Neckodeemus

konstantin and neckodeemus still need to vote. im not even gonna PM them, cause they forgot last time and i dont wanna keep having to do that... Limited PC access at the weeks end I'm afraid :sleeping: Forbes UD Brewer Duddy UD Campas Cheers.

Jorge Arce (KO 5) Masibulele Makepula Julio Cesar Chavez Jr. (W UD) Mathew strode Arthur Abraham (W KO 8) Edison Miranda

Last time check, Barrera made his excuses 3 years ago and 3 years runnning, his excuses were still excuses. How the fuck you gonna say Pac has a staccato career? Eight years ago, at the age of 19, he beat the lineal champ Sasakul on won the WBC flyweight title and 3 years later he won the IBF Super Bantamweight when he beat the HBO trying to hype Ledwaba. Flash in the pan? shut the fuck up, Pac was a world champ at age 19 and the past 8 years he has beaten 7 world champs, only guy to stop granite chin Morales and if he retire now, he is Canastota bound. I probably should have said a staccato recent career, I was typing pretty fast and that was the point made in the above paragraph. People are saying Manny is Superman, what is his biggest win since he fought Barera? Morales. Who beat Morales shortly before Manny did and, one would presume, took another little chunk of Morales away? Barrera. However, after fight III Morales still went forward and beat Manny. Slice it, dice it, cut it lengthways, since they fought Barrera has had a better run of form, he will also dictate when he and Manny fight again because he can. He also has a longer, more distinguished top-level career. Manny is Canastota bound now? Perhaps, afterall McGuigan was recently placed into the HOF. The point is that people are putting up threads and calling Barrera a coward, his career seems to suggest otherwise and recently he has been in better form than Manny who, like Marco, beat Morales but who failed to beat, was completely out-boxed by, Marquez.

No. Morales went down like a guy who had ran out of gas, he sagged from my perspective. He looked out of sorts in fight II and still out-boxed Manny, people are talking about Manny-Barrera II like he has already beaten Morales, Erik could beat Manny and send him packing 1-2 into a fight with Barrera. Marco is not a pussy, you must see that and are trash talking. A rematch with Manny wasn't made, immediate rematches are often a bad idea. It seems Marco is fairly confident Manny would lose some steam, their recent fight by fight runs suggest this. By the time Paccers-Barrera II takes place, and it will do so, Manny will have lost a lot of lustre and been in some tough fights where he is out-boxed and his balance problem exposed. Then he will fight Marco, possibly in Barrera's last fight. Win, lose or draw neither man is going down as a coward, Marco is an intelligent guy, he doesn't feel the need to throw insults or speak like a jive-talking pimp. Paccers in on the back-burner but he is not going anywhere, Marco can beat Chavez, if he can do this, Chavez is tough, and make Mexican history in doing so then take on Paccers. A fight that may be like Lewis-Tyson.

Pac-Fans have to accept that putting a guy down three times then being out-boxed by him round after round is not criteria for winning a twelve round fight. Erik was up in weight for Raheem and may have ditched it but did not look at taut as he usually does. Frankly he looked worn. Also two weights of the same poundage does not mean the same levels of body tone.

dont worry about this poster he doesnt knwo anything about boxing he think pac has achieved more than oscar has LOL just shows how stupid he is and how lil knowledge he has. I think you must be mistaking me for someone else, I never talk about Oscar.

Surely we should hold fire and see if Barrera takes the match late in his career and then judge him? There must a thousand strands all saying MAB ducked Paccers and will be harshly judged for it yet, on last check, both men are still active and a rematch is a fight away. Barrera said he did not have a chance to prepare properly for Paccers and we know this to be true. Since that fight Marco has taken on Ayala and Morales plus annexed versus Peden and had a tough fight with Juarez then schooled him in a rematch. In that time Paccers has fought Marquez (taken to school, humiliated and lucky to scrape a draw), Morales (out-boxed and proven to be fairly pedestrian in fight I, beat a, frankly, flabby looking and worn Morales in fight II) and beaten Larios. Since they fought Barrera is 6-0, Pacquiao is 4-1-1 and in the two black marks he was comfortably out-boxed for long periods. Barrera has added to his reputation and if Manny loses to Erik, as I feel he will, he may go down as a flash in the pan hype-monster who fought two genuine greats after they had knocked holes from one another and had very hard careers. Both guys are very good and rematch is necessary but if anything, head to head aside, Barrera is the man who has hung better at higher class, Manny has had a staccato career and is not as invincible as his fans (fanatical to the extreme of not seeing he got comprehensively out-boxed by JMM) like to think.

The difference is Morales belived in his excuses and BArrera did not that why BArrera is a pussy. If he actually believe it, he would have rematch Pac anytime. Juarez first fight was close and Barrera does not want to leave any doubt and of course I believe he knows he can beat Juarez that's why he fought him again right away. Pac-Man is a tough fight. Marco might be waiting for a sign that it is time to take Manny, then he will do so, boxing is about strategy and timing. If Marco does not fight Pac-Man again he will be judged badly, if he fights him and wins he can retire at the right time and it would be churlish to claim he is ducking anyone, he'd have avenged a defeat and retired on that.

Morales was winning until Pac connected on the sixth and almost took Morales down. Look at Morales face after that fight and how the fuck you gonna tell me, that was from worn out. Pac literally rearranged his face. so shut the fuck up. Morales looked out of sorts versus Raheem and Manny II, yet, as you say, he out-boxed Manny. I think Paccers fans are getting anxious. Erik has rested for a year now. A boxing lesson beckons for Pac-Man, he may not even get to the Barrera rematch on a winning roll, if not he'll get hosed financially. Erik went down like a tired fighter, this was not Duran on his face time.

Yeah Pac has staccato career :rolleyes: , fuck outta here. Look at his record. An early loss, a title loss, a unification draw and then the road to the Barrera fight. After which he lost and drew once again. His prior career was not as constant as Barrera's and his subsequent career hasn't been. You are mistaken. Barrera has reeled off wins since that fight and Manny has had stutter steps, it is clear to see. Plus he did stay on in the division after the Sanchez loss.

MAn i wasnt saying that about u i was talking about Joartcc. I thought you had gotten me mixed up, no problem, it happens :)

Face it kid. Your man is a pussy. I think you must be talking about a different Barrera. If not you completely lack respect for fighters.

We need to bear in mind that Manny was in the formative stages when he lost to Torrecampo and lost his final fight at Flyweight as he grew too big for the division. I did point out that Paccers had had staccato recent form and that is true. We'll have to see how it all pans out in the long run.

Guys, before it gets said let me state this: The only nuts I hold are my own, to stop them slapping against your womans/mums legs :) I'm joking by the way, it is a good response to this 'nut hugging' insult.

Morales can beat Pac, I think he still have enough to actually pull it out but I would never bet on it. I do not think Morales taken the 3rd fight if he actually think he can not win. Unlike Barrera, who made his excuses and pussied out when he actually the rematch was on his hands for to be made. If you think immediate rematch was a bad idea, see why he rematch Juarez immediately. Because he knows he can beat him. I thought the Juarez match-up was wrong, he beat the guy first time out, why bow to pressure to go right back into it when you are better than the guy, it gave us fans a glorified exhibtion this weekend (no disprespect to Juarez and his fans). Barrera should see if Manny loses to Erik, Marco has taken care of his business with Morales, if Manny loses he can force him into a fight after that and Manny will get less money as he will be coming off a loss and going for Marco's titles. Morales can certainly beat Manny, we do agree on something :) I strongly feel it is wrong for Marco to be called a pussy.

you're not a nuthugger? :rolleyes: well ok, but neither are you a true boxing fan. you only recognize boxers you root for and downplay their opponents in case your heroes got beat. belittling PAC's career and recent achievements will have most boxing experts laugh at you. the guy was a world title holder in 2 divisions prior to facing MAB. it was only his 2nd fight at featherweight when he faced MAB yet he gave him a thorough onesided beating. So I must be a Marco fan, who thinks Morales can beat Paccers and who must have alternated rounds between cheeering for Marco and rooting for Erik when they fought. Or maybe I'm a guy who thinks Manny can be out-boxed, who has seen him out-boxed and thinks a second fight will transpire, I'm not belittling Manny but take his achievements and compare them to Barrera's. People say Barrera has this big question mark over him, well Manny has two, he has to lead the trilogy with Erik and his fans have to accept that Marquez out-boxed him. I've not belittled Manny, I've pointed out his recent form and compared him obejectively to Marco, maybe you feel he comes offf seond best in this respect, in which case you are belittling Manny.

There are numerous threads that absolutely kill all logic from this statement, regardless, if floyd becomes RING Champ at 147, what will you say then? If you made a typo and meant 140, when was Kostya EVER going to get in the ring with Floyd? We both know damn well Kostya never had any intention on fighting floyd. Floyd is the one overeaching his grasp, yet Hatton demands 13 million to fight Floyd? These guys need to fight one another, your right, but right now judging by the evidence that more than favors Floyd Mayweather, this is Hatton's teams fault for the fight now happening, and I think his team knows that if he gets in the ring with Mayweather than undefeated record is going to go. Hello Black Jesus (great Ghostface track BTW). I don't see the thread killers, Floyd and Ricky will age in unison, no one will have an adavantage there. I did mean 140 though, I apologise about that. I think Floyd did not press a claim to fight Tszyu nor did he go for Hatton when he beat Kostya. By moving up in weight Floyd is making the fight hard to make. Personally I'd like Floyd back at 140, he looked sharp, speedy and dangerous there, his balance and fast hands made his counter left hook a real bonus. Unfortunately he is moving weights so fast that natural fights get by-passed. What if he fights De La Hoya at 154 or catchweight? Oscar is faded, despite a recent win over Mayorga, and in fighting Oscar Floyd is trying to live off the glory from an era that is fading. Mayweather should instead forge his own glory in the era he is a prime part of. That means a fight for #1 at 140. Personally I think it will happen. I'm a Manc so I won't wish you luck in the game tomorrow ;)

Barrera UD Juarez Guzman SD Barrios Gonzalez TKO 9 Vasquez

The judges don't know how to score a fight anymore and the 'net is playing a big part. I don't know how many times I've scored a fight for a guy and people say he should have lost, other times, like last night, I score for a guy and he gets the fight taken away. I always hear the same argument against me: "My guy threw X more punches and landed slightly more so he won." So what, it is a race now, we are watching amateur boxing? Because if we are we might as well give up shop. It seems that judges score second by second instead of taking a round as an whole, they seem to give the nod for a guy winning the last 30 seconds of a round. What is that? Do we want boxer's or Sugar Ray Leonards (who earned his stripes but boasted about this trick in biography where they broke the Hagler fight into numbers). This isn't maths. You story a round then pick it and start a new round. Don't got he other way and then spill one round into the next and say: "Fighter A turned the tide in the last thirty seconds so I'm going to give him the start of this round by default." You are really saying that one guy fought for thirty seconds and you are giving him nearly two rounds. Scoring is relative, yet there are rules and it seems they are not being applied. Both Toney and Peter jabbed, lets break it down from the start. Peter pushed his jabs into Toney from a flat base and Toney powered jabs into Peter by stepping into them, forget bone and skin issues, that is why one guy got bashed-up. Then they pot-shotted, Peter landed big, usually early when he was fresh and was then out-cuted, he hit Toney big and Toney winked at Sam's corner. Toney hit Peter big and punched through his head, not behind it. He got Peter in ring centre in 9(?) and smashed a shot right in. Toney landed the better punches, often Peter landed swipes and barely-legal blows. A guy has a right to defend himself using body movement and not get instant retribution, under the refs eyes, from illegal blows, are we going to say: "You only only block and parry with a perfectly straight back." What next? No body movement, no guard then just cement guys into the canvas and see who can land the most shots. Toney beat Peter but we need judges who are trained to know the rules, know the applications and then apply them. For instance, a 9-9 round. Why call it the ten-point must ruling when it isn't a rule that is applied. If a guy is punished for breaking the rules he needs to be punished. You take the round. If he wins it he loses it for, in effect, cheating his way to trying to win it. Take the round. As soon as the ref says "Deduction" the judge fills in the -1 on the deductions card and if the guy who breaks the rules won the round the judge gives it 10-10, then in the end the guy who broke the rules loses the round 10-9 or 10-8, he is punished. Toney will be back. Boxing needs better judging in big fights and better, forceful, refereeing. Those who think that is harsh needs this :bottle: :) Only kidding. Peter looked anything but a genuine heavyweight hitter though.

I'll join up mate.

I wrote the article guys and I am glad that it made people think. Some think it was poor and that is their choice, I won't quibble with the right to disagree. What I will say is that Graham is not afraid to come out and answer the fan questions put to him (how many do that?) so in a way he is prepared to put up and answer the questions concerning the Floyd fight. The man has a current Champion (until he loses at 147 he is that) and has trained numerous British guys we all respect such as Brodie and Gomez. His views do carry weight and I am not being biased, his record is excellent. The fight with Floyd is wanted. Floyd is the one whose reach is overstretching his grasp. He never won anything meaningful at 147, if Kostya was so faded where was the call-out from Floyd? These guys need to fight one another, plain and simple. As for rumours, they do not relate to Billy and Ricky, only one of them. Also how can Ricky be waiting for Floyd to get old? Has Ricky stopped aging himself? Is he in stasis? He will age along with the other guys! :) Thanks guys.

All his career, was at the Bika bout.

and Tito isn't far behind. Beating "names" doesn't matter at all when they are from lower weight classes. Tito was repeated knocked down by welterweights, outboxed by a few as well. Oscar was great but the 2003 middleweight Oscar was not Ae you saying McIntyre and Tucker Podwell are better names on the resume than Oscar? Or that they were harder defences? No offence but that is quite laughable. Perhaps Oscar Vs McIntyre on HBO PPV would satisfy your question?! I would venture to say that Manfredo was also easier than Oscar as a defence. His chin is bigger than a yacht and he was only there to mug for the cameras and get his arse spanked senseless.

Tito fought better versus Jones than Lacy wil ever fight again. At the higher weight also. I'm not sure what the purpose of the thread is because the original statement is patently wrong. McIntyre, Podwell and Manfredo are poor, they sound like a 1970's progrock trio and fought with as much ability and urgency. Manfredo spent more time looking at the camera and canvas than he did fighting.

I don't mind the late nights. Stay awake until 5am most weekend nights so it is even better when a big fight is on. I love it when we have Saturday fights here and then over to the USA for another show. The more boxing the merrier.

I had a dream I was in a menage a trois with Deeta Von Teese and Kelly Brook. It has not come true. If Hopkins does destroy will you dream that I marry Von Teese, then we can both work on Kelly! I've had some odd dreams like that myself mate, usually the reverse happens so it might be a bad omen for Hopkins :nonono:

Without a second viewing I thought Hopkins nicked the fight. More punches thrown by Joe but the abiding memory is the amount of cleaner shots Hopkins seemed to land. I would not go wild if it was scored either way though as it is a case of what you like. I like the guy making an impact with his shots, pro boxing is not decided on amateur point scoring, got to take into accounts the frugality and quality of Hopkins' shots. But Joe made a hell of a case for himself. On thing that rankles is that 9-point card. That is very poor. Given the other cards were similar it is clear one guy completely misread the fight, Hopkins can complain about that but not the verdict overall as it went tight due to his inactivity at times. A few years ago it is a different bout, Hopkins was more effective then again so was Joe.

I think I know what the couch meant in this dream. Chuck Giampa was sat on it during the fight, and was facing away from the ring. Crazy card, spoiled the fight, which was better than expected!

and he did armed robbery in his teens. Not to forget that he also survived meeting Steve Bunce! And only got paid $400 for his first fight. Plus his family lived in a hole in the street until he was 15. No one gave him anything, apart from three bites at the middleweight title. I'm just glad the build-up has been this much fun, maybe people will nip out and buy some tickets today. Bunce is there to provide a bit of colour in the late hours. You have to take him with a pinch of salt but he is a character and if you love him or hate him he forces you to stay awake for more of his Buncisms (going for Tyson on points over Lennox Lewis is the best one he's ever comeout with).

One thing against Hopkins is that he did allow some drift in the middle rounds. I think his flooring of Joe left Joe stuck in two minds, attack or wait, for the first four. Then he got into it and Hopkins took his rounds off at the wrong points. Hopkins, though, did land the more telling blows. Compubox is not a judge of quality. Problem for Hopkins is that he would land then smother and it may have done his shots a disservice. Along the ropes, when Joe would open, Hopkins sometimes had the last word. Often with punches landed you then look at accuracy and punch effectiveness. One shots from Hopkins early put Joe over and made him fight cautious, Hopkins' punches in the following rounds kept him cautious. Compubox is good fun but with a stat 9/10 times there can be a lot of problems with that stat. My girlfriend is a fan of Joe's boxing and she had Hopkins 4-0 in the early going, then Joe tightening the scoring, she was turned off by Hopkins' spoiling and time wasting, she had it a draw and is a pretty good judge. Reckons Hopkins made a mountain for his own back. However, fight over. Joe won so time for him to move on and Hopkins to perhaps move into being a trainer. Jones will land shots on Joe but his chin will present a problem. I think Joe-Jones may be an interesting fight, can we hack the showboating though :nonono: