Ward clamping on against Kessler

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  • Boxing_1013
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    #61
    Originally posted by SUBZER0ED
    I'm not butt hurt at all. If Ward was so great, why did he bail after winning his second bout @ LHW against Kovalev? Could it be because he wanted no parts of Oleksandr Gvozdyk or better yet, Artur Beterbiev? You're probably one of those folks who clowned Golovkin for not moving up. But it's ok for Ward to duck the remaining beasts of the LHW division that he moved up to. Conquering one guy at the top the division made him very good. Beating the guys who are as good as or better than that guy would have made him great.
    I would say most boxers, especially those who have some leverage, are selective about who they fight these days...just how it goes...a lot of that is due to promoters, and a lot of those promoters are just trying to protect their investment and help their fighters.

    Ward though, I mean he was very very selective of who/when/where he fought in his career...and he seemed to be more or less the one calling his one shots, rather than any promoter...hence suing Goosen 3 times etc.

    I don't really judge him too much for retiring after Kovalev...now if he came back at some point then yeah I would probably have to judge him a bit for that...seeing as, like you mentioned, there were some real tough young guys at 175 when he left, and I know AB was his mando so that would look like he was playing it safe by retiring.

    When evaluating Ward, I'm not sure how some overlook that he never traveled (to face Bute, Stevenson, Kovalev, Kessler, Froch etc; fought 23 of his 32 fights in California), dropped a belt rather than face Anthony Dirrell (his excuse being that the networks wouldn't be interested, a silly excuse), and that he appeared many times to talk out of both sides of his mouth (winner of Super 6 should face Bute; then 2 fights later, after Ward wins, he says Bute hasn't done enough..like wtf lol).

    He was a tough smart fighter...I always say that about him...but yeah if he was from a different country like Venezuela I don't think anyone would really know who he was...wouldn't have gotten great scorecards, or gotten away with the rough tactics very much...wouldn't have been able to have been as selective with who/where he fought...he would have had a few Ls/DQs and probably would have had to change his style to keep getting fights.

    I think the plan was to make him into the new Mayweather, as far as him making everyone money when he fights, but for whatever reason he never took off like Floyd did.
    Last edited by Boxing_1013; 04-28-2020, 01:04 PM.

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    • MastaBlasta
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      #62
      Originally posted by asgarth
      So, you are saying that he is not a dirty fighter?
      There are 20+ minutes highlight videos of Ward fighting dirty.
      A lot of fighters who fought him are saying that Ward is a good boxer, but also uses a lot of dirty tactics. Might be resentment, but it's not just a single fighter. Kovalev, Froch, Barrera, Rodriguez all made remarks about Wards dirty fighting style.
      Did you ever hear any referee talking about Wladimir Klitschko being a dirty fighter?
      I havent, but Klitschko clearly had an advantage by being allowed to clinch and lean on his opponents whenever they were getting anywhere close to punching range.
      Is there even a referee who straight called someone a dirty fighter?
      Boxing (fighting) is rarely clean. Anything a fighter does that an opponent or fan says gives them an advantage is called dirty (outside of knuckle-forward punches). But it's a fight: they may stand on your feet, elbow you in the mouth/chin/face, d**** massive weight on you, etc, etc. It's not clean punching ... but it's a fight, and people will do all manner of things trying to get you in a compromised position where they can clock you ... that's just part of it.

      That's why the famous immortal words: protect YOURSELF at all times. The ref can't see everything. He WON'T call everything. And things happen fast. Boxers have to come prepared for war, and compose themselves properly. Overall referees do a good job keeping fights clean ... but there will never be a 100% clean fight that's worth watching, Lol.

      Ward, Kov, Wlad, Froch, Floyd, Manny, etc etc ... and many others adjust to the reality and find ways to stay in the fight and win. It's part of what you have to do. Blatant dirty tactics usually get called out. And NO, Ward was not a dirty fighter any more than most.

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      • White Mandela
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        #63
        Originally posted by Froch_uppercut
        Well...and anyone he 'fought' (he didn't actually fight guys, he broke the rules and then retired early after losing to Kovalev.
        Corrupt fighter, corrupt help. Disgusting.

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uDEBCoaR_lU
        Did you put a fiver on Froch and lose your savings?

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        • stealthradon
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          #64
          Originally posted by MastaBlasta
          And NO, Ward was not a dirty fighter any more than most.
          Number of headbutts against Kessler in the Ward fight: 7-8.
          Number of headbutts Kessler has sustained during his entire 49 fight career. Less than 10.

          You do the math.

          Ward was a dirty fighter.

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          • MastaBlasta
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            #65
            Originally posted by therealpugilist
            Only guy in history to go from ages 13 to 33 without and loss and not be considered great in something.....boy this is Rich

            The butthurt is real around here
            LoL Acceptance will lower blood pressure. People be butthurt for decades when they don't like the results. Boxing is great.

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            • MastaBlasta
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              #66
              Originally posted by stealthradon
              Number of headbutts against Kessler in the Ward fight: 7-8.
              Number of headbutts Kessler has sustained during his entire 49 fight career. Less than 10.
              You do the math.
              Ward was a dirty fighter.
              LoL, that's interesting I'll admit (if true). But, if everyone was convinced Ward was gonna use his head like that, wouldn't you prepare and have an answer?

              Ward's style like many others leads to unintended (and maybe some intended) headbutts. No one complained when Maidana did it to Floyd ... called it roughhousing, lol. Same for Duran, BoomBoom Mancini, many others. And so it is.

              If I were gonna fight Ward, I'd have a "style" answer or counter-tactics if I felt he were gonna be using headbutts. That's just me though. Protect YOURSELF the ref says ...
              Last edited by MastaBlasta; 04-29-2020, 12:29 AM.

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              • asgarth
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                #67
                Originally posted by MastaBlasta
                Boxing (fighting) is rarely clean. Anything a fighter does that an opponent or fan says gives them an advantage is called dirty (outside of knuckle-forward punches). But it's a fight: they may stand on your feet, elbow you in the mouth/chin/face, d**** massive weight on you, etc, etc. It's not clean punching ... but it's a fight, and people will do all manner of things trying to get you in a compromised position where they can clock you ... that's just part of it.

                That's why the famous immortal words: protect YOURSELF at all times. The ref can't see everything. He WON'T call everything. And things happen fast. Boxers have to come prepared for war, and compose themselves properly. Overall referees do a good job keeping fights clean ... but there will never be a 100% clean fight that's worth watching, Lol.

                Ward, Kov, Wlad, Froch, Floyd, Manny, etc etc ... and many others adjust to the reality and find ways to stay in the fight and win. It's part of what you have to do. Blatant dirty tactics usually get called out. And NO, Ward was not a dirty fighter any more than most.
                How is Ward not more of a dirty fighter than most though? You won't be able to make 20+ min highlight videos of most boxers being dirty in the ring.

                It's rather objective to say that Ward bends the rules more often than the average boxer.

                Out of curiosity, which fighters do you think are dirty?

                And what fouls were commited in fights like Inoue Vs Donaire or Ramirez Vs Hooker?

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                • therealpugilist
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                  #68
                  Originally posted by MastaBlasta
                  LoL Acceptance will lower blood pressure. People be butthurt for decades when they don't like the results. Boxing is great.
                  these guys really make up what happened in these fights and have delusions......****s unreal

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                  • Apollo7
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                    #69
                    Originally posted by Boxing_1013
                    So no one is allowed to offer dissent on Andre Ward when his name is brought up? This is a boxing forum man lol...and there is literally no current boxing to talk about...what do you expect people to do.

                    Ward and his fan should be happy people are talking about him to be honest...with threads like this his name lives on, and his 3 or 4 fans get to come on here and defend him and try to recruit a few more guys for the fan club.
                    People will do what they want. Same way people will point out how salty and pathetic it looks. The guy just started a hater thread for no apparent reason about a guy who isn't even fighting anymore. Seems like some people are seriously butt-hurt and Ward's living in their heads.

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                    • mlac
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                      #70
                      Someone like Usyk for example does not hold at all....watch any of his recent fights and he does not use any dirty tactics either. So why could Ward never do that?

                      Usyk fought in his opponents back yards time and time again.
                      Why could Ward never do that?

                      The answer is clear fella's. Wards gameplan revolved around constant clinching and other dirty tactics. the reason he would never fight in his opponents back yards is because the reff would not let him get away with it. And the Judges would not score fights to him when he lost...

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