You can hold as much as you want, but it's main use is when hurt, so you can survive round, or to stop opponent landing as much as you
Just read my last response to you again since it clearly didn't compute.
Suppose he could have fought Tszyu in the 90’s. By the time Margarito and Williams were top guys at 147, Oscar had long moved up. I know he went back down in 2008 but he was never gonna go back down for a Margarito or Williams. I remember there was some talk of Oscar-Margarito in Dec 2008 after Margarito ruined the planned Oscar-Cotto fight, but he obviously wound up fighting Pacquiao.
He could have easily fought Williams at 154 or 60. If Mayweather “missed him” then how didn’t Oscar? Mayweather was never in any kind of talks with Williams so by the same logic I don’t see how Oscar isn’t under that same umbrella.
As for Margarito, you just said it there, Oscar said he was going to fight the Margarito-Cotto winner, thinking it was going to be Cotto, then when Margarito won he said he didn’t want the fight. So how’s that not a miss?
I have only one thing against Pac, his refusal to get tested and the lame excuse "I'm afraid of needles", before that I always cheered for him, then I was positive he was using PED'S.
Pacquaio has never once said he was afraid of needles.
floyd got caught cheating. they let him and covered it up. i suggest you read the literature on the subject. it was a program that was setup to allow floyd to cheat through the use of tue's. that is not even up for debate. floyd literally could do anything and you would defend him i suppose. just like a certain orange man. floyd is a cheater. deal with it. do you really think floyd has the personality of an egalitarian that wants "fair fights" i suggest you study human behavior and psychology. he clearly would do anything to win and he did.
Hey guy, you don’t know who you’re talking to do you? Does the Username give you any clues? You remember me, the guy who spanks your little botty on this forum none stop? No you clearly don’t know otherwise you’d never have replied to me you pathetic fat fuck :lol1:
Oh you suggest I do that, do you? I suggest you kill yourself. Buddy, I have forgotten more about this subject than you will ever know in the entirety of your sad pathetic life. Don’t go down this road with me, please. I am tired of embarrassing you none stop. You have not even the first clue about drugs, drug testing or how it works. So please, do yourself a favour.
You are at a point where you are actually deeming USADA as as “fake testing” :lol1: Are you legit straight up brain dead or are your dribbling spastic parents genuinely siblings? It’s one or the other.
So just to repeat again, the UFC, a multi BILLION dollar company used USADA exclusively to administer their drug tests for a decade to which they caught a plethora of their athletes using PEDS. And that is “fake” to you is it?
Get a clue, you fat basement dwelling cunt.
A plethora of reasons lol you haven't said 1. If he had plaster in the gloves why did some fighters take the punches? Stop being so insecure and answer
I don't need to give a reason, the fact remains, though, that are a plethora of reasons as to potentially why.
You can't just assert that there wasn't illegal wraps because the punches were taken. That's a fallacious argument and a non argument.
They would investigate the massive incompetence and/or any payments from Margarito to the commission for them to have helped him cheat.
What are you even babbling on about now?
just because you say it's true doesn't make it so. Nazzim said he felt the cushion while it was on the table and that's the 1 that had "a block" in it. Nothing about the other hand having also had illegal substances
BOTH wraps had illegal substances on them, idiot. Look it up.
And yes, the one that was APPROVED by CSAC.
Yeah definitely avoided him, nobody really wanted that Crawford smoke at 147 in the 2010’s.
I think it would have been an interesting fight around 2007, was never gonna be an attractive fight for Floyd, I certainly wouldn’t say Floyd should have fought him either, he had bigger fish to fry.
I always think Tszyu would’ve been a nice addition, 140 was the only weight he never claimed the lineal title, think Floyd was HBO and Tszyu was SHO, which made it difficult.
Floyd wanted that fight with Tszyu. He was vocal about that. I think he saw a high reward lower risk kind if fight with Tszyu being inactive and injury prone.
Couldn’t happen for many reasons but Floyd definitely wanted it.
I don't know about that let's not get too carried away
Manny was doing the chasing, and Floyd was doing all the running and holding
Iron Dan put the official hold count at around 30 isn't that right Iron Dan
23. That's how many times there were clinches in that fight which averages to less than 2 per round.
Those pesky facts.
1. That's the dumbest most brain dead thing I have ever heard in my life. He wasnt close to getting away with using loaded wraps.
What is? That he attempted to use illegal hand wraps vs Mosley? It's a literal fact you daft cunt :lol1:
Is your theory that commissions and refs spanning several countries and states all conspired for Margarito?
I don't have a theory.
I said if you get caught attempting to use illegal handwraps then ever fight you had prior to that is up for question. It just is, I'm sorry.
2. Why then i the only fight anyone questions is Cotto?
Quite positive I haven't even mentioned Miguel Cotto in this thread :thinking: :dunce:
Is your theory that Paul Williams and Joshua Clottey and Daniel Santos and have super humanly durable skin?
Like I said, I don't have a theory.
But, he got caught attempting to cheat via illegal hand wraps, so, when that happens, every fight he had prior to that is going to be questioned. That's how it is in this thing known as life. Sorry that it makes you cry like a little baby but it just how it is. Get used to it.
I wouldn’t class Margarito and Williams as Oscar’s era. He was the generation before. By the time they were top rated fighters- especially in Williams’ case he essentially had one foot out the door. Floyd held titles at welterweight the same time both Margarito and Williams did. In contrast, I wouldn’t say Floyd missed Thurman, Porter or Amir Khan, or anyone from that 2012-15 range. The young guys are always gonna call the cash cow out.
He could’ve plausibly fought Margarito in 2008 but we’re talking the last legs of his career at that point, probably wishes he did instead of Pacquiao in hindsight. Based on Margarito’s showing vs Mosley he might’ve had a chance, although Oscar looked terrible back at 147 IMO. I think Floyd would have stopped him had the rumoured September 2008 rematch happened.
That’s true but Williams was never on Floyd’s radar or was any calling for it even. he wasn’t at 147 long and was avenging his loss to Quintana for most of it.
As for Margarito, I can’t see how that can’t be under the umbrella of a “miss” when he said he was going to fight the winner and it would have been the biggest fight in the sport at the time had it happened. But instead he quite blatantly ducked it and cherry picked Pacquaio instead that backfired. If that’s not deemed a “miss” then I’m not sure what is.
Can you read? I said over and over that he attempted to use illegal wraps vs Mosley.
Exactly so what in the flying fuck are you talking about?
the fact that you don't have theory is exactly why I said it's braindead.
I don't have a theory because I don't care.
He got caught attempting to use illegal hand wraps, that's the long and short it. So as a result every fight prior to that is going to be in question.
By your logic if Margarito had gotten caught bringing a gun to his fight vs Mosley then you have to question if he shot every other opponent.
Not really.
A legitmately retarded comparison by a real retarded cunt :lol1: Congrats on that one.
It came out he got permission to use a water IV, which required notification to the testing agency.
He did not violate any rules and he didnt get "caught" using any "masking agents" other than water.
Nah, he got an "exemption" about 3 weeks after the fight happened.
And that was only when the story came to light, about getting caught using an illegal IV, which he did.
A random fight that got cancelled I really wanted to see was Mayorga vs Angulo. Dunno why, just thought it would be fun. Think it was 2009.
Mosley-Judah another one that got cancelled that would have been alright.
Mosley-Berto 2010 aswell, cancelled due to the earthquake in Haiti.
The only time I remember it being talked about was when the Rugged Man and Floyd had that spat on some radio show. FTR, I think Floyd beats both Margarito and Williams relatively easily. But I would still class them as guys from his era he missed, albeit for completely logical reasons.
I’d say it’s more of a swerve than a miss, no doubt Oscar could have fought him had he wanted to but I wouldn’t class Margarito as a guy from his era, the same way Winky Wright was when they both held 154 titles for a couple of years. For example, I wouldn’t say Pacquiao missed Spence or Crawford despite them fights being very plausible at times for the same reasons.
I think Pacquiao definitely missed Crawford. In fact I’d say he outright avoided him.
RA The Rugged Man is a moron :lol1: He reminds me of posters in here.
I just don’t see how Floyd missed Williams when it was never a serious discussed fight.
I think if we want to talk about legitimate fights Floyd missed then Stevie Johnston would be a legitimate one and then probably Margarito and I’d say that’s about it.
I am going off Nazzim's words he said the cushion was on the table, not on his hand. Also it has never been said that if there was plaster on the other hand just the cushion that Nazzim found.
regardless there are MORE CHECKS than just the handwrapping process. So if he used it in previous fights they would of had to get past all of those checks. Is that what you think? And if so how? And how has no one ever even asked for it to be Investigated? Surely if he was getting away with it there would be other fighter doing it. At least fighter with the same trainer.
how did other fighters take those plaster punches and never get cut?
You won't address any of this because you can't accept that you're a gullible that's been fed a fairytale and you believed it like a moron
Both wraps had illegal substances on them DUMBASS. That’s AFTER they were APPROVED by the CSAC.
Learn to read you thick cunt.
How they potentially took them is irrelevant, there could be a plethora of reasons.
The fact is, he attempted to use illegal handwraps in a fight. Meaning, ALL of his previous fights will be questioned. It’s just how it is when you try to cheat. Cry more about it.
Don't try to minimize it. Holding is holding that was Mayweather's strategy to hold and spoil.
Manny didn't hold at all. He was there to fight that was obvious
English, do you read it?
He literally held less than 2 times per round on average. Less, than 2 times, per round. Meaning it objectively wasn’t his strategy.
Realisticly, there's no need to hold unless your hurt..If floyd held he should lose round as he's either signalling he's been hurt or pac s too much
Not really.
It's been a part of the sport from it's genesis and always will be.
genuinely curious how Canelo beats Nunn, Wright, and Trinidad at 154? The same Canelo who struggled with Trout and Lara, Ancient Cotto, and GGG
Micheal Nunn lost to Steve Little and Frankie Liles and struggled with Merqui Sosa and Iran Barkley.
So the same logic applies.
UKAD clearly just said "Yeah I can't be bothered with this, whatever the WBC said" :lol1:
Look how they treated this case compared to Conor Benn's case. It took Conor Benn 2+ years and 2 hearings with them to be cleared.
It's taken Mungia 4 months and from what I can gather, no hearings from UKAD to clear him.
Who cares what the average is his excessive holding ruined a megafight
Probably the worst megafight performance ever i can't think of a performance more horrible about as horrific as Floyd vs Baldymir when he emptied the joint out
You didn't see srl or hearns excessively holding all fight
Except less than 2 per round is objectively not excessive. What part of your thick skull is not understanding that?
Muhammad Ali for example held more in Frazier 2 than Mayweather did probably his entire career combined.
Unbelievable, you're probably one of the guys excusing canelo too, am I right?
Well Canelo actually failed two drug tests. Pacquaio has never failed a drug test.
Also, again, Pacquaio has never once said he is afraid of needles.
Was my 2nd choice, was 2010 I think, Salido spoiled the party, Bob f***ed up over-marinating it.
I knew Salido would beat him too. This entire forum called me crazy for even giving Salido a chance let alone picking him to win by KO.
I think it's wild when a fighter has a little fan base and they pretend fights didn't happen. I saw the Mtagwa fight, I don't know how you can watch fight that and see a guy who has stamina issues, not a great chin and struggles on the backfoot and think he can beat Salido.
It was similar when Broner has undefeated and at this peak of being overhyped, where his rabid fanbase pretended the Quintero, De Leon and Pauli fights didn't happen. Especially the first two. I don't know if you were on this forum at the time in 2013 but the posters on here acted like Broner would legitimately kill Maidana, at least 95% of posters on here deemed that as good as sanctioned murder. I was totally baffled and was very confident Maidana would not only win but beat the hell out of him. Which of course he did. I don't know how you could watch his fights with Quintero, De Leon, Pauli, Gavin Rees, and others not see that Maidana who is bigger, stronger, dirtier and hits substantially harder than anyone he's fought by a ginormous margin was not going to land massive punches on a totally cement foot Broner with an average defense. I made a lot of money on that fight.
You are lying they were not cleared and no one had checked them.... because it wasn't time to check them yet. The 1st time anyone had checked them it was ****m and then once the commission had actually picked them up a block fell out.
https://********/6RvQcHouzQE?si=XpqtQDtgIyDzE0wT
Erm, no.
When Naazim got to the room, one of Margarito's hands had already been wrapped AND APPROVED by CSAC.
While the other one was being wrapped, Naazim questioned the amount of tape used and asked for it be rewrapped to which the substances were found.
So you ain't got a clue you daft twat :lol1: Don't even know your own story :lol1:
its easy to "want a fight' in the media, thats literally the whole point of going to the media. to spin your narrative. what matters is action. floyd took no action to make the fight. being vocal conveys nothing about being truthful, and often can be used to be deceptive.
lets talk about credibility and how words dont matter if you have none. floyd is the same guy that said he wanted winky wright. then winky said ok lets fight and floyd said oh ummm yeah ill fight you but you need to come down to 154 with a rehydration clause, obviously floyd thought this would kill the fight but winky said sure thing lets do it and agreed to floyds terms, floyd then said oh wait i should get even more money. goalpost movingggggggggggg
we have seen that same method to duck fights with pac, take the test take the test, 14 days? oh you agreed? 0 days. oh you agreed? i should get more money and you should barely get any. its such a joke. he did not want the tsyzu fight. the only thing you are going on is him saying he wanted the fight but he has no credibility or honesty as proven so no, we simply cant trust his words. we have to look at his actions and his actions show he did nothing to want the fight.
from what i remember tsyzu even proposed an hbo/showtime joint promotion to make the fight, floyd did his media thing and moved on till the fight was no longer relevant, im surprised he didnt fight tszyu after hatton knocked him out, would fit his personality profile. you all said i was ducking tsyzu 5 years ago well i proved you wrong! he creates the conditions for fights not happening and then uses those conditions to justify why they didnt happen. his excuses also contradict themselves constantly. i cant fight top rank guys, yet he didnt fight top rank guys when he was with top rank, then he did fight pac when he was with top rank thus disproving his BS claim. its a joke people fall for his excuses.
I can't even get past the first paragraph.
Don't you ever get tired of being in the running for the most retarded dude on this site? It can't be fun.
It's not too late to unalive yourself, just saying.
Manny peaked in 2010.
Every year after that was a substantial decline from his peak.
sure he still has something left in the tank but the amount left is not the same as the full tank in 2010.
floyd never fought the full version.
Leonard at least beat Duran before he got slept by Hearns.
Floyd fought the one the Manny that got KO'd already.
sure theres still some crumbs of glory for beating duran after hearns.
duran still has tank left especially beating barkley.
but you're getting little to no credit for that.
thats not peak duran.
not peak manny.
also the scorecards were 116-112.
floyd almost drew with a guy with one arm
116-112 is 8 rounds to 4.
That's not "almost a draw".
Also one card was 118-110 which is 10 rounds to 2.