited talent out and then failed the first fresh face worth a **** who got to him. Yet this guy and his sissy-in-spirit Lennox Lewis get nothing but praise and consistent top five positions.

I'm not saying Lar McTubbyButts or the Cowardly Lion are or where bad fighters by any means. They both made their statement in their way, but, I am saying as men who influenced boxing, **** these guys.


Is it common to wait out talent? Thanks Larry and Lennox, really love that Kronk. So the very next gen featured a guy, Pov, who was pretty good, and a guy, Wlad, who was actually good in any period, but it took more than a decade to get to AND there's secondary belts? ... ... ... And you guys just blame the bodies and promoters. Like it was them who created the idea the champion makes the belt. Or it was them who created the idea there should be second place world champions, not Lennox Lewis's idea he fought for and the WBA eventually caved on with the WBC following shortly after.

Fury treats the bodies, the fans, and other fighters like absolute **** all the way up until he gets his ass kicked by a third worlder in a war torn country ... you can't make this **** up. Still this isn't the environment Larry created, oh no. It's isolated and disconnected for sure.

Why is being a single strapper with the best resume good enough?

Why is being a unified champion who knows damn well 2/3rds of their belts are just splinter groups of their only real belt good enough?

Why do we bend over backwards to make guys like Wlad, who never did **** all anything for fans, things like lineal champions when maybe he didn't earn it?

Why is it okay to spend more than a decade playing around with championship leftovers for secondary titles? Don't you dare blame Lennox for Povetkin's tactics.

Fanboys keep and have kept giving men who did not earn a status the defacto upgrade to said status purely because no one better was around at that time.



It's okay, actually, to say Larry Holmes couldn't hold Rocky Marciano's jock, purely based on undisputed title defenses. Purely based on the reality Larry Holmes never once bothered to gather Marciano's title nor defend it. Resume, and who does and does not excite you, should be and always have been secondary to status.


Instead, Larry great jab doe

Lewis great jab doe

Larry/Lennox resume better doe

Without like even an once of embarrassment we judge based on subjectivity.


So, I say Queen's post here was fire, **** all y'all.

[billeau2]

But was Larry Holmes' title reign so long because the division was weak. I am not saying Larry Holmes was not tremendously talented, but is he a little over rated by a weak heavyweight era?

Here is something I found out...Look at a random sample of heavyweight champions, include at least a few great ATG level guys... You will find that Most heavyweights have fought competition that is more characterized as skilled, able, but not great. As compared to fighters at Welter, lightweight, etc...

The reasons for this are mostly scientific. Human Beings able to fight professionally are a small sample, human beings over 180 pounds, while not as small a sample, are also relatively rare compared to human beings weighing in at between 120 and 160ish. Some combat sports represent this: The Thai boxing champion is around 1140-160, the heavyweight division is generally not considered as relevant.


As far as I can tell the heavyweight champs that fought the best competition are obviously Ali, I think Lennox Lewis is also up there... But a fighter like Louis, or Liston, fought many skilled and decent fighters, but no real ATG level wins (Liston Lost to Ali of course). This means Holmes is kind of average IMO regarding his level of competition, maybe a little weaker at most...