Why do some forget that GGG accepted the Ward fight in 2013?

[Citizen Koba]

Not a fan of excuses, regardless of the factual content.
Either sucks to be him or it serves him right.

He could have been Nelo but nah

If there's factual content, man, most people would describe it as an explanation rather than an excuse.

I guess it just depends whether you're trying to judge the world or understand how it actually works maybe, but use of the word 'excuse' means you already made your mind up.

[Boxing_1013]

[IMG]https://media2.*****.com/media/KFt2DA9T82paOA1Yci/*****.gif[/IMG]

How did you score those fights

[Curt Henning]

I was being facetious, man, your implication was that Ward didn't make the offer because it was his fight of preference, but because he wanted to put GGG in his place. Once again, pure speculation.

Given that Ward was basically given two options - GGG or Kovalev -if he wanted the HBO contract it was a no brainer that he approached GGG first regardless of his feelings, although the way he used it as an opportunity to stick the knife in in was a clever bit of PR.

Ward made the offer to GGG, the smaller guy, and he had ample practical reasons to do so, same as Golovkin did to fight Canelo... the fact that you choose to interpret the two cases differently based on no evidence but your own feelings is kinda exactly what I'm talking about. I mean sure, yeah, if you extend the same cynicism to the motives of all fighters it's one thing... if you say look at Boo Boo or Jermall or the many other fighters who ain't had the breaksand judge 'em the same way as GGG then that's cool, but that ain't what I'm seeing from you.

Anyways, you know me - I ain't in the business of crapping on fighters whether it's Golovkin or anyone else... but I do try to apply the same standards to all fighters, regardless of what promotion or nationality they are... not to make excuses for some and criticise others, or find reasons why two fighters doing the exact same thing should be judged differently.

And whether Ward is greater than Golovkin ain't really anything to do with it. He certainly achieved more and was likely a better fighter. Was that some kinda effort to bruise my ego or something? I ain't that kinda fan, man.

again...you made something up completely out of thin air...."you chose to interpret the two cases differently based on no evidence but your own feelings"

no I DID NOT

i based them off what i heard and saw

golovkin was running his lips..."im looking for good fights...no one will fight me "....."anyone from 154-168"...trying to make fights with chavez and froch at 168....abel saying "168 would be his best weight".......thats not my feelings...those things happened...they were all said

i dont remember canelo begging for fights....i dont remember canelo saying "anyone from 147-160"....i mean maybe he said hed be there one day...when he was ready...but i dont recall canelo begging for fights and saying ill fight anyone at 160..in fact in 2015 he said "155 or no fight"...wasnt till may 2016 he started saying hed fight golovkin at 160

theres evidence...its not just my "feelings"....you just made that up...like most golovkin fans do

[Citizen Koba]

again...you made something up completely out of thin air...."you chose to interpret the two cases differently based on no evidence but your own feelings"

no I DID NOT

i based them off what i heard and saw

golovkin was running his lips..."im looking for good fights...no one will fight me "....."anyone from 154-168"...trying to make fights with chavez and froch at 168....abel saying "168 would be his best weight".......thats not my feelings...those things happened...they were all said

i dont remember canelo begging for fights....i dont remember canelo saying "anyone from 147-160"....i mean maybe he said hed be there one day...when he was ready...but i dont recall canelo begging for fights and saying ill fight anyone at 160..in fact in 2015 he said "155 or no fight"...wasnt till may 2016 he started saying hed fight golovkin at 160

theres evidence...its not just my "feelings"....you just made that up...like most golovkin fans do

The evidence I was asking for was evidence that Ward offered Golovkin the fight before Kovalev specifically to put Golovkin in his place rather for the good practical reasons that it was an easier fight that would likely have earned more money and that it's likely if he went up in weight he wouldn't come back down again.

That's what you asserted. Can you back it up?

You're saying that although both fighters asked for the smaller guy, worth more money and a more natural weight progession for future fights it was less than admirable when Golovkin did it and proof of his unwillingness to take challenges. But when Ward did it, it was perfectly justified because Golovkin had had the temerity to say he'd be willing to fight Ward in the past even though Canelo had also called GGGs name? I gotta say, man, I really ain't seeing what you think is so different about the two situations.

[kafkod]

This video is dated July of 2014. GGG clearly says he’s not ready for Andre Ward! Got any more Narratives???

https://********/G6_IPGpBlYs

I’ve wondered about the context of what he said there. Was he saying the talk about ward was too much for him as in he’s had enough of it? Not today as in he doesn’t want to talk about it? His English not being great doesn’t make it any more clear either.

GGG was talking to reporters to publicize his upcoming fight with Geale and somebody asked him if he had anything to say to Andre Ward, not whether he was ready to fight Andre Ward.

Viewed in that context, his reply is easier to understand.

[stealthradon]

hey, no...stealthradon is too much for me!

(by which I mean something entirely different, apparently)

Since you don't speak English too well either, the actual phrase would be "too good". Not 'too much'.
The idiom "He's too much" means that he's a joker. But instead, you chose to interpret in a way, that literally makes no grammatical sense, and then attribute that hypothetical, and only that, to his sentence. Someone who's not well versed in English.
Either GGG speaks perfect English, or he doesn't. And since "he's too much" isn't perfect English, it must be the opposite.
So in conclusion, you're just too much. Too much ******. And too much dishonest.

[Nay_Sayer]

Bumlovkinites are still in denial. Lol..

[Curt Henning]

Bumlovkinites are still in denial. Lol..

golovkin never does anything wrong! rule number #1 of being a gggroupie "always point the finger at someone else...anyone else"

[Curt Henning]

The evidence I was asking for was evidence that Ward offered Golovkin the fight before Kovalev specifically to put Golovkin in his place rather for the good practical reasons that it was an easier fight that would likely have earned more money and that it's likely if he went up in weight he wouldn't come back down again.

That's what you asserted. Can you back it up?

You're saying that although both fighters asked for the smaller guy, worth more money and a more natural weight progession for future fights it was less than admirable when Golovkin did it and proof of his unwillingness to take challenges. But when Ward did it, it was perfectly justified because Golovkin had had the temerity to say he'd be willing to fight Ward in the past even though Canelo had also called GGGs name? I gotta say, man, I really ain't seeing what you think is so different about the two situations.

how can anyone prove that? of course you cant....i mean...what do i need a written letter? lol...youre asking for something that can be proven

but what i can tell you is that ward was eventually going to move to 175....so it would be easier to get the 168 fight out of the way first and move up...than go up and come back down....is that good enough?

you know ward offered to fight golovkin....thats documented by both parties....and so was team golovkins response

how can i prove that ward wanted to put golovkin in his place? does it matter if thats why? but i can read between the lines....he was more than willing to fight golovkin...golovkin chickened out.....plain and simple

of course you cant see whats different.....because youre a card carrying member of the lil g fan club....a tried and true gggroupie...ive already explained the difference...you refuse to see it

[Citizen Koba]

how can anyone prove that? of course you cant....i mean...what do i need a written letter? lol...youre asking for something that can be proven

but what i can tell you is that ward was eventually going to move to 175....so it would be easier to get the 168 fight out of the way first and move up...than go up and come back down....is that good enough?

you know ward offered to fight golovkin....thats documented by both parties....and so was team golovkins response

how can i prove that ward wanted to put golovkin in his place? does it matter if thats why? but i can read between the lines....he was more than willing to fight golovkin...golovkin chickened out.....plain and simple

of course you cant see whats different.....because youre a card carrying member of the lil g fan club....a tried and true gggroupie...ive already explained the difference...you refuse to see it

Ha ha... card carrying member... what cos I refuse to call GGG a coward and a chicken the exact same way I don't call other fighters juvenile names? I like many, many fighters (including many of the same guys you do) and I've crticised GGG more than I've criticised any other fighter over recent years FWIW, but then I feel I kinda got a right exactly cos I am a fan. When was the last time you acknowledged fault in one of your favourite guys? Now that would be something I'd respect you for.


So yeah. Anyway. Your subjective interpretations aside we're in broad agreement. It definitely made sense for Ward to fight GGG first if he could and it definitely made sense for Golovkin to fight Canelo first if it was in his power. You can talk about cowards and chickens if that's really what you reckon makes things happen the way they do but subjective ish like that doesn't actually have a bearing on the facts on the ground. They attempted to do the same thing so if you're gonna be consistent you gotta judge 'em the same way for that action.

Look man, I believe that Ward would have fought GGG, I believe that Ward was absolutely genuine in his offer... why wouldn't he be? I aklso see no reason to disbelieve Golovkin when he says he was willing to make that fight in 2013 when it would have been by far the biggest fight available to him. Not that Dre was ducking either cos I can equally see how that fight would have been fairly pointless for him, quite aside from his long term shoulder problems and ongoing dispute with Goosen. I think what you seem incapable of grasping is that I ain't trying to point the finger at anyone or say one side's to blame and the other ain't - cos the real world ain't like that - I'm merely trying to understand the situation from as many perspectives as possible.

I think you're so immersed in this idea that it's one side against another or good vs bad or whatever you think, that you're quite incapable of recognising that some of us simply don't see the world - or the sport - in those kindsa terms. All you got is a loada guys - fighters, mangers, promoters - all making the same kind of calculations, risk vs reward, short and long term gains vs potential costs. Every other interpretation of why fights happen or don't is just fanboys playing favourites.

What I don't get is why you're getting folk saying that Golovkin's a coward or whatever for ducking Dre when all he was doing was exactly what Ward attempted to do. You tell me it's different but that there's no proof, that there can't be proof, but that I just can't see it cos I'm a fanboy, which is all well and good, but is entirely meaningless in terms of a convincing logical argument.... I don't suppose you got anything a bit more, well... weighty, than 'me right, you wrong' have you?

Besides in neither case does choosing an easier, more lucrative fight at one moment it time constitute evidence that a dude wouldn't choose a more difficult fight if that was the best option at the time, which is, I beleive roughly where we started out.