For those who thinks Manny fights Past Prime fighters...Come to school

I know, I said that, I think it was changed into 3 mil, but I also remember reading that Roach would have not have allowed Manny to fight if DLH would have re hydrated to 160, so to play it safe DLH came in at 147 to the fight. No sir. They just had the option of calling of the fight should dlh have decided to weigh in officially at let's say 152 like he did in the forbes fight.

Read it again, Roach and Arum said Manny won't fight if DLH outweighed him. Let me clear out what you said... DLH will pay 1M for every pound in excess of 147 during weigh in... It does not mean DLH should not rehydrate after the weigh in...

Fighters after fighting Manny seem to lose something more than the fight. So people are quick to say they were shot before fighting Manny...That seems to be a lie. Just to name a few... Barrera won 8 straight before fighting Manny! Morralas fought 8 fights only losing once to Barrera before fighting Manny. DLH Lost 2 out of 5 fights...Floyd Mayweather & Bernard Hopkins. Both great fighters. Diaz has won 9 straight fights before Manny. His only 2 losses to Manny & Holt. Hatton...45 fights only losing to Floyd and Pacquiao. JMM 7&1 the one loss out of that 7 , to Manny. None of these fighters at the time of fighting Manny showed NO signs of being Past Prime. Barrera in the first fight was still prime. Marquez was still close his prime also as was Hatton kind of. The others though were not. I know you want him to look good, but these fights were just against guys who were past it. Oscar was 36, a part time fighter for years, hadn't made WW in seven years and had lost half of his last six fights. Diaz was just Diaz. He wasn't past prime at all, he was just never any good. Morales was done as a top fighter. The first Pac fight was his last hurrah. He fought very well, but that war as well as his last war against Barrera, which he lost and got beaten up pretty bad had finally taken everything out of him. He then lost to Raheem badly looking like shite and then the second fight with Manny he just didn't have the legs anymore and truly was cooked and served up in the last fight. Hatton was also just Hatton. Looked terrible against Lazcano and nearly got popped the same as Manny and Mayweather did him and then beat Paulie, but I think he was never going to win at that stage against any good top fighter. It was the end for him one way or another and Pac really made him see the end quickly.:lol1:Poor bastard. The thing that gets me though about your post is that you said none of these guys showed any signs of being past their best. All that means is that you have never seen them at their best. Compare Oscar to when he was fighting Mosley, Whitaker, Quartey, Carr etc. How can you possibly he say he looked the same? My god, there is such a huge difference which is why people say he was shot. Hatton had struggled against aforementioned fighters and been knocked out badly by Mayweather. Morales looked nothing like he used to years before as when he fought Barrera for the first time. There were big differences which is why people say this stuff. Anyway, none of it matters because he is fighting a very prime Cotto who just beat arguably the most skilled fighter in the WW division in Clottey. We'll see.

I remember reading though that if he outweighed Manny the fight was going to be called off, that is true, so DLH didn't want to lose his money. that was for the official weigh in. No rules on the unofficial fight night weigh in.

All fighters fighting past prime.. period.. I'm tired of all of these bullshits here.. Why all of these excuses haven't mentione prior to each fight? Why can't you just watch and enjoy boxing? I can smell excuse before Cotto-pacquio.. If Cotto win - pac is tool small and overrated If pac wins, Cotto is a damaged good and past prime... So what are we gonna do to enjoy boxing without making excuses? There's a lot of hating going around here...

No he was not, look at the coverage they had here, Roach wanted DLH to pay 1 million for every pound DLH came in overweight, Manny's lawyer said it should be 3 million since 1 is chump change for DLH, then Arum put in the contract that DLH would have to weight the same on fight night or he will pay and or have the fight called off and as for the Mayweather fight, it was at 154 with him re hydrating to 160+ he gassed because he was passed his prime and the only thing that saved DLH was his chin and nothing more. Um...no....that fine was only for the official weigh-in. It was deemed illegal to enforce fines on an "unofficial" weigh-in.

I know, but is anyone he fought in that time frame the same calibur fighter at Manny or Morales? Don't think so, so once he faced a good fighter in Manny he lost. Regardless if he was or was not past his prime I have said before it was still a legit win. I do hold Manny in high standards as does everyone else because he is P4P king and unlike Mayweather fights guys that he would not fight (Mayweather) I'm not saying Manny is cherry picking or fighting past prime fighters now, I am just saying Morales, DLH were past it, Diaz wasn't, neither was Hatton nor Cotto, just saying he should keep up fighter prime fighters. like?? taking on bigger fighters like Cotto is alot more dangerous than fighting anyone at his own class at 140, and there's no big money at 140. Cotto is one of the toughest fighters out there for him, and that shouldnt be overlooked.

I believe it was a little bit of both, him being tired and him having a poor camp, but regardless in being in great shape, you can still be weight drain, look at Manny when he got KO'd, another reason he was weight drained because he wasn't allowed to balloon up to 160 like most WWs do, because if he did. 1. Fight would be called off 2. 3mil per pound over 147 Because he wasn't able to rehydrate to a "comfortable" weight he wasn't able to throw as much (not only because he couldn't pull the trigger but because not being at the comfortable weight makes you throw less or in this case not hard shots) causing him to be weight drained. ODLH was allowed to rehydrate, but whatever the reason was he didnt. They said it was the kangaroo meat, or he wanted to stay slim so he can keep up with Mannys speed. But it's a myth that he wasnt allowed to rehydrate. Its just that he didnt. He was also 147 at least 3 weeks before the fight as 24/7 showed, thus he didnt drain or starve himself for the fight night. I watched Mayweather vs ODLH recently, and ODLH was gassed by the 6th round. If ODLH was truly drained vs Manny, he wouldve been KO'd.

I know tater...I know. We will find a way. We'll find a way, Im glad to see that you have no problem in showing everyone that you are a ignorant person. Saves me the trouble in doing for you. thanks man. I own you boy!

The constant rape of Bad Boy is worth cracking open another cold one. Carry on. Im sure you can dig yourself a hole faster then that, you know, being so close to the ground and all.

I do take that in consideration but then what? You have to remember Barrera didnt lose 3 years before losing to Manny, and 3 Years after. Im not going to hold that against Manny for the only person to beat Barrera in a 6 year timeframe. At this point, youre holding Manny to incredibly high standards for not beating someone in their super prime, but when was he given the opportunity? He wouldve had to beat someone undefeated who has never lost a round and no such fighter existed at his time. Someone who is close is Mayweather, but he's been off for 2 years and he's cherrypicking a lightweight. And you can bet your ass if either Pacquiao or Marquez beat Mayweather it'll blamed on that 2year layoff and/or brittle hands that may or may not have broke during the fight.

I never take credit away from Manny beating Barrera, it was a legit win, but you must also take into consideration that he had lost to junior jones, morales, beat hamed and then lost to Manny, he was showing signs of him slipping. Now I don't think Frazier was past his prime when he lost to Foreman, I just think Foreman was too big and strong for Frazier. Manny is in his prime now, if he were to lose to Cotto, again not passed it, just Cotto was too big and too strong, but say Manny goes back down to JWW and fights Paulie and beats him but struggles with him and gets hit too much, then I will say he is showing signs of being past his prime, know what I mean? I do take that in consideration but then what? You have to remember Barrera didnt lose 3 years before losing to Manny, and 3 Years after. Im not going to hold that against Manny for the only person to beat Barrera in a 6 year timeframe. At this point, youre holding Manny to incredibly high standards for not beating someone in their super prime, but when was he given the opportunity? He wouldve had to beat someone undefeated who has never lost a round and no such fighter existed at his time. Someone who is close is Mayweather, but he's been off for 2 years and he's cherrypicking a lightweight.

You are right, because he didn't throw anything (exaggerating) how can you gas out when you don't throw anything, why wasn't he able to throw anything because he wasn't able to move the way he had to, to win the fight, laziness might have something to do with it, but he was showing signs of hims slipping in the Mayweather fight and Forbes for the fact that he tired half way (which I think past prime fighters do, gas out faster then they used to) and wasn't able to "pull the trigger" and continue his attack and got hit WAY too much for someone still in their prime to allow, unless you are Chavez or Margarito, DLH never blocked punches with his face, so him getting hit too much is a sign of his reflexes not working like they used to, another sign of a being passed your prime. http://www.boxingscene.com/forums/view.php?pg=manny-pacquiao-oscar-de-la-hoya-compubox Sorry buddy. Delahoya was throwing just as much if not more than Pacquiao for the first few rounds. It wasnt until the 6th round when Pacquiao turned it up a notch that the fight truly slipped away from Oscar. Only difference is that Oscar whiffed with pretty much everything. Once again i agree DLH did show signs of aging with forbes but his loss to pacquiao cannot be attributed to weight drainage because he was actually in great shape. It cannot be attributed to age because Pacquiao never did anything really creative in the ring that night. Jab, straight, turn straight, straight, jab, turn straight, jab, straight, turn Oscar just had absolutely 0 defense against the straight left because he had horrible sparring partners that did absolutely nothing to help him prepare for it. The one guy that would have someone helped him...he fired.

Maybe, because if you think Morales, Larios and DLH were prime when they fought Manny, then I honestly don't think you know what prime is, Morales went into the Manny fight coming off a lose to Barrera and he beat him, he went into the 2nd fight 1-2 and the 3rd 1-3. Larios just got KTFO by Vazquez and moved up in weight to fight him and lose. DLH went in more weight drain then anything but he was passed his prime, not shot, but passed his best days. I never said being young=prime, prime example is Manny gets KTFO young and is KTFO of people now...Manny is in his prime now, because he is improving and showing his abilities very well. I see being passed your prime when you show signs of age, reflexes aren't what they used to and you get tired faster then before...all 3 Larios, Morales and DLH had those problems before stepping in the ring with Manny meaning they were past their best. Prime can vary. Also DLH just fought MAyweather and lost to a split Decision. He had fight left. DLH is a weird floppy subject...you never know with this guy. Morales wasnt shot before their 1st fight. He beat Pac and two fights later Pac stopped him. the 3rd was a rubber match that shouldnt have happen but there was unfinished buisness. I didnt even mention Larios because i never saw that great fighter in him. hes good but not nothing to wright home about

all 3 Larios, Morales and DLH had those problems before stepping in the ring with Manny meaning they were past their best. Then what would that Say about Shane Mosley? DLH knocked out Ricardo Mayorga in 6rds in 2006. It takes Shane Mosley 12 rounds to knock out Ricardo Mayorga and come literally within seconds of losing to that same Ricardo Mayorga as he was up on the cards on all 3 cards had he been saved by the bell. A fight thats definitely a showcase of Mosley's age catching up to him. But then he follows that up with his best performance in years by dominating and knocking out Margarito in 6.

No one can really know when their prime is. A prime fighter doesnt lose, when he does, he's automatically not primed. When Frazier lost to foreman he automatically lost his prime status, but he went in that fight after beating Ali. so its easy to assume his prime was beating Ali, and not losing to Foreman. So to say Barrera wasnt primed when he lost to Manny is whatever. Barrera didnt lose in the past 3 years prior to fighting Manny and didnt lose until another 3 years after. Youre automatically discrediting Manny a legit and solid win just to diss him, which again happens alot on this board. Makes no sense to me..

Forgot to mention Barrera, he beat him while he was not prime but not passed it, he was still a GREAT fighter, the 2nd fight was unnecessary, because Barrera was passed it by that time. Back to your reply... Morales was he went in to the 2nd Manny fight 1-2 and the 3rd 1-3 that isn't signs of slipping?...o.o and so was Larios he had just got TKO'd by Vazquez and he had to move up in fight...DLH barely, BARELY got by Forbes, if that isn't sign of slipping, I don't know what will convince you otherwise. 2nd Barrera fight was supposed to take place a year and a half earlier than it actually did for the 130lb wbc title. Just before the 2nd Barrera fight he had lost his title in controversial fashion to JMM where you could argue Barrera won the fight. And as far as DLH goes....signs of age....YES. Signs of "slipping"?? Absolutely not. The DLH that fought both forbes and pacquiao was lazy, unmotivated and undertrained. Forbes fight was supposed to be at 150. DLH came in at 152 anyway. DLH fired Valero as a sparring partner for being an annoying southpaw that actually gave him a mouse under his eye. People keep saying DLH was dehydrated this...zombie that for the Pacquiao fight but watch it again and you will see that DLH never gasses out at any point during the match. Even when Nachos pulls the plug in the corner you never see DLH breathing hard. He was actually in great shape cardiovascularly. Just never worked to the point during training camp where he could actually adapt to Pacquiao's speed and awkwardness.

Yes they were, Morales, Larios were passed their primes...not shot (Morales was in the 3rd fight) but passed their primes...DLH was more weight drain then shot, but he too wasn't at his best. what makes you think that? I guess your definition of Prime maybe different than mine. But you aint shot until you cant win no more. Also not all fighters peak their Prime At the same time. And it dont mean just because you are young you are in your prime. Thats a misconception. How do you see it?

Not all the fighters pac has faced were in their prime. This holds true for all fighters. However, Pac's will be under a microscope because he is on top right now. Same held true for PBF & RJJ before him. All 3 will be appreciated more once theyre gone. Maybe there is a fine line between Prime and Past Prime. But not one ,was Past his Prime...meaning shot. They sure were not losing fights.

Difference between bein past prime and bein shot. EM was finished in the 3rd fight, but it was still a big win for Pac cuz it sealed the trilogy 2-1 for him. MAB showed when he felt like it he could be in it in the rematch, he just didn't have the heart to win. I wouldn't say he was altogether shot, just unwillin to press the action. DLH was obviously past it, but hadn't looked shot in his last few sporadic fights as a part time fighter. He just came into the fight weak as hell from makin 147, but that was his goddamn fault for cherrypickin a LW instead of facin Marg. He was supposed to kill lil Pac. Hatton wasn't shot either. He just looked like it cuz Pac blasted him so easily.