Comments Thread For: Wilder: I've Been Calling Out Anthony Joshua For Almost 2 Years!

[N/A]

If wilder Joshua is delayed, I personally don't have a problem with that.

I don't either. The fear isn't the fight being delayed, the fear is the fight not happening at all.

AJ & Wilder are the top two fighters on Earth. AJ & Wilder have both been built in the US by SHO. AJ vs. Wilder is the biggest fight possible. AJ vs. Wilder is easy to make since both are with SHO. Wilder desperately wants the fight. If AJ wants to be undisputed champion and prove he's the best, the fight is right there. Nothing is stopping him.

So if instead of taking the biggest fight possible, for the undisputed heavyweight championship of the world, he refuses to fight Wilder and signs an exclusive deal with a rival network, that's about as blatant of a duck that there ever could be.

[Catrin]

Buuuuuummmmmmmmmmm squad!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Sid-Knee]

I know it's not very popular on this site to analyze facts objectively. Which makes sense since it's fans with allegiances to specific fighters.

But if we're being fair, it's obviously ridiculous to claim AJ ducked Wilder several times.

A case could be made that AJ ducked Wilder this March, but it would be a flimsy case at best. I don't think it's ducking to give a fight more time to build as long as you do end up taking the fight. So in my personal opinion, AJ hasn't ducked Wilder yet. Yes, he could have fought him in March, but it made way more business sense to fight Parker first and AJ vs. Wilder is such a bigger fight later this year than it would be now.

This Miller talk though should have everyone nervous that the plan is to duck Wilder. For all of us that want to see AJ vs. Wilder, the biggest fear has always been that HBO would do whatever it takes to block the fight.

Mentioning Miller as an opponent certainly makes it seem like Hearn is leaning towards HBO, even though it'll kill the Wilder fight dead. Which would be a real shame. A real real shame. Everyone knows AJ & Wilder are #1 and #2 on the planet. Everyone who cares about knowing who the best boxer on Earth is wants to see them fight. Delaying the fight for another year would make sense in terms of giving the general public time to find out about the fight and get excited, but it'll be a real shame if Matchroom & HBO go full board and this fight never happens.

The fight can happen even if AJ were to go to HBO. Wilder doesn't have a contract with Showtime.

[Sid-Knee]

First of all we don’t know where the fight will be. Second Wilder talking isn’t negotiatiing anything. You joshua fans are assuming that the fight will be in the U.K.

I'm not. The fight will take place where it makes the most money. That's always been my stance on fights.

[N/A]

The fight can happen even if AJ were to go to HBO. Wilder doesn't have a contract with Showtime.

Haymon is able to operate on a handshake to a ridiculous degree because he conducts business in a way that allows him to operate on a handshake. When your handshake becomes meaningless, and your entire business is built on it, your house of cards can quickly crumble. Look what happened to Top Rank when they screwed SHO and brought Manny back to HBO.

HBO is a deal breaker. Period. End of story. SHO built Wilder and AJ in this market. SHO has made an unbelievable financial commitment to Haymon's stable. Giving him a ridiculous amount of control over the largest boxing budget in this country, if not the world.

Haymon will not stab them in the back and bring Wilder over to HBO to fight AJ. SHO doesn't need Wilder under contract because Haymon has given his word and that is how Haymon operates.

When AJ & Wilder are on the same network and the network is willing to pay the most for the fight, if you turn down the fight to go sign an exclusive TV contract with a rival network, you can't then blame Wilder if he doesn't jump to that network too. HBO would be signing AJ specifically to block that fight from happening.

[Sid-Knee]

Haymon is able to operate on a handshake to a ridiculous degree because he conducts business in a way that allows him to operate on a handshake. When your handshake becomes meaningless, and your entire business is built on it, your house of cards can quickly crumble. Look what happened to Top Rank when they screwed SHO and brought Manny back to HBO.

HBO is a deal breaker. Period. End of story. SHO built Wilder and AJ in this market. SHO has made an unbelievable financial commitment to Haymon's stable. Giving him a ridiculous amount of control over the largest boxing budget in this country, if not the world.

Haymon will not stab them in the back and bring Wilder over to HBO to fight AJ. SHO doesn't need Wilder under contract because Haymon has given his word and that is how Haymon operates.

When AJ & Wilder are on the same network and the network is willing to pay the most for the fight, if you turn down the fight to go sign an exclusive TV contract with a rival network, you can't then blame Wilder if he doesn't jump to that network too. HBO would be signing AJ specifically to block that fight from happening.

If what you say is true, that Showtime are willing to offer the same money as HBO would or more, then I don't see AJ going over to HBO. Not until they've fought Wilder, anyway. If they want to go over after that fight because more money is on the table, then I have no problem with it.

And I think you're being paranoid thinking HBO want to block this fight. They get nothing out of it doing that.

[N/A]

If what you say is true, that Showtime are willing to offer the same money as HBO would or more, then I don't see AJ going over to HBO.

But put yourself in the shoes of Hearn. If you're Hearn, it's not just about getting AJ the best deal, it's about leveraging AJ to get your stable the best deal. We've seen this over and over again. When Showtime signed Tyson out of prison (10 fights, $30 million per fight), Showtime also had to give most if not all of their dates to Don King.

When Haymon brought Mayweather to Showtime, Showtime had to give most if not all of their dates to Haymon.

When you have the straw that stirs the drink, you milk him for all he's worth. So just getting him a big contract isn't the goal, the goal is getting a network to bribe you with other dates to convince him to take their big deal.

For Matchroom USA to succeed, they need dates. Lots of dates. That's how you get fighters. HBO will never outbid SHO for AJ. SHO has the larger budget. Whatever dollar amount HBO offers, SHO will match it or beat it.

But what they can't match or beat is giving Hearn a bunch of TV dates. If HBO is willing to go that far, there's nothing SHO can do to stop it. Unless AJ ends up being the first fighter in history to realize they're being leveraged to secure dates that don't benefit them.

And I think you're being paranoid thinking HBO want to block this fight. They get nothing out of it doing that.

No. I'm not being paranoid. This is how HBO has operated for decades.

SHO crowning an undisputed heavyweight champion of the world would be the ultimate embarrassment to the crumbling facade currently known as HBO boxing. HBO will do everything they can to try to stop it.

And they need content anyway. I'm not even saying it would be a bad idea to tell Kovalev, Andrade and Chocolatito to **** off and jump in bed with Hearn. Nobody HBO works with right now offers them anything that matters other than GB w/ Canelo and K2 w/ GGG. Everybody else is disposable and if HBO has to clear most of their dates for Matchroom in order to get AJ, they will seriously consider it.

[Raggamuffin]

I'm not. The fight will take place where it makes the most money. That's always been my stance on fights.

Well said!

[Kezzer]

HBO would be signing AJ specifically to block that fight from happening.

Clearly that isn't the case. Were HBO to sign AJ its because they want to showcase one of, if not the most,marketable heavyweights of the moment. They have opportunity to pull in significant viewers as a result of it, whether he fights wilder or not. That it "could" block the fight is purely a by-product; that would not make any sense to be their objective.

[N/A]

Clearly that isn't the case. Were HBO to sign AJ its because they want to showcase one of, if not the most,marketable heavyweights of the moment. They have opportunity to pull in significant viewers as a result of it, whether he fights wilder or not. That it "could" block the fight is purely a by-product; that would not make any sense to be their objective.

HBO boxing is hanging on by a thread. At this point it's all about keeping up appearances as the budget continues to get cut. An undisputed heavyweight champion of the world being crowned on Showtime is the ultimate humiliation to HBO boxing.

Espinoza is fighting to become the best boxing network. Nelson is fighting to remain a boxing network at all. Big difference.

Yes, obviously, there is great upside to signing AJ. But let's not get carried away. He's still a British fighter. And if he refuses to fight Wilder, his US popularity will take a major hit.

It's going to take a massive amount of money and a massive amount of dates to get AJ. Money and dates HBO boxing really doesn't have. So to go all in on AJ, to such a ridiculous degree, isn't just about what Aj brings to the table for HBO. It's about preventing something that would make it so clear that SHO is the leader, that you risk higher ups at HBO questioning why they waste their time with boxing in the first place anymore.

Study Seth Abraham's five pillars of HBO boxing and you'll get a better understanding of how seriously HBO takes this kind of stuff. They are a prestige network. Being third banana in the boxing business is a black eye on their brand. This is not just about whatever ratings AJ will do. He is a pawn of a larger game here. He is a symbol of whether HBO represents excellence or not anymore in this sphere. Nelson has to show his bosses SOMETHING, ANYTHING, to justify staying in the game. Landing AJ could be life or death for him, and in the long run, HBO boxing in general.

Hearn knows this and that is why he's going for the jugular.