PRIME Floyd Mayweather vs PRIME Manny Pacquiao, Who would win and how?

[Nash out]

Mayweather UD. As great as Manny was, style wise, he is very predictable, and with Floyd's defence and countering being so good, he'd beat Manny every time.

[Raonic]

Seems very odd to say he didn't want to fight a prime Pac when only one of these fighters signed a contract to fight the other in their prime. And that wasn't Pac.

Again, if Manny Pacquiao decided that he didn't need a whopping 24 days to recover from giving blood, then the fight would have happened. That ends the conversation about whose fault it was that the fight didn't happen in their prime.

I don't know why you're saying that everything was resolved. Nothing was resolved until the fight was made in 2015. The closest they were was in 2010 when Pacquiao ran away over blood testing.

You're going about this the wrong way here. I think the whole "he started it" kid mentality might be holding the conversation from going forward.

I didn't say Manny wasn't afraid to fight Floyd (That could very well be the case why Manny held the fight back for 8 months from late 2009 to late 2010). I said Floyd was afraid of Manny in his prime (as well). Very possible that both guys were afraid to fight one another. At one point, Manny just needed to sign the contract. At another point less than a year later, Manny was waiting for a fair offer from Floyd. Again, goes both ways.

Floyd signing the contract in 2009 but then refusing to sign for the 5 years after doesn't mean he wasn't ever afraid. A lot of the other reasons was started on his side.

I mean if you want to sum it up. Both guys had special demands that weren't the norm, probably because they wanted to take all advantages they could, and it held up the fight. A lot of the reasons happen to just be so lopsided towards 1 side.

[travestyny]

You're going about this the wrong way here. I think the whole "he started it" kid mentality might be holding the conversation from going forward.

I disagree. It's not a kid mentality. What I've been saying from the beginning is something that you wish to completely dismiss for whatever reason. There were negotiations and out of those negotiations came a fight contract that was signed off on by one party. The terms were agreed to by the other party, which is HUGE. Ultimately, the fight didn't happen because the party that didn't sign off, Pacquiao, wanted 24 days to recover from giving less than 2 tbsps of blood. That's why the fight didn't happen in 2010. There were no serious negotiations after that point until 2015 when the fight was finally made.

I didn't say Manny wasn't afraid to fight Floyd (That could very well be the case why Manny held the fight back for 8 months from late 2009 to late 2010). I said Floyd was afraid of Manny in his prime (as well). Very possible that both guys were afraid to fight one another. At one point, Manny just needed to sign the contract. At another point less than a year later, Manny was waiting for a fair offer from Floyd. Again, goes both ways.

How was he waiting for a fair offer when there were never negotiations after 2009/2010 until the fight was made.

Floyd signing the contract in 2009 but then refusing to sign for the 5 years after doesn't mean he wasn't ever afraid. A lot of the other reasons was started on his side.

I'm not sure what you mean. There was never anything to sign after 2010 except the contract that was drawn up in 2015. You're sounding a bit like Bob Arum who kept saying sign the contract when there wasn't one to sign.

I mean if you want to sum it up. Both guys had special demands that weren't the norm, probably because they wanted to take all advantages they could, and it held up the fight. A lot of the reasons happen to just be so lopsided towards 1 side.

What reasons are you referring to. If this bothers you that much, we can go through the reasons that happened and see what deemed to be fair. What you're going to find is a lot of games being played, but nothing being taken seriously. The only time that there were serious negotiations for this fight was twice. Once where Pacquiao ultimately declined over blood testing, and when the fight was actually made.

[Raonic]

I disagree. It's not a kid mentality. What I've been saying from the beginning is something that you wish to completely dismiss for whatever reason. There were negotiations and out of those negotiations came a fight contract that was signed off on by one party. The terms were agreed to by the other party, which is HUGE. Ultimately, the fight didn't happen because the party that didn't sign off, Pacquiao, wanted 24 days to recover from giving less than 2 tbsps of blood. That's why the fight didn't happen in 2010. There were no serious negotiations after that point until 2015 when the fight was finally made.

Lol you'll never find any post I made that dismisses it. I outright acknowledged Manny held up the fight in 2010. But you can't ignore the rest of what happened.

Okay, Manny held up the fight. It took a year but he finally agreed to it. A mature mentality that wants the fight is to look past what happened and look forward from that point on (you can probably try to get compensation via split, etc). Instead, they decided to play games and there was no justification as to why they decided to do that.

In the end, Floyd made ridiculous requests (flat fee, etc) and Manny made ridiculous requests (no drug test, etc) that they both probably knew they would have to compromise on anyway and they chose not to play. They tried to negotiate and they couldn't get it done. Despite the fact that what the body of the contract was in 2009, they agreed to in 2015 with minimal changes.

Of course it is. The fight was held up by Pacquiao in 2010.

Why were they trying to hold up the fight until 2015?

[QUOTE]How was he waiting for a fair offer when there were never negotiations after 2009/2010 until the fight was made.

He agreed to blood testing but then was waiting for a fair offer because Floyd changed it to a flat fee. There wasn't anything that happened between the original offer and Manny accepting the blood testing that would warrant a flat fee.

I'm not sure what you mean. There was never anything to sign after 2010 except the contract that was drawn up in 2015. You're sounding a bit like Bob Arum who kept saying sign the contract when there wasn't one to sign.

What reasons are you referring to. If this bothers you that much, we can go through the reasons that happened and see what deemed to be fair. What you're going to find is a lot of games being played, but nothing being taken seriously. The only time that there were serious negotiations for this fight was twice. Once where Pacquiao ultimately declined over blood testing, and when the fight was actually made.

Exactly. The fight was held up because of Manny in 2010. Once that was dealt with, they decided to play games. If they were serious, why exactly would you play games? Be a man, look past the mistake (try to negotiate it in the contract maybe as compensation) and get the deal done. Instead they constantly tried to swing their ****s by making requests they knew wouldn't have ever happened.

You wanna know why? Probably because they never were interested in fighting to begin with.

Look at what happened. The contract they negotiated in 2009 is more or less the same structure as it was in 2015. Both sides had excuses as to why the fight didn't happen 2011 to 2014 and you couldn't justify a 5 year delay just because a guy didn't accept a term until 2010. Because if you wanted it, you would have accepted the same contract in 2010 that you signed for in 2009 and the same contract you ultimately signed for in 2015.

[travestyny]

Lol you'll never find any post I made that dismisses it. I outright acknowledged Manny held up the fight in 2010. But you can't ignore the rest of what happened.

Okay, Manny held up the fight. It took a year but he finally agreed to it. A mature mentality that wants the fight is to look past what happened and look forward from that point on (you can probably try to get compensation via split, etc). Instead, they decided to play games and there was no justification as to why they decided to do that.

In the end, Floyd made ridiculous requests (flat fee, etc) and Manny made ridiculous requests (no drug test, etc) that they both probably knew they would have to compromise on anyway and they chose not to play.



Why were they trying to hold up the fight until 2015?

How was he waiting for a fair offer when there were never negotiations after 2009/2010 until the fight was made.

He agreed to blood testing but then was waiting for a fair offer because Floyd changed it to a flat fee. There wasn't anything that happened between the original offer and Manny accepting the blood testing that would warrant a flat fee.



Exactly. The fight was held up because of Manny in 2010. Once that was dealt with, they decided to play games. If they were serious, why exactly would you play games? Be a man, look past the mistake (try to negotiate it in the contract maybe as compensation) and get the deal done. Instead they constantly tried to swing their ****s by making requests they knew wouldn't have ever happened.

You wanna know why? Probably because they never were interested in fighting to begin with.

Look at what happened. The contract they negotiated in 2009 is more or less the same structure as it was in 2015. Both sides had excuses as to why the fight didn't happen 2011 to 2014 and you couldn't justify a 5 year delay just because a guy didn't accept a term until 2010. Because if you wanted it, you would have accepted the same contract in 2010 that you signed for in 2009 and the same contract you ultimately signed for in 2015.

I think we are agreeing.

Manny held it up when there was a negotiation. There was no negotiation between both teams after that until the fight was made in 2015.

You guys just need to stop pretending that Bob Arum wasn't the reason this fight didn't happen. After it broke down after the initial negotiation, Arum in no way was trying to make the fight because he wanted to keep milking that cow. It's so obvious that I don't know why you guys try to pretend it isn't. The only time that you can bring up about Mayweather is his flat fee offer?? You mean the one where HE called Pacquiao DIRECTLY BEHIND Arum's BACK to see if he could get Pacquiao to agree to a shady side deal? lol. That wasn't a negotiation, my man. That was Floyd thinking he could get somewhere if he could get Arum out of the way, and I think Floyd found out that Pacquiao aint so stupid when it comes to money.

But again, as far as proper negotiations, there was the initial one where Mayweather signed on that line, and the ultimate one, which was sparked by Mayweather going over to Pacquiao directly at a Miami heat game. Think about that.

[Tarl of Bristol]

In their prime, I think Floyd wins because he's too big for Manny.

Now, if the fight happens and Floyd comes in the shape he was against Conor, Manny would smash him; he's gotten rid of ****roach and is off of spreading love to his neighbor.

If Floyd were to go in to serious training camp, then he might beat Manny but tough Floyd clearly won their first match, it wasn't as lopsided as a lot of people like to state. Manny won 4 rounds and the rounds he won, he did so convincingly. That idiot trainer, ****roach shouldn't have been telling Manny between rounds "you're winning, don't worry" but should've been telling him "amp it up and go after him, you're losing this fight." Not surprised ****roach didn't do the right thing because this is the same trainer that Amir Khan has stated about the advice he's given him is to "drag this out and make it a toe to toe war" in regard all the fights he trained him for. Heck, a guy with Amir hand speed and skill set couple with that glass in his jaw and you're supposed to tell him out box his opponent and move.

The Manny now that has went back to his old ways is superior to the Manny that Floyd fought and it may wind up differently in a rematch.

[QueensburyRules]

--- I see no evidence that you think with anything but your keister.

They agreed to all terms for March fight at MGM that TUE 50-0 reserved, but then he demanded nonstandard drug testing to kill the fight.

Manny kept the date and arum moved to Clottey at Cowboy stadium for a beating of a bigger, stronger fighter than TUE who was so spooked he gave up the date and MGM because Manny was gonna seize all his precious PPVs.

Smartly protected his precious zero that means so much to the preening thugs that keep him propped up with like the upcoming exhibition against that little Japanese Banty. Fled Tokyo in the middle of the night to go squalin' to his daddy to dry his tears. Can he even make that fight and venue?

[Raonic]

I think we are agreeing.

Manny held it up when there was a negotiation. There was no negotiation between both teams after that until the fight was made in 2015.

You guys just need to stop pretending that Bob Arum wasn't the reason this fight didn't happen. After it broke down after the initial negotiation, Arum in no way was trying to make the fight because he wanted to keep milking that cow. It's so obvious that I don't know why you guys try to pretend it isn't. The only time that you can bring up about Mayweather is his flat fee offer?? You mean the one where HE called Pacquiao DIRECTLY BEHIND Arum's BACK to see if he could get Pacquiao to agree to a shady side deal? lol. That wasn't a negotiation, my man. That was Floyd thinking he could get somewhere if he could get Arum out of the way, and I think Floyd found out that Pacquiao aint so stupid when it comes to money.

But again, as far as proper negotiations, there was the initial one where Mayweather signed on that line, and the ultimate one, which was sparked by Mayweather going over to Pacquiao directly at a Miami heat game. Think about that.

Well why weren't there any? There wasn't justification on Floyd's side why you are doing proper negotiation in 2010 but then back off for 4 years. Can't just blame everything on Arum as shady as he is since Arum agreed to the same terms he agreed to in 2015. You can't just ignore that as well.

Floyd clearly wanted it on his terms and clearly didn't care enough of the fight from a legacy standpoint. That's just as much of a reason why the fight was delayed, especially because just like how Manny was always going to agree to drug testing, everything Floyd had a "problem" with in those 5 years before, he ended up agreeing to in 2015 anyway.

Really for him, why fight a prime fighter if it's not on the terms you want? Wasn't exactly the first time he was accused of stuff like that.

[travestyny]

Well why weren't there any? There wasn't justification on Floyd's side why you are doing proper negotiation in 2010 but then back off for 4 years. Can't just blame everything on Arum as shady as he is since Arum agreed to the same terms he agreed to in 2015. You can't just ignore that as well.

Floyd clearly wanted it on his terms and clearly didn't care enough of the fight from a legacy standpoint. That's just as much of a reason why the fight was delayed, especially because just like how Manny was always going to agree to drug testing, everything Floyd had a "problem" with in those 5 years before, he ended up agreeing to in 2015 anyway.

Really for him, why fight a prime fighter if it's not on the terms you want? Wasn't exactly the first time he was accused of stuff like that.

Again, you have to give some specifics for this to be properly hashed out. Immediately after the fight fell through in 2010, then it was some time before Pacquiao decided that 14 days would be ok..and by then, Mayweather had already been calling for no cut-off period. Pac's team was well aware of that.

Then, by the time he agreed to no cut-off date, it became about any and everything else. Needing time to heal for a cut that would magically be better when Floyd was in jail, but when the judge said he could have a fight before jail, it was magically not going to heal again. Or needing to build a huge stadium which we are still waiting for. Or is it about the deadline that Arum put out, when he claimed he couldn't find Mayweather's number.

There was the time Mayweather was calling for Pacquiao again but Arum had put it out there that Pac was more interested in the Marquez fight for a 4th time (I think it was the 4th one). Saying that the Mayweather fight will still be there. Then Pac gets knocked out cold which obviously would mean the fight would need to wait even longer.

Come on, man. It was ridiculous. There was no negotiation because Arum wasn't going to have any further negotiations because he wanted to milk that cow. The Mayweather side seemed to not be sweating it because they knew what Arum was doing. It didn't get anywhere until Mayweather pulled Pac aside at a basketball game.

I don't mind anyone saying it was both teams fault after the initial attempt. Everyone has their own opinion, afterall. But the closest attempt besides in 2015 when it was made, was clearly in 2010 and that's when they were both in their prime. That's when it should have happened. I can only blame Pacquiao's side for that one. It's hard for me to see how anyone can say Floyd was scared and didn't want it when he signed off on that 50/50 contract.

Unless you want to discuss the specifics, we can agree to disagree. It's all old as hell at this point anyway.

[kdd]

Floyd destroyed jmm. Absolutely video gane style destruction. Jmm was at a slower speed, boxing IQ than Floyd and jmm is hall of fame.
Jmm went life and death with Manny.

Dumbest quote of the whole thread .. you don’t know **** about boxing. Style makes fights in boxing.. stick with mma