Sonny Liston vs Marciano resume comparison

[Ivich]

former-heavyweight-champion-rocky-marciano-left-visits-with-sonny-liston-at-his-aurora-downs-training-camp-west-of-chicago-sept-24-1962-where-liston-is-training-for-the-title-fight-with-current-champ-floyd-patterson-ap-photo-2MX1TM8.jpg

Just curious why everyone tends to pick Liston over Marciano. I wrote this from a desktop so there aren't any artifacts.

If we look at resumes, Liston's biggest claims to fame are knocking out Floyd Patterson (I man he was much heavier and bigger than, and with a style with 0 chance against Liston's style). And of course Liston quitting vs Clay. From a boxing skill perspective, Liston is top tier. Boxing has a lot of intangibles though.

Now I am not gonna be so ignorant to not say that Liston certainly had potential and his outside the ring lifestyle is one of the reasons he didn't go as far as he could.

My question is why is Marciano knocked for beating Walcott 2x, Charles 2x and Moore. When these guys were all better than/equivalent of Patterson at the time Rocky fought them. And Rocky beat them without a size advantage. All were at or around the same weight - and he was giving up height and reach vs all of them. He also did this in a very short span of time with next to no amateur career. He beat them in devastating fashion. Ruined them.

Yes Louis was past his best. Every boxing fan knows this. However, he was on a 9 fight win streak and Marciano is the only guy to have knocked him cold, outside of the ring. Louis was 212 lbs on fight night, Marciano was something like 184 (going by memory). If Louis almost beat him we might have a case, but the fight wasn't close. It was like all of rocks fights, him trying to get close and his opponent trying to stay away.

Ali never spoke of Liston the way he spoke of Marciano. He only used the "shook my kin folk back in Africa" comment with 2 fighters, Shavers and Rocky. In regards to their power. He said this about a man who called him clay to his face repeatedly, talked bad about him openly - and even went on to say he was good friends with Marciano, even though he only knew him for 1 year.

In this article here it states Liston ran from Rocky once he figured out who he was in the flesh.

https://www.espn.com/sports/boxing/n...ory?id=3529752

At Marciano's funeral Liston said something about Marciano being the greatest hw to ever live. Ali said something pretty close to that. Nobody else got this treatment.

when I watch Marciano, I know he is a great fighter. His timing, his leverage, his clever baiting and his relentless crouching style he invented all by himself. He is a nightmare. His only struggle is getting close to you with that 68 reach. Once inside it's his world. He swarms you.

People also go on about Marciano's weight. What other heavyweight was running up to 15 miles in boots with sand weights in them, in hill country. Of course he is light, he trained like a spartan. He was running on christmas day. Are we all so dim to throw hard work out the window? in that photo Marciano is likely around 250 lbs. (I read he was 255 in retirement), 205 in between fights, and 225 before he started boxing. There is only so much time in a day and Marciano used all of it. up at 5 bed by 9:30.

Ali first used the "kinfolk" quote after the first Cooper fight.
So that's 1 you are wrong on.
I don't believe Liston was at Marciano's funeral can you provide proof he was?Can you also provide verified source for his "supposed quote?"

Liston is on record as stating Joe Louis was the greatest heavyweight ever.That's 2 you are wrong on.
Ali never said Marciano was the greatest heavyweight either .That's 3 you are wrong on!

I have no doubt you will never provide any evidence of your claims,just like you have never produced any to back up your claim that Marciano used to do 30 rounds on the 300lbs bag after sparring,despite countless requests from me that you do so!
Liston afraid of an old fat Marciano.
"After Patterson lost to Liston I wasn't tempted to make a comeback,I knew I was too old".Marciano.

"His left jab is the best of any fighter i've seen since Louis. This fellow gets real force into his jabs like Joe used to do. He's great, just great. The left jab set up DeJohn. Then Liston cut him down with a body attack. To me, he appeared a more effective body puncher than Charles. I would have to say Ez is a better boxer. I thought Liston looped his punches more than he should. He should shorten 'em up more. He can move faster than Jersey Joe. I don't know [if he can take a punch]. He really didn't have to fighting DeJohn. A couple of uppercuts shook. He legs wobbled but he came right back again."
Marciano on Liston

Congratulations! You have taken hero worship to a new level!

[automaton89]

The only champion Liston beat was Patterson.

[Ivich]

The only champion Liston beat was Patterson.

Who was in his prime.Would fight at top level for a further 10 years losing just 4 fights to,Quarry,Ellis and Ali x2.
Want to compare that to Louis's and Walcott's further pugilistic activities.or to Charles descent into journeyman status?

[automaton89]

Who was in his prime.Would fight at top level for a further 10 years losing just 4 fights to,Quarry,Ellis and Ali x2.
Want to compare that to Louis's and Walcott's further pugilistic activities.or to Charles descent into journeyman status?

Patterson did not seem to try to fight. It was Tyson -Spinks type of fight.

[QueensburyRules]

former-heavyweight-champion-rocky-marciano-left-visits-with-sonny-liston-at-his-aurora-downs-training-camp-west-of-chicago-sept-24-1962-where-liston-is-training-for-the-title-fight-with-current-champ-floyd-patterson-ap-photo-2MX1TM8.jpg

Just curious why everyone tends to pick Liston over Marciano. I wrote this from a desktop so there aren't any artifacts.

If we look at resumes, Liston's biggest claims to fame are knocking out Floyd Patterson (I man he was much heavier and bigger than, and with a style with 0 chance against Liston's style). And of course Liston quitting vs Clay. From a boxing skill perspective, Liston is top tier. Boxing has a lot of intangibles though.

Now I am not gonna be so ignorant to not say that Liston certainly had potential and his outside the ring lifestyle is one of the reasons he didn't go as far as he could.

My question is why is Marciano knocked for beating Walcott 2x, Charles 2x and Moore. When these guys were all better than/equivalent of Patterson at the time Rocky fought them. And Rocky beat them without a size advantage. All were at or around the same weight - and he was giving up height and reach vs all of them. He also did this in a very short span of time with next to no amateur career. He beat them in devastating fashion. Ruined them.

Yes Louis was past his best. Every boxing fan knows this. However, he was on a 9 fight win streak and Marciano is the only guy to have knocked him cold, outside of the ring. Louis was 212 lbs on fight night, Marciano was something like 184 (going by memory). If Louis almost beat him we might have a case, but the fight wasn't close. It was like all of rocks fights, him trying to get close and his opponent trying to stay away.

Ali never spoke of Liston the way he spoke of Marciano. He only used the "shook my kin folk back in Africa" comment with 2 fighters, Shavers and Rocky. In regards to their power. He said this about a man who called him clay to his face repeatedly, talked bad about him openly - and even went on to say he was good friends with Marciano, even though he only knew him for 1 year.

In this article here it states Liston ran from Rocky once he figured out who he was in the flesh.

https://www.espn.com/sports/boxing/n...ory?id=3529752

At Marciano's funeral Liston said something about Marciano being the greatest hw to ever live. Ali said something pretty close to that. Nobody else got this treatment.

when I watch Marciano, I know he is a great fighter. His timing, his leverage, his clever baiting and his relentless crouching style he invented all by himself. He is a nightmare. His only struggle is getting close to you with that 68 reach. Once inside it's his world. He swarms you.

People also go on about Marciano's weight. What other heavyweight was running up to 15 miles in boots with sand weights in them, in hill country. Of course he is light, he trained like a spartan. He was running on christmas day. Are we all so dim to throw hard work out the window? in that photo Marciano is likely around 250 lbs. (I read he was 255 in retirement), 205 in between fights, and 225 before he started boxing. There is only so much time in a day and Marciano used all of it. up at 5 bed by 9:30.

- - Just curious who your "everone" people are. Don't ever remember the topic even coming up.

[_Rexy_]

The only champion Liston beat was Patterson.

Almost like there was only one belt back then. Patterson ducked him for years

[Ivich]

Patterson did not seem to try to fight. It was Tyson -Spinks type of fight.

The fact that Liston annihilated Patterson twice is a negative for Sonny?
Did
DeJohn
Bethea
Folley
Harris
Valdes
Summerlin
Williams x2
Machen
Try to fight , or did they all just cave in?

[Ivich]

- - Just curious who your "everone" people are. Don't ever remember the topic even coming up.

It's just another blatant attempt to big up Rocky,this time with non- existant quotes at Liston's expense.

And these "Rockista's ,"wonder why we get so pissed off with their constant idolatrous hero worship.

[them_apples]

Ali first used the "kinfolk" quote after the first Cooper fight.
So that's 1 you are wrong on.
I don't believe Liston was at Marciano's funeral can you provide proof he was?Can you also provide verified source for his "supposed quote?"

Liston is on record as stating Joe Louis was the greatest heavyweight ever.That's 2 you are wrong on.
Ali never said Marciano was the greatest heavyweight either .That's 3 you are wrong on!

I have no doubt you will never provide any evidence of your claims,just like you have never produced any to back up your claim that Marciano used to do 30 rounds on the 300lbs bag after sparring,despite countless requests from me that you do so!
Liston afraid of an old fat Marciano.
"After Patterson lost to Liston I wasn't tempted to make a comeback,I knew I was too old".Marciano.

"His left jab is the best of any fighter i've seen since Louis. This fellow gets real force into his jabs like Joe used to do. He's great, just great. The left jab set up DeJohn. Then Liston cut him down with a body attack. To me, he appeared a more effective body puncher than Charles. I would have to say Ez is a better boxer. I thought Liston looped his punches more than he should. He should shorten 'em up more. He can move faster than Jersey Joe. I don't know [if he can take a punch]. He really didn't have to fighting DeJohn. A couple of uppercuts shook. He legs wobbled but he came right back again."
Marciano on Liston

Congratulations! You have taken hero worship to a new level!

Please provide evidence for your quotes and when I am home I will as well

Ali said of all the champions Marciano would be the hardest to beat and he may not beat him due to his style. Even you know he said this. Easiest video to find

[them_apples]

- - Just curious who your "everone" people are. Don't ever remember the topic even coming up.

Ok how about this then? Who picks rock?

ill make a poll

problem solved