Women Died Of Starvation After Being In ISOLATION CELL FOR 4 DAYS With NO Charges!

[turnedup]

The public would never get their hands of the weaponry the Military Forces will. Us being armed in a Civil War would amount to us being a mere nuisance.

As for keeping guns out of an idiots hand, what if they become stupid after buying the gun ?

What about smart criminals ? If a thug can manage to keep a few blocks on lockdown by becoming a king pin, he can't be that stupid.

I have family in that life..they didn’t become players in that world by being smart but by being ruthless and by buying their way out of trouble. People sometimes forget that even cops can have a price and be bought..not all but there are many that do, can and have. One thing I can say about that life as someone who walked away from it in his teens is that, it doesn’t last long. Prison or death are the two outcomes for them all.

[turnedup]

It's not so much about winning. It's about being able to fight back and die free.

It's also a deterrent to any dictator.

No dictator has ever presided over an armed populace.

Remember; "An armed man is a citizen. A disarmed man is a subject."

Dude we are and will always be subjects. Skip a few years of paying taxes and see how much of a citizen you are to this country. Best country in the world but freedom is a state of mind and a perception. I love this country but the government is its own version of a corporation, we think it works for us but it’s the other way around.

[turnedup]

Another way to look at it: Lets take two scenarios, in the first, the country is disarmed, in the second, it is not.

The government commences to murder more people. People who might get a knock off their credit score, are pursued and shot by agents for the IRS, because god forbid you refuse to pay taxes. Ranchers who protest regarding grazing rights granted to them, by the government, then taken back, are also pursued.

Eventually people see the government is out of control and rebel... Now remembering our two scenarios... You are a government agent told to secure the state of Pennyslvania. You must go high in the mountains, to all the bordering states, etc.

Knowing that people have no firearms this might be difficult, time consuming, but alas, you know you can come and take areas without much real resistance, and at least you know you can hold areas because of the firepower.

KNOW, knowing that people are armed, know the areas they live in intimately, are willing to fight against you, with weapons at the ready... suddenly? Its not really a workable proposition is it? Oh you might get some areas, might secure a spot here and there, but you will not be able to hold it, and you will be picked off by people who know where they live.

And there you have if really... The government does not do so well when people fight back and are willing to do so. Things have not changed so much from the times of King George.

Or they could show us what they do on foreign soil and drop three bunker busters and all those armed civilians shhhh themselves and give up their land. If the government wanted to steam roll us there is shhh all we could do about. You have folks forgetting that they have shhh we haven’t even thought of yet. We’ve seen them ruin lives with a snap of a finger, i guess a false sense of security is better than none.

[1bad65]

Dude we are and will always be subjects. Skip a few years of paying taxes and see how much of a citizen you are to this country. Best country in the world but freedom is a state of mind and a perception. I love this country but the government is its own version of a corporation, we think it works for us but it’s the other way around.

While you make some valid points, you cant say an armed populace are subjects.

We have Constitutional rights (though politicians love taking them away when possible), including the right to vote and bear arms, a jury trial, etc. We arent subjects.

Alot of the rights we have, people in disarmed countries dont have.

I gotta ask, you're not proposing or advocating a repeal of the 2nd Amendment, are you?

[turnedup]

While you make some valid points, you cant say an armed populace are subjects.

We have Constitutional rights (though politicians love taking them away when possible), including the right to vote and bear arms, a jury trial, etc. We arent subjects.

Alot of the rights we have, people in disarmed countries dont have.

I gotta ask, you're not proposing or advocating a repeal of the 2nd Amendment, are you?

I am a gun owner so no, I though believe in reforming si you can’t just buy a gun without paperwork

[1bad65]

I am a gun owner so no, I though believe in reforming si you can’t just buy a gun without paperwork

You cant buy a gun without paperwork, unless it's a private seller.

And surely you arent proposing that regular guys like us would by law have to take the time, effort, and money to run paperwork on buyers whenever we sell one of our guns??

[turnedup]

You cant buy a gun without paperwork, unless it's a private seller.

And surely you arent proposing that regular guys like us would by law have to take the time, effort, and money to run paperwork on buyers whenever we sell one of our guns??

I’m talking about all of it for everyone requiring documentation. I’ve been to gun shows where I can just pull out cash and walk out with a piece. That shhh should be illegal and folks feel like being robbed of that is somehow taking from their rights. I haven’t sold a gun before, I can go to several precincts here and donate them or ask for them to be destroyed. The first time you do it’s weird as fk, at least I was smart enough to put mine in a bag and no whip it out of my holster 😂

[1bad65]

I’m talking about all of it for everyone requiring documentation. I’ve been to gun shows where I can just pull out cash and walk out with a piece. That shhh should be illegal and folks feel like being robbed of that is somehow taking from their rights. I haven’t sold a gun before, I can go to several precincts here and donate them or ask for them to be destroyed. The first time you do it’s weird as fk, at least I was smart enough to put mine in a bag and no whip it out of my holster 😂

Again, you're solution is to put the more regulations/costs/hassle on the law abiding people, the gun owners selling their guns.

Why not just increase the sentencing for criminals who are barred from having guns but get caught with one?

Let's punish the criminals more, and not harrass the law-abiding citizens.

Surely you cant disagree with that logic, can you?

[turnedup]

Again, you're solution is to put the more regulations/costs/hassle on the law abiding people, the gun owners selling their guns.

Why not just increase the sentencing for criminals who are barred from having guns but get caught with one?

Let's punish the criminals more, and not harrass the law-abiding citizens.

Surely you cant disagree with that logic, can you?

Because while you may do your due diligence in screening your buyer not everyone does and if people are fully held accountable for helping someone get their hands on a gun who legally couldn’t otherwise because they are too cheap to spend $20 or something reasonable on the process they should also be held accountable for what that gun gets used for. Folks love saying they need a gun for protection from criminals but how are criminals getting theirs..at some point the inconvenience is less than the risk of not doing it. It shouldn’t be a burden for you to spend three days and twenty bucks on a gun sale. If it is I don’t know what to tell you..maybe don’t sell them then. You can’t tell me you haven’t seen someone stupid and angry enough to go kill someone if only they had access to a weapon at that time..because we all have. As I mentioned on another thread I have redneck friends in Pennsylvania who shouldn’t by any stretch or the imagination own guns ever..legally or not..great people but give them a few drinks or if they are messing with pills become different people. I’ve had many chats with them about that shh.

[billeau2]

Or they could show us what they do on foreign soil and drop three bunker busters and all those armed civilians shhhh themselves and give up their land. If the government wanted to steam roll us there is shhh all we could do about. You have folks forgetting that they have shhh we haven’t even thought of yet. We’ve seen them ruin lives with a snap of a finger, i guess a false sense of security is better than none.

Dropping bunker busters on an area that will become your backyard does not work. Sherman's strategy can only work when you can clear an area out totally. You poison the water, etc it can come back to you. Also, if you have people and troops in an area, you cant bust them out... Our grid, our roads, you think you can just destroy them to take an area you want to control?

I would recommend a training exerscize if you do not think me patronizing. When training students to work against a knife for example, the first thing I say is, "think, what do you... Think... would be good, what would be bad?" In other words, when we look at troops going into areas and taking control, lets imagine what they have to deal with. With a knife, to get a handle on what to do, one must first think intelligently about the situation and not about what people say one can and cannot do.

You will find that it is a nightmare to go into an area where people are armed and able. Would you like to be told you have to go into Texas and "clear" an area, where people are armed and waiting? Think it through. Think about Vietnam, and the attitude the generals had... similar to what you stated...how did that work? In other words think it through intelligently, with no ideology, no emotion, and no heresay.