Comments Thread For: Ward: Kovalev Not Same Fighter, But He'll Be Hard To Deal With

[P4Pdunny]

Kovs performance was good and clever

[Boxing_1013]

Question...how do you reconcile the fact that several other people, including many on press row and and former fighters SEE these fights differently than you?

In 95% of fights there is only 1 winner. About 5% of the time I think reasonable people can differ about who won. Those are the legitimate 7-5 type fights with quite a few close rounds. I felt the Wilder/Fury fight reasonable people can differ on. People I respect, like Steve Farhood, had it scored for Fury, but I thought the first 6 rounds were even and Wilder won 2 of the last six with the KDs so a draw is how I had it and I feel that was the right score.

I mention all of that because anyone who says they see a dominant performance by a fighter when it is actually very close clearly has an agenda in doing so. You can know boxing but still have a clear bias. Dan Rafael doesn't like Tyson Fury after Fury's comments about ***s a few years ago, and his scorecard in the Fury/Wilder fight was a reflection of that bias. A lot of people in the boxing business have a tribal support for other fighters. For instance black fighters are more likely to favor a black fighter in a fight (see: Danny Jacobs saying Broner beat Mikey Garcia), and the same with mexican fighters and usually the same for white fighters too.

Generally if someone 1) knows boxing; 2) and doesn't have a bias, then I usually find myself agreeing with their scorecards more or less. I like someone like Paulie Malignaggi usually, but he also seems to score more favorably for feather-fisted defensive fighters, because that's what he was. I favor the aggressive fighter who does the most damage, because without the guy bringing the fight, there would be no fight.

Also I think when fights happen, there is usually a consensus afterwards about what the proper result was. In Kov Ward 1 for example, I would say 90% of people commenting felt it was a robbery, even most people who were rooting for Ward seemed to indicate that.

As time goes on people seem to convince themselves that their guy actually did better than they first thought. They find themselves defending 'their guy' in a show of tribal support.

I don't care about the opinions of people on boxing who score fights with a clear bias. If someone knows the sport and doesn't have a bias, most fights have clear winners.

Found this note on BoxRec from the Ward-Bika fight btw, which I assume most Ward fans have not actually watched. This is how I felt when I watched the fight and I think 90% of people who watched the fight live thought it was a very close 50/50 fight when it happened:

'Majority of observers had the Fight a lot close in terms of rounds scored to each fighter than what the judges had'

[Boxing_1013]

Then we have nothing to discuss, do we? Thanks for closing off the conversation because we weren't getting anywhere. I guess when you can't win you might as well lie and cast aspersions. Good luck with that. It might win you a couple of arguments in grade school but that doesn't fly here.

Also, stop telling people what to do. That's about the 3rd or 4th post you've demanded I do something. Doing so just makes you a conceited a$$hole to go along with your conspiracy foolishness. I don't owe you a damn thing.

Lol OK man. It is obvious from reading your initial posts that you never watched the Bika fight and probably never watched the Barrera fight.

[Boxing_1013]

doubt it. the more Kovalev wins the more boost to Ward's legacy. he whooped him FIRST. its in the history books. Ward should be the biggest Kov fan because he benefits from that success.

The problem for Ward and his fans is anyone who watches the first fight will see it was an undeserved robbery win for him. And the second fight he was still getting outboxed before the controversial 8th round.

The Alvarez win over Kov has no asterisk by it. No one can take any shots at Alvarez they have to give him his due there.

If Kov goes on to further great success a lot of people will rightly overlook the Ward fights as hometown decisions. If Kov falters then Ward and his fans can at least try to say that Ward 'destroyed' Kov in those 2 fights. But as we saw in the Alvarez fight, Kov looks as good as he ever has so that narrative is not really there.

So Ward and his fans are stuck a little bit here. They can't make up their minds.

[Boxing_1013]

you are right.

My baad. Floyd at least traveled all around to fight in more parts of the u.s..

Lol I guess you are trolling I can't even tell lol

[Boxing_1013]

i can't believe there's 10+ pages in this thread arguing who really won Ward vs Bika?? must be some grade A ******* being sniffed around here.

I can guarantee you that you didn't actually watch the fight lol.

If you did - how did you score it?

[jmrf4435]

Lol I guess you are trolling I can't even tell lol

American fighters hate leaving momas backyard.

Does that help? Floyd was just as bad as ward.

I feel like especially early in his career Floyd was more willing to fight in random areas o fthe u.S.

[Boxing_1013]

American fighters hate leaving momas backyard.

Does that help? Floyd was just as bad as ward.

I feel like especially early in his career Floyd was more willing to fight in random areas o fthe u.S.

True in his early days Floyd earned his keep for sure

[Ake-Dawg]

In 95% of fights there is only 1 winner. About 5% of the time I think reasonable people can differ about who won. Those are the legitimate 7-5 type fights with quite a few close rounds. I felt the Wilder/Fury fight reasonable people can differ on. People I respect, like Steve Farhood, had it scored for Fury, but I thought the first 6 rounds were even and Wilder won 2 of the last six with the KDs so a draw is how I had it and I feel that was the right score.

I mention all of that because anyone who says they see a dominant performance by a fighter when it is actually very close clearly has an agenda in doing so. You can know boxing but still have a clear bias. Dan Rafael doesn't like Tyson Fury after Fury's comments about ***s a few years ago, and his scorecard in the Fury/Wilder fight was a reflection of that bias. A lot of people in the boxing business have a tribal support for other fighters. For instance black fighters are more likely to favor a black fighter in a fight (see: Danny Jacobs saying Broner beat Mikey Garcia), and the same with mexican fighters and usually the same for white fighters too.

Generally if someone 1) knows boxing; 2) and doesn't have a bias, then I usually find myself agreeing with their scorecards more or less. I like someone like Paulie Malignaggi usually, but he also seems to score more favorably for feather-fisted defensive fighters, because that's what he was. I favor the aggressive fighter who does the most damage, because without the guy bringing the fight, there would be no fight.

Also I think when fights happen, there is usually a consensus afterwards about what the proper result was. In Kov Ward 1 for example, I would say 90% of people commenting felt it was a robbery, even most people who were rooting for Ward seemed to indicate that.

As time goes on people seem to convince themselves that their guy actually did better than they first thought. They find themselves defending 'their guy' in a show of tribal support.

I don't care about the opinions of people on boxing who score fights with a clear bias. If someone knows the sport and doesn't have a bias, most fights have clear winners.

Found this note on BoxRec from the Ward-Bika fight btw, which I assume most Ward fans have not actually watched. This is how I felt when I watched the fight and I think 90% of people who watched the fight live thought it was a very close 50/50 fight when it happened:

'Majority of observers had the Fight a lot close in terms of rounds scored to each fighter than what the judges had'

So you don't reconcile it, you just presume they have a bias? I will tell you what I do, I have my opinion on who won and why, I reconcile that with the actual results. If the results agree, cool, if they don't I ask, were there rounds that were close and if yes, then I acknowledge that others may be partial to different aspects of boxing and scored for the other guy. I then accept the result as official, but reserve the right to tell others that I felt differently than the three judges.

Too many fans don't have enough humility to accept that there is no right or wrong that can be aligned to. Only opinions.

[aboutfkntime]

The problem for Ward and his fans is anyone who watches the first fight will see it was an undeserved robbery win for him. And the second fight he was still getting outboxed before the controversial 8th round.

The Alvarez win over Kov has no asterisk by it. No one can take any shots at Alvarez they have to give him his due there.

If Kov goes on to further great success a lot of people will rightly overlook the Ward fights as hometown decisions. If Kov falters then Ward and his fans can at least try to say that Ward 'destroyed' Kov in those 2 fights. But as we saw in the Alvarez fight, Kov looks as good as he ever has so that narrative is not really there.

So Ward and his fans are stuck a little bit here. They can't make up their minds.

yea

Ward made him look terrible

If Kov goes on to further great success, it will make Ward's win look even better