Is Canelo vs. GGG even that big of a fight financially?

[Motorcity Cobra]

And the people that bought tickets will likely want to buy them again, even at a higher price. That is what good promotion and an exciting fighter can do.

The gate for a Canelo-Golovkin match would be huge.

Mexican fans are very supportive when they think its a tough, even match up. They didn't support Canelo-Smith to that extent, but they sure as hell supported Chavez jr vs Martinez, and Canelo is a stronger A side than chavez, and Golovkin is a stronger b side than Martinez.

Look, I could be wrong, obviously. There isn't an exact science to all of the stats we are mentioning. But I do think that Canelo-Golovkin can be a very big mainstream type of fight: A little bigger than Canelo-Cotto was, probably a little smaller than Mayweather-Cotto.

You are delusional. Canelo-Smith had a higher gate than Khan-Canelo which was held in Vegas. To give you an idea of how Vegas gates dwarf gates outside of Vegas check this out. GGG's highest gate is 2 mil with 22,000 people. Vargas-Trinidad had 9,000 people in Vegas with a gate of $7.5 mil. Lewis-Rahman had a gate of $7.5 mil with 9,000 people. Even in the UFC their fights outside of Vegas don't come close to generating the gates Vegas gets. For Canelo to do more outside of Vegas than he did in Vegas is amazing. Find another fight outside of Vegas that's doing Vegas numbers. There is a reason GGG doesn't fight in Vegas. You can't sell $10 tickets in Vegas.

[Larry the boss]

honestly i dont give a ****..i wont see a dime from it..

[PK3434]

You are delusional. Canelo-Smith had a higher gate than Khan-Canelo which was held in Vegas. To give you an idea of how Vegas gates dwarf gates outside of Vegas check this out. GGG's highest gate is 2 mil with 22,000 people. Vargas-Trinidad had 9,000 people in Vegas with a gate of $7.5 mil. Lewis-Rahman had a gate of $7.5 mil with 9,000 people. Even in the UFC their fights outside of Vegas don't come close to generating the gates Vegas gets. For Canelo to do more outside of Vegas than he did in Vegas is amazing. Find another fight outside of Vegas that's doing Vegas numbers. There is a reason GGG doesn't fight in Vegas. You can't sell $10 tickets in Vegas.

Nice stats but I think you missed my point.

Canelo-Smith had a very good gate with a stadium with almost unlimited amount of seats. I assume raising the prices in a huge venue like Cowboys Stadium for a Canelo-GGG is the way to go.

You are misunderstanding me. Gennady is a draw with ticket sales on his own as he has proven, but I am in no way calling him a crossover star that is a money machine at the gate and on ppv (although he does better than 99% of other boxers, as far as fighting in profitable events). I just believe a Canelo-GGG fight will be a very easy fight to promote and have a lot of success with.

The Vegas thing is an entirely different issue. Vegas fights are either huge fights for stars (like the fights you mentioned) or fights where neither guy has a reliable fanbase (Kovalev vs Ward and Loma vs Walters). Golovkin hasn't fought in Vegas because he has actually been promoted well, and has cities where fans will support him. The major Vegas fights are in a different category than something like Golovkin vs Rubio obviously.

[sunny31]

PPV $70 ea at 700k = $49 mil. Half goes to the distributor and 7.5% goes to the network. So now you're already at $20 mil. GGG gets his $10 mil and now you're at $10 mil. Subtract undercard purse, canelo purse, advertising costs, etc and you're operating in the negative. But you can add the gate and sponsors so you're probably around $10 mil gate and $3 mil sponsors.

You don't know what you are talking about, here is a few points though: Advertising costs would come ALMOST entirely from the broadcaster, HBO or whoever. That is why they keep half the ppv money, it is to cover advertising, promotion, and the actual cost of the broadcast, whatever is left is their profit.

Undercard will almost always be agreed by the A-side fighter, in this case Canelo because it is ultimately be coming out of his pocket. Even still probably a maximum of $2 maybe $3 million if they go for a quality undercard.

Canelo owns the financials of the event, he will probably have an in-built guarantee - but ultimately they will have a forecast on what the event earnings are likely to be, and then the actuals so Goldenboy and Canelo take the risk TOGETHER. The part we agree on is that there will be about $30 million (give or take) in the pot for the main event fighters in this case.

But lets call it $27 million for argument sake. GGG gets his flat fee of $10 million, and Canelo is left with $17 million. Golden Boy will take their cut whatever that might be, anywhere between 15-25% is normal, Eddie Hearn for example goes 80-20 with his fighters. Lets say 20% for argument sake. That will be $3.4 million, which will be for their time and effort. GGG will pay Todd Loefller a similar amount for his time and after taxes everyone goes home happy and all the richer.

You guys keep going on about shows that lose money, that only happens if a fight absolutely bombs, or the projections don't meet the actuals. You can easily make money on a show which does 250k buys, and lose money on a show that does 3 times that, why? Like every business model it is turnover - costs = profit. If you spend more than you bring in you lose money. This can happen for a few reasons, first you guarantee a fighter too much money, i.e. Floyd Mayweather on his Showtime contract. They needed to come up with a minimum of $30 million for him no matter what, so they weren't taking the risk together, Showtime was taking all the risk. Same with Pacquiao in his last fight with Bradley. Sometimes a promoter will know he is going to lose money on a fight, but he takes a risk on the fighter because it may put him in a stronger position looking at the long term.

Anyway I have spent enough time educating you...Eddie Hearn explains the ppv model better than me. There are small variances in the US but its basically the same, if you have the time and patience and want to know about the boxing model from a financials point of view this is the best interview you will ever see on the subject. PS my brother is a Sports Agent.

[Boxfan83]

honestly i dont give a ****..i wont see a dime from it..

No I feel you on that, Im just saying for this fight to be held up over "assumed" earnings is LUDICROUS (Mike Tyson voice). Canelo being out until May is kinda telling to me that this fight will be over marinated and finances once again will be the excuse from both sides...

[Canelo and GGG]

Its not so big,not worth a risk for Oscar,you can fight BJS and do 400-500k Then fight Lamule or one of bigger 154lbrs and do 400K again easy money.

400-500k are big ppvs if 1 person is holding it

[Motorcity Cobra]

You don't know what you are talking about, here is a few points though: Advertising costs would come ALMOST entirely from the broadcaster, HBO or whoever. That is why they keep half the ppv money, it is to cover advertising, promotion, and the actual cost of the broadcast, whatever is left is their profit.

I stopped reading right there. How many PPV's have you put on? This man has worked in the indrustry for decades and what he says is entirely different from what you're saying:

The promoter serves as the quarterback of the pay-per-view promotion and enters into various commercial arrangements and customarily undertakes what seems like endless promotional, marketing, compliance, administrative and logistical responsibilities.

As with any boxing promotion, the promoter enters into a site agreement with a venue, broadcast license agreements with international networks and cable stations throughout the World, sponsorship agreements, bout agreements with the boxers for their participation in the bout, among a host of other insurance, travel, production and related vendor and consultancy agreements. Of particular note in a pay-per-view event is that the bout agreement for a main event

The promoter and distributor jointly develop a marketing plan to enhance public and media awareness through the (hopeful) creation of a compelling event. They utilize the particular talents and demographic following of the event participants.

Many sponsors prefer to support a pay-per-view event as opposed to a cable televised event because there is customarily a much greater promotional and marketing effort put forward by the promoter, the distribution company and the boxers themselves to “hype” the event. Increased hype and marketing dollars means greater exposure to the public for the sponsor.

http://www.secondsout.com/ringside/the-business-of-boxing/the-abcs-of-pay-per-view

“Jeff Fried is President of Fried & Company, P.C., a Washington, D.C. based law firm that represents a wide variety of sports and entertainment interests, with an emphasis in the area of professional boxing through representation of promoters, managers and select professional boxers.”

So where are you getting false information from?

[daggum]

conservative estimates say it does 500 million dollars. 10 million? hmmm yeah not ducking though

[_Maxi]

I can't see it making 500 millions to be honest. I think it sells between 1 and 1.5 millions if its done at 160 and before the end of 2017.

[sunny31]

I stopped reading right there. How many PPV's have you put on? This man has worked in the indrustry for decades and what he says is entirely different from what you're saying:

The promoter serves as the quarterback of the pay-per-view promotion and enters into various commercial arrangements and customarily undertakes what seems like endless promotional, marketing, compliance, administrative and logistical responsibilities.

As with any boxing promotion, the promoter enters into a site agreement with a venue, broadcast license agreements with international networks and cable stations throughout the World, sponsorship agreements, bout agreements with the boxers for their participation in the bout, among a host of other insurance, travel, production and related vendor and consultancy agreements. Of particular note in a pay-per-view event is that the bout agreement for a main event

The promoter and distributor jointly develop a marketing plan to enhance public and media awareness through the (hopeful) creation of a compelling event. They utilize the particular talents and demographic following of the event participants.

Many sponsors prefer to support a pay-per-view event as opposed to a cable televised event because there is customarily a much greater promotional and marketing effort put forward by the promoter, the distribution company and the boxers themselves to “hype” the event. Increased hype and marketing dollars means greater exposure to the public for the sponsor.

http://www.secondsout.com/ringside/the-business-of-boxing/the-abcs-of-pay-per-view

“Jeff Fried is President of Fried & Company, P.C., a Washington, D.C. based law firm that represents a wide variety of sports and entertainment interests, with an emphasis in the area of professional boxing through representation of promoters, managers and select professional boxers.”

So where are you getting false information from?

No it doesn't at all contradict what I was saying. Just because they push the marketing together doesn't mean it comes from the promoters pocket. It doesn't say that anywhere. There are absolutely cost implications for the promoter but again just to repeat the great MAJORITY of that advertising and marketing cost will come from the broadcaster of the ppv. The promoter will absolutely participate in this process and help devise a plan, that is LITERALLY their job.

Watch the Eddie Hearn interview or live in ignorance, either way I don't really give a shiz.