You Can't Be P4P #1 With Zero Elite Wins...

[Jsmooth9876]

Based on this criteria Errol Spence is #1 P4P. He has the most elite win in boxing, KO over the champ Brook in his hometown.

Brook KO > Russell Jr, inactive Walters, old small Rigo

Wow just when you've thought you've read everything, this fking ******ity just slaps you right in your face

[koolkc107]

I think Bud is suffering a little bit now from what Mayweather suffered his whole career.

He fights an opponent who is supposed to be the one to beat him or at least give him a hard time.

Then, after he totally dominates, that boogeyman turns into a bum.

And yes, Gamboa was elite (and undefeated) when Bud fought him.

Then you have wins over guys like Beltran who gives EVERYONE a hard time...except Terrance.

Lastly, say what you want about Indongo not being elite. But NO ONE in the top 10 P4P has a dominant victory over a guy that did anything close to what Indongo had done prior to meeting Bud. Dude globetrotted his way to two major belts back to back and Crawford made him look like a club fighter.

No, Terrence is P4P #1 and it isn't even close.

As to why I have Spence and Mikey rated over Loma and Rigo, the same reasoning applies.

Don't get me wrong.

When it comes to the eye test, Rigo and Loma are two of the most skilled there are, maybe ever.

But for me, P4P is more than an eye test.

The term was invented not because Sugar Ray Robinson "looked" like the most skilled guy going.

He proved it against other skilled guys. Over and Over again.

The skilled guys that Spence and Mikey dominated are better fighters than the skilled guys Loma and Rigo have beat. That's why they are higher.

One of them- Loma or Rigo- will be place very highly after the fight in December.
With a close fight, perhaps both.

But for now?

Yeah, Spence and Mikey and Thurman and even AJ are higher- they beat better men.

[Combat Talk Radio]

...which is why Golovkin will have to wait til May for a crack at it.

At least Loma is fighting Rigo in December, so a W there makes him legit.

Right now, Bud is top dawg.

Mikey, Errol, Thurman, and AJ round out my top 5.

So what you're saying is, the only eligible candidates would essentially be

Jeff "The Hornet" Horn (beat Manny)

Srisaket Sor Rungvisai aka Minny Pacquiao (beat Chocolatito)

Anthony Joshua (beat Grabomir)


Because nobody else has beat a fighter that should be considered anywhere near "elite" doe.


Don't get me wrong, I'd be perfectly okay calling The Hornet #1 P4P. He's already the #1 Welterweight in the World.

I'd also be okay with Rungvisai since he's the #1 Super Flyweight in the World.

[koolkc107]

So what you're saying is, the only eligible candidates would essentially be

Jeff "The Hornet" Horn (beat Manny)

Srisaket Sor Rungvisai aka Minny Pacquiao (beat Chocolatito)

Anthony Joshua (beat Grabomir)


Because nobody else has beat a fighter that should be considered anywhere near "elite" doe.


Don't get me wrong, I'd be perfectly okay calling The Hornet #1 P4P. He's already the #1 Welterweight in the World.

I'd also be okay with Rungvisai since he's the #1 Super Flyweight in the World.

If we'd seen the best Manny and Horn had dominated, the answer would be yes. Instead, we saw an aged Manny still beat Horn from pillar to post and get robbed by judges. So no, Horn doesn't get on the p4p list and the first time he fights any of the young welters out there he is toast.

Rungvisai would definitely be on my list but I want to see him do it against another top guy. I thought Chocolatito won the first fight and I have no idea if Srisaket is THAT GOOD or Roman just aged that fast which happens at the lower weights more dramatically.

AJ IS on my list and top 5 to boot. The Wlad he beat was as good a version as we've seen the last 5 or 6 years. And that Wlad was definitely a top 10 p4p guy, although I would have him ranked towards the bottom of the 10 even at his peak.

[SweetPbfAli]

If strength of resume is the highest weighing factor, it would be difficult not to put Canelo at the top. However, he had controversial decisions in all of his elite level fights so it leaves some doubt and the same goes for GGG. Crawford's resume is on par with GGG's and only GGG's last 2 fights may have given him a slight edge there. The thing with Crawford is that people seem to think he is going to get better and he unified all the belts at 140, regardless of the opposition in the division and on top of that, he's about to move up to the most competitive division in boxing. For that, i'll give Crawford the #1 spot for the time being.

[Combat Talk Radio]

If we'd seen the best Manny and Horn had dominated, the answer would be yes. Instead, we saw an aged Manny still beat Horn from pillar to post and get robbed by judges. So no, Horn doesn't get on the p4p list and the first time he fights any of the young welters out there he is toast.

Rungvisai would definitely be on my list but I want to see him do it against another top guy. I thought Chocolatito won the first fight and I have no idea if Srisaket is THAT GOOD or Roman just aged that fast which happens at the lower weights more dramatically.

AJ IS on my list and top 5 to boot. The Wlad he beat was as good a version as we've seen the last 5 or 6 years. And that Wlad was definitely a top 10 p4p guy, although I would have him ranked towards the bottom of the 10 even at his peak.

You can't cherry pick bro.

The Grabomir that got beat by Joshua - while he DID show up in good fashion - was a pale shadow of the Grabomir of old, fresh off a decisive loss that made no sense. Grabomir was nowhere near caliber when he fought Joshua, no matter how well he fought.

The Manny that got beat by Jeff "The Hornet" Horn - and yes, he lost to Jeff "The Hornet" Horn - was fresh off a dominant victory over a game, prime Jessie Vargas, prior to that, a dominant victory over a game, prime Tim Bradley.

Reality is, people keep saying Manny's washed up, but it's not like he was coming off a clear loss like Grabomir was.

If anything, Horn's victory over Manny rates higher BECAUSE it was unexpected, versus Joshua where many felt Grabomir was going to sleep no matter what.

Rungvisai won the first fight if people would ignore the fact that a southpaw/orthodox fight WILL end up in headbutts. He wasn't doing it on purpose - it's going to happen. Plus, dropping Choco on his ass early in the fight was no fluke, it was a beautiful shot that made Choco get walked back for the rest of the fight; he felt that power and kept getting caught on the inside.

This is a guy that likely would have went on to beat Acne Back Cuadras had the fight not been stopped; Cuadras was on the run, power depleting, getting increasingly hit on the backfoot. Rungvisai gets better under adversity, shows up to fight EVERY time, trains like a beast, has an iron chin and power in both hands. I'm not 100% sure Estrada beats him.

People are still sleeping on this guy. I've been saying it for months. If the first fight was a robbery or a fluke, explain why nobody was convinced Choco would win the rematch wide or by KO. It's because people are lying to themselves. Go back and watch his fights. He's better than he's being given credit for.

Choco was a good fighter who got beat twice by a superior fighter. That's all there it is to it. Unless your name is Floyd Mayweather or Andre Ward, it happens.

[Lester Tutor]

But your post was the exact opposite of an honesty friend. Why you gotta make stuff up instead of just sticking to the facts?

Actually, to be consistent with you and Redd Foxx, since you are both acknowledging not just the dismissal of a fighters position but also the events or circumstances of a recent fight, then technically with GGG and Alvarez - their Draws - because GGG didn't beat the Lineal Champ nor did Nelo get the straps, that Draw should elevate TC at #1. TC alone is the closest from the top 6 with multiple division wins. Did TC have controversial wins vs the top 6?

I'd put GGG at #2. With Kova's two losses, Nelo should ideally be in front of him.

[Curt Henning]

no self respecting person with healthy self esteem has or ever had golovkin p4p 1 anyway

[koolkc107]

You can't cherry pick bro.

The Grabomir that got beat by Joshua - while he DID show up in good fashion - was a pale shadow of the Grabomir of old, fresh off a decisive loss that made no sense. Grabomir was nowhere near caliber when he fought Joshua, no matter how well he fought.

The Manny that got beat by Jeff "The Hornet" Horn - and yes, he lost to Jeff "The Hornet" Horn - was fresh off a dominant victory over a game, prime Jessie Vargas, prior to that, a dominant victory over a game, prime Tim Bradley.

Reality is, people keep saying Manny's washed up, but it's not like he was coming off a clear loss like Grabomir was.

If anything, Horn's victory over Manny rates higher BECAUSE it was unexpected, versus Joshua where many felt Grabomir was going to sleep no matter what.

Rungvisai won the first fight if people would ignore the fact that a southpaw/orthodox fight WILL end up in headbutts. He wasn't doing it on purpose - it's going to happen. Plus, dropping Choco on his ass early in the fight was no fluke, it was a beautiful shot that made Choco get walked back for the rest of the fight; he felt that power and kept getting caught on the inside.

This is a guy that likely would have went on to beat Acne Back Cuadras had the fight not been stopped; Cuadras was on the run, power depleting, getting increasingly hit on the backfoot. Rungvisai gets better under adversity, shows up to fight EVERY time, trains like a beast, has an iron chin and power in both hands. I'm not 100% sure Estrada beats him.

People are still sleeping on this guy. I've been saying it for months. If the first fight was a robbery or a fluke, explain why nobody was convinced Choco would win the rematch wide or by KO. It's because people are lying to themselves. Go back and watch his fights. He's better than he's being given credit for.

Choco was a good fighter who got beat twice by a superior fighter. That's all there it is to it. Unless your name is Floyd Mayweather or Andre Ward, it happens.

There's a lot I could pick apart here- and even one or two things I could agree with.

But, if you think Wlad was a shell of himself against AJ or that Horn actually won his fight with Pac, we see things so differently that argument is surely not worth the effort.

[Bjl12]

GGG is now the #1 fighter of the world.

What the...? Dude has 2 good wins. One was against a WW and the other is controversial.

And he just LOST to Ca$hnelo. Wtf don't you idiots get??? XD XD XD