Tolerant Europe?

[jaded]

haha...I'll just call you Chris for now on.

[F l i c k e r]

It's pretty reasonable. First your Kaiser tried to destroy Europe by a good old fashioned war, but failed when you all surrendered. Then Adolf tried to do it, not just with conventional battles but by gassing and shooting and starving as many civilians as possible too. But still that didn't quite do the job. Now your current leader's gone through the backdoor by forcing millions of Islamic "refugees" who'll multiply exponentially once they settle in Europe on the other 27 EU countries who didn't want anything to do with them. Soon the trucks running through crowds and gunmen at concerts will be even more commonplace and it's all thanks to wonderful Germany.

Not really.

It's Russia who really started it. US and Russia's involvement in the middle east, caused the civil wars in the region. Causing thousands of people to see refuge in Europe to get away.

Russia havs the most to gain from this by destabilizing the EU, the sole entity that is keeping Russia from doing what they want in Europe (to an extent as we see what is going on with Ukraine). Which effectively they have began to do.

Germany only problem was attempting to "do the right thing" and "helping those in need" by allowing the refugees in the country where all of the rest of eastern Europe turned them away. From Turkey to Greece and Italy with everything in-between.

No realizing the mistake. Germany no longer wants them in the country. Seeing how their presence has caused mass civil unrest and a spike in crime.

Germany can only take fault for bringing them in and now wanting to put them out. Basically at fault for showing kindness to unruly people.

Russia is the real reason behind the surge of refugees to Europe. They are the one's actively causing the problems in the middle easer/ northern africa regions and they are also the ones who will benefit the most from a destabilized EU.

Not Germany, who just so happens to be the backbone of the EU. If Germany left like Britain. The whole organization would collapse. That's how great of an effect the German economy has on the union.

[John Barron]

Not really.

It's Russia who really started it. US and Russia's involvement in the middle east, caused the civil wars in the region. Causing thousands of people to see refuge in Europe to get away.

Russia havs the most to gain from this by destabilizing the EU, the sole entity that is keeping Russia from doing what they want in Europe (to an extent as we see what is going on with Ukraine). Which effectively they have began to do.

Germany only problem was attempting to "do the right thing" and "helping those in need" by allowing the refugees in the country where all of the rest of eastern Europe turned them away. From Turkey to Greece and Italy with everything in-between.

No realizing the mistake. Germany no longer wants them in the country. Seeing how their presence has caused mass civil unrest and a spike in crime.

Germany can only take fault for bringing them in and now wanting to put them out. Basically at fault for showing kindness to unruly people.

Russia is the real reason behind the surge of refugees to Europe. They are the one's actively causing the problems in the middle easer/ northern africa regions and they are also the ones who will benefit the most from a destabilized EU.

Not Germany, who just so happens to be the backbone of the EU. If Germany left like Britain. The whole organization would collapse. That's how great of an effect the German economy has on the union.

this is all so wrong on so many levels. you have to be joking with this. Russia started the civil war in Syria? let me guess Russia was responsible for the destruction of Libya too? LOL

[John Barron]

Russia has a lot to gain from the dismantling of the EU but you are giving them far too much credit for it because you want to whitewash Germany. the attempted overthrowing of assad and killing of gaddafi was a joint pet project of the EU, US, Gulf States, and possibly Israel that backfired catastrophically.

[F l i c k e r]

this is all so wrong on so many levels. you have to be joking with this. Russia started the civil war in Syria? let me guess Russia was responsible for the destruction of Libya too? LOL

No.

Russia has a hand in the events taking place there.
Just like the United States.

They both supply either side and poke the fire.
Russia has the most to gain from a destabilized EU.

1 + 1 = 2

And I understand what you're saying with all parties agreeing to the Qaddafi thing etc.
But what does Germany have to gain by ruining themselves?

Made the mistake of allowing so many unruly refugees in the country? Yes.
But doing so to take over Europe in some way like the original quote I replied to? No way.

[John Barron]

No.

Russia has a hand in the events taking place there.
Just like the United States.

They both supply either side and poke the fire.
Russia has the most to gain from a destabilized EU.

1 + 1 = 2

And I understand what you're saying with all parties agreeing to the Qaddafi thing etc.
But what does Germany have to gain by ruining themselves?

Made the mistake of allowing so many unruly refugees in the country? Yes.
But doing so to take over Europe in some way like the original quote I replied to? No way.

well of course they do. Russia is backing government forces, they were invited to do so, if anything they are helping to stabilize Syria. it's the US, EU, and Gulf States fueling the conflict by arming and funding their proxy groups that end up murdering each other or become ISIS. the Syrian civil war is not a civil war at all.

another point to make is that the vast majority of refugees coming to Europe aren't even from Syria. most are from Afghanistan, Iraq, Pakistan, etc. Russia has nothing to do with any of these countries as far as we know. in fact, most of these countries have been bombed before by the US, EU coalition during the war on terror. and then you have economic migrants from all over Africa taking advantage of the situation.

i don't have a definite answer for merkel's ******ed open-door immigration policy. maybe it was in good faith or maybe it wasn't. i see you're from Germany, perhaps it's your job to question your government. but to make the claim that Germany is relatively blameless in all of this is absurd. Germany is the de facto leader of the EU, and the EU stood to make big financial gains in seeing both Libya and Syria destroyed.

[F l i c k e r]

well of course they do. Russia is backing government forces, they were invited to do so, so if anything they are helping to stabilize Syria. it's the US, EU, and Gulf States fueling the conflict by arming and funding their proxy groups that end up murdering each other or become ISIS. the Syrian civil war is not a civil war at all.

another point to make is that the vast majority of refugees coming to Europe aren't even from Syria. most are from Afghanistan, Iraq, Pakistan, etc. Russia has nothing to do with any of these countries as far as we know. in fact, most of these countries have been bombed before by the US, EU coalition during the war on terror. and then you have economic migrants from all over Africa taking advantage of the situation.

i don't have a definite answer for merkel's ******ed open-door immigration policy. maybe it was in good faith or maybe it wasn't. i see you're from Germany, perhaps it's your job to question your government.

but to make the claim that Germany is blameless in all of this is absurd. Germany is the de facto leader of the EU, and the EU stands to make big financial gains in seeing Libya and Syria destroyed.

I never said Germany was not at fault for anything. I said if they are at fault for something, it is welcoming in the refugees and then (after the incidents the refugees have caused; increases in rape, assaults, etc. so it is fairly justified.) turn them away/ oust them from the country. Which by default, they would flood the surrounding countries. Most likely France, if anything, next.
That is what Germany would be at fault for. This was nothing designed. It just happened.

If anyone is to blame for the refugees, it is the ongoing conflict in the middle east backed by a) United States and b) Russia.
Of the two, only one benefits from a destabilized EU. Which is the only entity that keeps Russia from out-right taking whatever borders they wish (ref. events in Ukraine)
So again, 1 + 1 = 2

You really just have to research it.

[John Barron]

I never said Germany was not at fault for anything. I said if they are at fault for something, it is welcoming in the refugees and then (after the incidents the refugees have caused; increases in rape, assaults, etc. so it is fairly justified.) turn them away/ oust them from the country. Which by default, they would flood the surrounding countries. Most likely France, if anything, next.
That is what Germany would be at fault for. This was nothing designed. It just happened.

If anyone is to blame for the refugees, it is the ongoing conflict in the middle east backed by a) United States and b) Russia.
Of the two, only one benefits from a destabilized EU. Which is the only entity that keeps Russia from out-right taking whatever borders they wish (ref. events in Ukraine)
So again, 1 + 1 = 2

You really just have to research it.

the state propaganda in Germany must be hilarious if you're blaming African hordes flooding your country on Russia.

Germany would also be at fault for enforcing migrant quotas on other EU members.

the conflicts in the Middle East and the refugee crisis were started by the EU and its allies, this is what you're not understanding. again, you are giving Russia way too much credit. it was a plan that massively backfired.

[1bad65]

I said if they are at fault for something, it is welcoming in the refugees and then (after the incidents the refugees have caused; increases in rape, assaults, etc. so it is fairly justified.) turn them away/ oust them from the country. Which by default, they would flood the surrounding countries. Most likely France, if anything, next.

How so? Can't those other countries, like France, simply say 'No' to the refugees?

Of the two, only one benefits from a destabilized EU. Which is the only entity that keeps Russia from out-right taking whatever borders they wish (ref. events in Ukraine)

You're substituting your assumption for fact. You cant say that statement is true.

You really just have to research it.

He has obviously researched this. You're just not accepting his facts because you're putting your opinions over those facts.

[John Barron]

generally speaking, open border politicians are ******ed as hell. we have the same problem here with democrats and the reason why they're so for it these days is to stay in power. pander to immigrants, immigrants will vote democrat for life. perhaps that should give you an idea on what merkel's motives were before the stupidity of her policies became overwhelmingly clear.