How Do You Rate Frazier In Terms Of Never defeating a Power Puncher ?

[QueensburyRules]

- - Whatever happened to StuBoy?

Got sent back to nursery school?

[billeau2]

- - Whatever happened to StuBoy?

Got sent back to nursery school?

C r a ckers and juice! Not the generics either! Saltines for nap times!

[The Old LefHook]

I suppose that if you sit down and set about the task, you can build a critique about any professional in any field, simply by gathering facts and assumptions that disparage the subject and leaving the praiseworthy items off to the side for use on another day. If I were to attempt to do this to Joe Frazier, I suppose that I'd start with his height. At just a shade under 6 feet, his is a Heavyweight stature from a bygone era. Then there is the mere 37 professional starts that "Smokin' Joe engaged in, the 4th least of the glove era among the actual champions, better only than Jeffries (22), Johansson (28), Tyson Fury & Michael Spinks (32).
Sometime in the course of that excercise, though, and because I don't happen to be a moron; it would occur to me that Muhammad Ali, who most people who know anything about the fight game regard as one of the 1 or 2 greatest champions of all time, was in supreme condition in 1971, comming off two great perfomances against two of the best opponents he would ever have (and that's saying an awful lot), and when he met Joe Frazier in the Garden in arguably the largest sporting event in history, it was the only meeting between the pair where they were both undefeated, and both smack dab in the middle of their respective primes....and Frazier was the better man.
After that........

Sorry, Willie, but I believe Clay was not smack dab in the middle of his prime. He was in excellent shape all right, but that is not a substitute for being in your prime, lad. He couldn't even move the way he had used to. Cus D'amato noticed this and spoke about it to Angelo Dundee. He said it took Clay two steps to achieve what he had done previously in one. I am sure you agree that the Clay who breezed through Cleveland Williams would have fought Frazier in a different manner, constantly pecking from the outside while running circles around Joe. He did not have the footwork of youth anymore. Clay was in his prime according to years, but not according to performance. He had to find a whole new way to win, something he kept coming up with throughout his career.

[The Old LefHook]

A power puncher with a chin like a rockem sockem robot with its head cement glued to the body.

I feel Chuvalo is right on the borderline of a power puncher. His punches were arm punches, but very hard ones. I believe that was an observation of someone on here, but cannot remember who it was.

[QueensburyRules]

Sorry, Willie, but I believe Clay was not smack dab in the middle of his prime. He was in excellent shape all right, but that is not a substitute for being in your prime, lad. He couldn't even move the way he had used to. Cus D'amato noticed this and spoke about it to Angelo Dundee. He said it took Clay two steps to achieve what he had done previously in one. I am sure you agree that the Clay who breezed through Cleveland Williams would have fought Frazier in a different manner, constantly pecking from the outside while running circles around Joe. He did not have the footwork of youth anymore. Clay was in his prime according to years, but not according to performance. He had to find a whole new way to win, something he kept coming up with throughout his career.

- - When I was 28, in spite of two previous horrific high speed motorcycle accidents leaving me Lucky to just be injured, the testa flowing through my system was such that a fainting goat as U say Ali was wouldn't stand a chance?

I prefer to think U misspoke in a haste now in need of a revision.

Make it so...

[billeau2]

I feel Chuvalo is right on the borderline of a power puncher. His punches were arm punches, but very hard ones. I believe that was an observation of someone on here, but cannot remember who it was.

Yeah heavy hands... There are many ways to hit and this is one of them...

[The Old LefHook]

Some of these newbies are so bad they almost make Queensbree seem like a prize to be fought over. Almost.

[them_apples]

I know he has a win on Ali but what or how do you rate a true heavyweight when he has no track record of fighting power punchers . Frazier avoided them before and after Foreman only fighting Foreman twice . I say rate in terms of other top heavyweight fighters in other eras . Most top guys have defeated at least one big puncher in their life times. Seems like a real stretch how people say he can beat up everyone . Seems to be a less skilled Dwight Qawi who gave Foreman a better fight .

That Argentinian was considered a power puncher. He dropped Joe as well.

quarry was also a “puncher”

don’t consider chuvalo a power puncher. Strong yes but his punching technique is lacking a bit

[Ivich]

- - Ali had more KOs than Frazier in their first fight and Joe tore him a new one. Same deal vs Foster.

What grade U in?

Frazier went to the hospital for weeks and Ali was there for an hour.Who tore who a new one? lol Foster was a lhvy Frazier actually ko'd only one heavyweight who was considered class, a former light heavy Doug Jones.

[Ivich]

I know he has a win on Ali but what or how do you rate a true heavyweight when he has no track record of fighting power punchers . Frazier avoided them before and after Foreman only fighting Foreman twice . I say rate in terms of other top heavyweight fighters in other eras . Most top guys have defeated at least one big puncher in their life times. Seems like a real stretch how people say he can beat up everyone . Seems to be a less skilled Dwight Qawi who gave Foreman a better fight .

Frazier is outside my top ten all time heavyweights,he is no 12.