Comments Thread For: Canelo Extends His Lead: BoxingScene Competition Index December 2020 Update

[crold1]

Love when arguments are backed up by numbers.

Really nice breakdown by Cliff Roid.

Appreciate it.

[Fire4231]

Hahaha TANK DUCKED LOMA

WILDER DUCKED WLAD

HAHAAHAHAHAHA 😂😂😂😂

It’s okay, now you’ve served ya purpose, come on, back in that cage you orangutan 🦧 😂😂

You know I’m you’re master boy!! Don’t make me get the “Chancla” out. 😂😂😂😂

Nahh that was weak. What else you got Teeth could be cleaner.

[Fire4231]

You think if you write in bold it means more?

Nope... I write it in bold because it annoys you bad teeth. You could peel that brown enamel like a potato and still see coffee.

😂😂😂 arent ya funny. Old crooked teeth like ya pops!!

What you know about dads bro your mother could never keep a man due to her intense gang style whoring.

Dang you’re pops was a funny guy bro!!

Yeah your mom said he was a hoot. He used to call her Bottom Buddy. He used to show up to use the bathroom and use her has a living Bidet. Just kind of worked for both of them and saved us a lot of money on toiletries.

All the lil kids in the street would sorta bully him, for been a crackhead, but man he would do ANYTHING For a dollar.

Lol.. you have no credibility I don’t believe you. What does a guy like you know about a dad? You know your mom couldn’t leave that donkey show gig alone long enough to nab a desperate fellow.

RIP

No that’s just what your mom told you. He is not dead she just doesn’t know who the **** he is. Maybe it’s the Jack @ss?

[Fire4231]

Actually, crold1 has arguably THE BEST method, or close thereto, to help understand which fighters are at the top of the game - and more importantly, WHY, beyond "eye test".

We didn’t need a method. If Cliff Rold was doing his job as a journalist he would be pressuring the promoters he works for to make the fights. Not create fake systems to elect and protect their hosts financial investment.

This one line sums it up:
Wins over unrated opponents were worth nothing.

Here is the one line I like. If everyone fights we will know who the best is. What are the sanctioning bodies doing if we have to use Cliff Rold’s rigged @ss system? If they are not trust worthy why are we too believe Cliff is. Isn’t Boxing designed to settle it in the ring?

So if you spark out some guy that none of the orgs care about, it doesn't make you #1. It doesn't do anything for you. Go beat someone that's on SOME org's Top 10 list, then you get credit based on how you got that win and how highly ranked they were.

This is just an extension of the problem. We wouldn’t need analytics to determine the best if Journalist and sanctioning bodies were just pushing for the fights the fans want to see. They only do so when it benefits the financial sponsor.

That's how you ensure the best strive to fight the best. Which is what it should be. I find it funny you call out "smoke and mirrors" - which describes the very fighters who aren't on the list and why. Because they've fooled you into thinking they're doing something.

Then fight them. Because there is no way to explain why lesser fighters get the fights but these guys who represent the best challenges never get them. What worst is this is despite the huge financial reward it would create. Your rigged system is not working. Let’s just go back to putting the top guys in the ring and letting them figure it out.

The problem (especially around NSB) is that people have a broken understanding of "best". It's not who "looks" like they "might" be, it's who goes out there and PROVES IT. Yep so how does that happen if you are keeping the fights from happening? When you elect the best the excuse becomes they are to dominant to fight mandatories and contenders. How is Cliff’s list helping when Canelo has a Franchise belt to escape tough fights? Stop bro I don’t believe you.

I have zero problems with this list, Cliff, and I love your methodology. It uses facts, data and logic to rate people rather than emotions.

Of course you don’t. It protects your favorite fighters and gives casual fans the false image that they are the proven best.

[Doubledagger]

Jermall and Canelo are the same age.

Look at their resumes and tell me who has had a better career thus far.

Do you honestly think Jermall has a better resume than Canelo?

What does Jermall bring to the table? He has no financial value. If he truly wants to fight Canelo then have him move up to 168 and fight Plant, take his title then be next in line for a September fight.

What did Callum Smith, Liam Smith, Amir Khan, Chavez Jr, and what has Yildrim done to deserve the fight?

The fact that you have to move the goalposts for Charlo but are okay with all of those bums fighting Canelo just goes to show what you and Canelo really think of Charlo.

[Doubledagger]

Charlo fought Derv after GGG and Jacobs

Jacobs is definitely better than Charlo. Thats why Charlo ducked Jacobs...or youre going to dispute that too??

GGG is definitely better than Charlo. Theres a reason Charlo wouldnt call out GGG when he was being gifted decisions against Korobov...

GGG and Jacobs (up until the Rosado fight) never struggled with a C level fighter in Korobov.

Charlos career is beating Julian Williams (win gets worse every day) and Dervenchenko. He also struggled against a shot Trout.

I guess you also think Fury had an "egg sized" weight in his gloves against Wilder and Deontays trainer "poisoned" him. Weird conspiracists. . .

You saying Charlo ducked GGG now? Really?

Okay, maybe that's true, in an alternate dimension where the wbc didn't order GGG to fight an eliminator with Charlo for Canelo's belt and he ran with his tail between his legs.

Jacobs better than Charlo based on ******** what? You're literally sucking this shieet out yo ass with no supporting evidence whatsover. I gave you the evidence, Charlo beat Chenko better than both GGG and Jacobs, and that's a fact.

Your counter argument is that they beat him first? So ******** what? How about GGG having more trouble with Chenko than Jacobs did even though Jacobs fought him first? In case you don't get the significance of that statement, its a direct contradiction to your assertion that beating someone first somehow makes the fighter weaker. Also, GGG didn't even legitimately win that fight. The majority of the boxing world believes he lost and GGG has refused a rematch.

Charlo ducked Jacobs because he is better? Lol, I guess that means GGG and Canelo, by your logic, are ducking Andrade and Charlo because Andrade and Charlo are better than the. Lol, bruh you're such a clown you don't even realise you're arguing against yourself, smh.

Jacobs struggled with Sergio Mora and got dropped by him, and he has a prior KO loss. Nuff said.

Charlo is weak against the slick southpaw style, not to mention he took the Koborov fight on short notice and had to fight him just minutes after his twin suffered his first loss.


But guess what, he is dynamite against the orthodox stance, which is why GGG and Canelo still running, which is also why, despite YOU routing for Derevyanchenko and thinking he would beat Charlo because of the Koborov fight, he got schooled for twelve rounds and got wobbled and hurt every single round.

Canelo and GGG aint slick southpaws, the only guy who can give Charlo that work is Andrade.

See the pattern, Andrade is calling out Charlo repeatedly, but GGG and Canelo are running.

Andrade knows he is Charlo's kryptonite, but GGG and Canelo know he is their kryptonite.

I guess since Jacobs is a switch hitter Charlo is ducking coz he thinks Jacobs will fight him southpaw, still a pathetic duck though, just like Canelo and GGG are pathetic for ducking Charlo and Andrade

[Combat Talk Radio]

Of course you don’t. It protects your favorite fighters and gives casual fans the false image that they are the proven best.

You lost all credibility with this one line:

"these guys who represent the best challenges... "

How can they represent" best" challenges when all you've seen is them sparking C-levels?

That's the flaw in your argument. YOU "think" they "might" be a challenge based on your 'eye test'.

That doesn't fly.

If said fighter(s) wanted to be perceived as threats, they wiu actively pursue Top 10 fighters and accept B-Side pay when necessary.

Instead, they fool fans like you with theatrics against lesser opposition.

Fine, doesn't make you Top 10, damn sure doesn't make you #1.

[Fire4231]

Let’s

You lost all credibility with this one line:

"these guys who represent the best challenges... "

Oh... so you are saying the Mandatory process is not presenting the best challenges? Why is it the sanctioning bodies are sometimes credible and then not credible in citing the best challenges?

It is truly rich, that you know better than them. Thank you Mr. Cliff Rold for a list that can tell us when we should trust the sanctioning bodies and not trust them. It is just what we needed because you claim they are only using the eye test for selection?

And so glad Cliff’s list nearly always falls in line with the promoters and boxing writers he is aligned with. Funny how the mandatory process seems to be working well and expeditiously when it is their favorite guy in line for the title shot?

So are you saying Jermall Charlo didn’t deserve a fight with Canelo at 160? and Benevidez didn’t deserve the fight at 168? So if it’s about the C-Level names on there resume, how does Yildrim get the call? When we measure Callum Smith against the same stick, why him? Is Rocky Fielding even A C-Level fighter himself?

Are you telling me Szeremeta, Derevychenko, Steve Rolls, and Matirosyan had better resumes than Jermall Charlo and Andrade?

You sound brain washed. What old media does is control who has a respectable name and give a credibility boost to preferred fighters and promoters. Then they steal credibility from any fighter/ promoter not favored by them.

Then with that false discredit of the non-preferred promoters competition we now have a reason for their preferred fighter’s protection. There is nothing credible about that process. But the truth is always visible because they have to eventually fight somebody. And those guys never seem to have accolades beyond what their Mandatory presents. Stop bro, fans aren’t ******. It wasn’t the eye test that gave them their mandatory position. But the fans eye test will determine what is tremendous match up. Isn’t that the source of how we drive revenue?

So when certain fighters move into the Mandatory position why does the Old and antiquated media then question their worth? This is clearly fighter protection. So now we should trust that same in pocket media to create a new system that circumvents the Mandatory process? GTFOH

How can they represent" best" challenges when all you've seen is them sparking C-levels?

Because sanctioning body says so. Who you fooling, C-Level competition is subjective and not at all consistent as applied. Derevychenko took GGG to task and was robbed of a decision. However Jermall beat the same Derevychenko easily in his next fight. So why would we not believe Charlo is on GGG’s level? Please explain why GGG should be able to avoid a guy like Charlo?

That's the flaw in your argument. YOU "think" they "might" be a challenge based on your 'eye test'.

No my friend, that is the bias in your position. These are legitimately ranked challenges by the authorities for making that determination. The eye test is what you use to label anyone at a specific promoter C-level. I simply don’t see Derevychenko as C-Level. He wasn’t “C,” Level when he was beating the brakes off GGG. Yet GGG and Canelo are fighting guys with terrible resumes and confirmed losses. Stop bro, you are floundering. This is not making sense.

That doesn't fly. If said fighter(s) wanted to be perceived as threats, they wiu actively pursue Top 10 fighters and accept B-Side pay when necessary.

Who are you talking about specifcially? B Side pay? The only promoters not honoring the A-Side position or working across promotional lines are aligned to Cliff Rold.

And if they control who is considered top 10 some promoters would never get a fight. It isn’t Old Media’s job to tell us who is Top 10. It is is the sanctioning bodies. Cliff Rold and his contemporaries are the reason why boxing is not growing. Because not only are they suppressing the best fights they are keeping the biggest grossing fights from happening. Nothing sells more than polarized boxing matches. But they don’t want them to happen because they are afraid of the outcomes.

There is a not so veiled box out of certain fighters and promoters. It is suffocating boxing revenue. Do they just want control or a successful sport? Looks like they have doubled down on the former. Boxing is in the midst of disrupting itself. You are part of the problem.

Instead, they fool fans like you with theatrics against lesser opposition. We don’t believe you clown. The smoke and mirrors is folks like Cliff Rold giving their own eye test to tell us who is A-Level and who is C-Level. As if we can’t see the same promotional companies talent benefiting? Just make the ****ing fights. Rankings should be base on fight happening and if some one ducks it should count against them.

Fine, doesn't make you Top 10, damn sure doesn't make you #1.

Nope the Sanctioning bodies do. However in your perfect world, you want pocket aligned PR guys like Cliff Rold to tell us who is Top 10 and who is #1. Not happening GTFOH with that bs. This is a sport. You don’t get to isolate fighters. Champions are determined in the ring not through an election. Keep functioning like you do and many of you will find yourself with out any credibility left.

[ShoulderRoll]

A win over Danny Garcia should have a little more value than a win over Jason Moloney.

That's the one flaw in this system. All divisions are treated as if their top 10 are equal but we know that is not the case.

A statistic to reflect that would fix it.

[crold1]

A win over Danny Garcia should have a little more value than a win over Jason Moloney.

That's the one flaw in this system. All divisions are treated as if their top 10 are equal but we know that is not the case.

A statistic to reflect that would fix it.

Get where the relativity could be an issue but the difference isn't ultimately Garcia/Moloney.

It's Carlos Ocampo (and the rating of Brook being lost).