Only in Germany..........!!

[Bozo_no no]

RIGHT and if he decides this
THEN ANYTIME he points out a foul or warns or takes a point means the GUY threw and landed a low blow.


So on each of those 3 points Neumann was acting on what he believed to be a violation of that insruction before the first round.

So therefore i am not guessing. YOU are guessing by calling them borderline shots since you don't know where exactly that border is.
My proof is the fact taht the ref
THE ONE WHO DETERMINED This before the bout, CALLED Miranda on what he deemed to be a violation of this.

Without propper warning.

You haven't proved a thing, and your photos are meaningless because you don't know where the line was.

There is no way a warning came with each photo you posted.

Like I told you in the 1st post I made in this thread, your photos prove nothing.

[Novirasputin]

Without propper warning.

You haven't proved a thing, and your photos are meaningless because you don't know where the line was.

There is no way a warning came with each photo you posted.

Like I told you in the 1st post I made in this thread, your photos prove nothing.

I never said there was a warning with each photo posted just that
Neumann didn't pick 3 random "borderline" shots as you suggest and just Screw Miranda as you think.

He let some some of those go
warned for others
and finally RIGHTFULLY took off points.

As i said he did all that because HE BELIEVED that the line YOU ARE talking about was breached. These photos illustrate a valid point, SHOTS TOUCHING UNDER THE NAVEL.

[Novirasputin]

It's black and white.

You quoted the rules from the "Injury (cuts)" section which talks about what is to happen IF the foul causes an injury, which it DID NOT.

Above that section, it clearly says points will be deducted, or a DQ will occur depending on the severity of the foul.

You are wrong, and have been wrong all along. You quoted the wrong section, and are like a child unable to admit he's wrong.

It did NOT call for an automatic 2 point deduction. The call was to be based on the severity of the butt, which everyone agrees was minor.

Give it up already.

The foul was SEVERE
it was INTENTIONAL it was not accidental
and there is implicit injury with each one.

Hence you are incorrect.

[Red_Menace]

I think the complaints about corruption and the referee are a little extreme.

The way I saw it, Abraham wasn't given time to treat his injuries. The ring doctor was putting gauze in his mouth to try to clear up the blood so he could see the extent of the injuries. The action was stopped because the ref wanted the doctor to take a look at him, not to give him extra time. That's pretty standard. It took a while because there was some disagreement about what to do, and how to score the fight if they were going to end it. I thought 2 points for the headbutt was extreme, but apparently it's in the rules. There should have been a deduction though. I don't believe there should be any free passes when you intentionally foul another fighter. I don't believe Abraham should have been allowed to continue, but that's the only part I think was handled badly.

The referee told them to keep the punches up several times. If you're being told your punches are low, that should be enough. I don't think it should be necessary to explicitly say, "next one you lose a point." If you have to say to keep them up repeatedly, then you're asking to lose a point at any time. Anyone that's saying Abraham's belt is high is wrong and should watch again. His belt line ends exactly in line with his navel. Some of Miranda's punches were landing well south and he got warned. He lost a point for landing low and he went right back out and did it again. The first time is not a free pass to do it again. Maybe a bit more strict than other refs, but it's fair. The last point he lost is really irrelevant.

[Novirasputin]

I think the complaints about corruption and the referee are a little extreme.

The way I saw it, Abraham wasn't given time to treat his injuries. The ring doctor was putting gauze in his mouth to try to clear up the blood so he could see the extent of the injuries. The action was stopped because the ref wanted the doctor to take a look at him, not to give him extra time. That's pretty standard. It took a while because there was some disagreement about what to do, and how to score the fight if they were going to end it. I thought 2 points for the headbutt was extreme, but apparently it's in the rules. There should have been a deduction though. I don't believe there should be any free passes when you intentionally foul another fighter. I don't believe Abraham should have been allowed to continue, but that's the only part I think was handled badly.

The referee told them to keep the punches up several times. If you're being told your punches are low, that should be enough. I don't think it should be necessary to explicitly say, "next one you lose a point." If you have to say to keep them up repeatedly, then you're asking to lose a point at any time. Anyone that's saying Abraham's belt is high is wrong and should watch again. His belt line ends exactly in line with his navel. Some of Miranda's punches were landing well south and he got warned. He lost a point for landing low and he went right back out and did it again. The first time is not a free pass to do it again. Maybe a bit more strict than other refs, but it's fair. The last point he lost is really irrelevant.

I saw it exactly the same way but apparently we are both Abraham huggers then.

I am a fan i will admit
but i can agree about excessive holding (although as i said this is Neumann he always had this problem and compared to Nady it benefited both guys.)


I don't agree about the last one being irrelevent because it gave AA a very good break and POSSIBLY cost Miranda the fight.
BUT as people allude to that is his fault.
Even if AA was wearing his shorts to his shoulders and EM barely touched them
if you have a guy hurt, and are down on the cards and need a KO to win, and know he will use the alloted time if you get caught on a LB or a questionable shot
WHY even try to do this? WHY?
Kirk Johnson was shredded in the Ruiz fight because of this exact thing.

a little nothing jab to Ruiz's shorts was the last straw for Joe Cortez
because if you foul like that alot then you are making the ref ITCH to DQ you or penalize you.

Don't give him that chance.

You can be sure HOpkins only punches when the ref can't see and if he were penalized points he would not even risk a shot like that.

[Smokin']

Without propper warning.

You haven't proved a thing, and your photos are meaningless because you don't know where the line was.

There is no way a warning came with each photo you posted.

Like I told you in the 1st post I made in this thread, your photos prove nothing.

What's with you and easy spelling mistakes? "Propper" is spelled proper, Mr.Education.

[Red_Menace]

I saw it exactly the same way but apparently we are both Abraham huggers then.

I am a fan i will admit
but i can agree about excessive holding (although as i said this is Neumann he always had this problem and compared to Nady it benefited both guys.)


I don't agree about the last one being irrelevent because it gave AA a very good break and POSSIBLY cost Miranda the fight.
BUT as people allude to that is his fault.
Even if AA was wearing his shorts to his shoulders and EM barely touched them
if you have a guy hurt, and are down on the cards and need a KO to win, and know he will use the alloted time if you get caught on a LB or a questionable shot
WHY even try to do this? WHY?
Kirk Johnson was shredded in the Ruiz fight because of this exact thing.

a little nothing jab to Ruiz's shorts was the last straw for Joe Cortez
because if you foul like that alot then you are making the ref ITCH to DQ you or penalize you.

Don't give him that chance.

You can be sure HOpkins only punches when the ref can't see and if he were penalized points he would not even risk a shot like that.

Actually, you're right about the last foul. I forgot Abraham took the long break on that one. I haven't gone back to look to see if it was actually a low blow, but Abraham definitely used it to buy himself time to recover.

And I'm not even a "nut hugger." It was the first time I'd watched a full fight from either of them.

[Pantera2000]

Actually, you're right about the last foul. I forgot Abraham took the long break on that one. I haven't gone back to look to see if it was actually a low blow, but Abraham definitely used it to buy himself time to recover.

And I'm not even a "nut hugger." It was the first time I'd watched a full fight from either of them.

The 11th round was right on the beltline. Abraham was about to go down, so it was a good excuse for the ref to give him a 5 min break. Again, until AA looked at the ref and bent over selling it as a low blow, the ref was gonna let the fight continue. Miranda should be allowed to show Neumann what a real low blow feels like!

[Novirasputin]

The 11th round was right on the beltline. Abraham was about to go down, so it was a good excuse for the ref to give him a 5 min break. Again, until AA looked at the ref and bent over selling it as a low blow, the ref was gonna let the fight continue. Miranda should be allowed to show Neumann what a real low blow feels like!

So it was a good excuse and then he was still gonna let the fight continue?

Come on now
as i said if he wanted an excuse he would
a. call the rabbit punc
b. the punch after the bell
c. DQ Miranda for too many fouls (after 3 fouls most fights are DQ)


As far as the shot, i don't believe Miranda threw it intentionally (he isn't ****** you know) but as i saw it on replay it grazed the blue as AA moved back.

The shot was not intentional or that powerful, and yes OF COURSE AA used it to buy time to recover.

Even Miranda or any SMART fighter would do that if they are hurt and trying to survive. There is no shame in it if you are trying to win.

I defy you to show one fighter who in AA's shape would say "yea don't worry about it ref, i wanna keep on fighting."

[bigtime9]

As far as the shot, i don't believe Miranda threw it intentionally (he isn't ****** you know) but as i saw it on replay it grazed the blue as AA moved back.

The shot was not intentional or that powerful, and yes OF COURSE AA used it to buy time to recover.

Even Miranda or any SMART fighter would do that if they are hurt and trying to survive. There is no shame in it if you are trying to win.

I defy you to show one fighter who in AA's shape would say "yea don't worry about it ref, i wanna keep on fighting."

The great armenian champion..running around the ring, hugging, grabbing bleeding all over everyone and anything, and the crooked judges give him the fight because he didn't earn it by fighting. AA talked to much before the fight that's why pantera closed his ****ing mouth

I bet that cheating ass armenian won't take the rematch in the states..i guantee it