Comments Thread For: Arum Reflects on Mayweather's IV, Pacquiao Shoulder Shot Scandal

[ADP02]

It's not valid?

It clearly proves that dehydration can have an accumulative effect, does it not? Look at it again.

If the sweat is not rapidly evaporated such as in humid environments, higher sweating will occur to accomplish the cooling effects. Sweat contains a large amount of sodium and chloride (salt). If an athlete is already in a dehydrated state, the sweat concentrations of sodium and chloride are further elevated thereby increasing the body’s salt loss. (1)

Now what does that tell you, genius? Your desperation is annoying. You ready to give up yet?

That's NOT Floyd. He trains at his climatically regulated gym and outdoors in relatively cool DRY evenings/nights of Vegas in March/April, 2015.


In Vegas its not humid and again, Floyd is an admitted night owl who trains later into the night when its much cooler. So its you that is desperate.

All the nails have been placed in Floyd's BS excuses for requiring an IV.

[travestyny]

That's NOT Floyd. He trains at his climatically regulated gym and outdoors in relatively cool DRY evenings/nights of Vegas in March/April, 2015.


In Vegas its not humid and again, Floyd is an admitted night owl who trains later into the night when its much cooler. So its you that is desperate.

All the nails have been placed in Floyd's BS excuses for requiring an IV.

hahahaha. There you go with the "that's not Floyd" shlt again. Speculation much? You must be his lost twin brother and you can feel what he is going through.

Keep highlighting dry. I thought I showed you this part of it:

The implications can be severe if not corrected, particularly in Nevada’s dry climate.

Ready to give up?

[ADP02]

1. So Manny rehydrated 10lbs. And you think he had an issue 2 days after giving blood? That's your argument? He wasn't dehydrated on fight night, so shut the **** up.

That is not my argument. Manny brought up the fact that he was down dehydrating himself and due to that and restricting his food and fluids it affected him when he gave blood.

2. Tell me, do you really believe Manny gave a pint of blood? lmao. This was the most laughable of your assertions. You better take that shlt back.

I didn't say that. I said an athlete who gives 450ml can have their performance impacted up to 4 weeks. That said and given what Manny said about his state, it could have affected him.

I do not know how much Manny gave but I did a similar test back in May where they extracted about 100ml (10 vials) but they were checking for much more things I would think than NSAC requests who would check for things such as HIV, HEP B/C. If I would have had to guess, I would think 2-3 vials of 10ml.

I was training too at the time but took the day off and resumed the next day. I did not notice a difference from what I remember but I have a friend who gets dizzy and faints even when he loses a bit of blood. Kinda scary the first few times you see him do that. Once he was injured and losing some blood and had to bring him to the hospital and tried to keep him awake as he kept losing consciousness. So to say, losing blood affects people differently.

I hear that some people need an IV 10 days later.


The thing is that you fell for it. Blood plasma is restored for them in 24 to 48 hours after donating blood. Way less than 10 days and there is a HUGE difference between <1 tablespoon and 450 ml. So its not possible to have contributed to Floyd's dehydration.
With your response, you killed that excuse of Floyd's if you cannot believe Manny.

3. Once again, just drinking water does not necessarily hydrate you. Are you aware of that or not by now? I can give you some information if you need.

Actually if you are just mildly dehydrated, it does the trick as per the study that I have already posted. Then Floyd can also eat/drink something. Its not like he was doing a marathon where he continued to perspire a lot and lose electrolytes and could never recover from the spiraling affects of the long strenuous activity vs fluid intake. Floyd was doing NOTHING and could have done all sorts of things to alleviate his mild dehydration.

4. The TUE was approved by an independent group of doctors. NSAC stated Floyd did nothing wrong. USADA stated Floyd did nothing wrong. The Independent labs said Floyd did nothing wrong. The independent TUEC said Floyd did nothing wrong. WADA was aware of the issue and was sent the documents and they did not levy any punishment to USADA, meaning the rules were followed. Furthermore, WADA confirmed that an IV can be given to combat dehydration when referencing this very case.

You are left with nothing, don't you agree?

Ready to talk about the good doctor now?

There are cases where the above can be shot right down. UCI has made quite a few deliberate and non-deliberate errors that went against the WADA code. What happened? UCI is still associated with WADA. How come?

UCI:
"The sample is dispatched to a WADA-accredited laboratory."
" Notifies WADA, send WADA copy of documents"
"Has an "inpdendant" ISO approved anti doping ORG which is mandated by .... the UCI.
"Has a TUEC committee, and so on."

Russian scandal had all that too.


So do not give me all that as if that means anything.


Its simple:
Floyd reps continually have paid USADA and got them in the door as far as boxing is concerned and possibly that paved the way for some of the other combat sports.

Floyd got a get out of jail free card with that RETRO TUE. If it was someone else they would have been BUSTED!

[travestyny]

That is not my argument. Manny brought up the fact that he was down dehydrating himself and due to that and restricting his food and fluids it affected him when he gave blood.

I'm happy you are saying this is not your argument. That in itself says enough.

I didn't say that. I said an athlete who gives 450ml can have their performance impacted up to 4 weeks. That said and given what Manny said about his state, it could have affected him.

I do not know how much Manny gave but I did a similar test back in May where they extracted about 100ml (10 vials) but they were checking for much more things I would think than NSAC requests who would check for things such as HIV, HEP B/C. If I would have had to guess, I would think 2-3 vials of 10ml.

I was training too at the time but took the day off and resumed the next day. I did not notice a difference from what I remember but I have a friend who gets dizzy and faints even when he loses a bit of blood. Kinda scary the first few times you see him do that. Once he was injured and losing some blood and had to bring him to the hospital and tried to keep him awake as he kept losing consciousness. So to say, losing blood affects people differently.

I hear that some people need an IV 10 days later.


The thing is that you fell for it. Blood plasma is restored for them in 24 to 48 hours after donating blood. Way less than 10 days and there is a HUGE difference between <1 tablespoon and 450 ml. So its not possible to have contributed to Floyd's dehydration.
With your response, you killed that excuse of Floyd's if you cannot believe Manny.

Dude, give up. Seriously. We both know by now that the things listed can contribute to dehydration. You already stated as much. And the main reason for the dehydration apparently was working out, as it should be with an athlete. This is common sense. Ellerbe gave the drug testing as an "and remember" addition. Come on. Get over it already.

Actually if you are just mildly dehydrated, it does the trick as per the study that I have already posted. Then Floyd can also eat/drink something. Its not like he was doing a marathon where he continued to perspire a lot and lose electrolytes and could never recover from the spiraling affects of the long strenuous activity vs fluid intake. Floyd was doing NOTHING and could have done all sorts of things to alleviate his mild dehydration.

I think you need his medical records to verify. Once again, all the records were sent to the independent TUEC and to WADA. Doesn't seem USADA or Floyd were trying to hide anything.

There are cases where the above can be shot right down. UCI has made quite a few deliberate and non-deliberate errors that went against the WADA code. What happened? UCI is still associated with WADA. How come?

UCI:
"The sample is dispatched to a WADA-accredited laboratory."
" Notifies WADA, send WADA copy of documents"
"Has an "inpdendant" ISO approved anti doping ORG which is mandated by .... the UCI.
"Has a TUEC committee, and so on."

Russian scandal had all that too.


So do not give me all that as if that means anything.


Its simple:
Floyd reps continually have paid USADA and got them in the door as far as boxing is concerned and possibly that paved the way for some of the other combat sports.

Floyd got a get out of jail free card with that RETRO TUE. If it was someone else they would have been BUSTED!

This is full of speculation. You should admit that much. Also, remember that a lab in the Armstrong case reported a failed test, and UCI swept it under the rug. This could not have been a WADA approved lab because any failed test must be sent to WADA immediately. Stop trying to compare Lance with Mayweather. You don't have all the information there.

Now can we please end this? It's really boring now.

[ADP02]

Yawn, Floyd did too after 10 days yet you believed that!!! Its time you wake up! 2 is 8 days less than 10. I think you can figure out the rest.


Plus Manny had those other "contributing" factors that you now are ignoring. Is this "NEW" or "OLD" Travestyny who "contributed" to this post?


I said it already. Manny said that he had to restrict his food and fluid intake because he was just at the limit. After the weigh in, he rehydrated 10lbs. Now we are talking about from 129.5 to 139.5. That is a much higher percentage of dehydration than Floyd who admits to rehydrating to around 149 when he came weighed in at 146.


Just to summarize:
- You believe Floyd who has relatively little change in weight but not Manny who dehydrated his body out about 10lbs. Floyd admits to making weight EASILY while Manny tells you that he had to restrict his food and fluids intake.
- You believe Floyd who gave blood 10 days before but not Manny who gave blood 24 hours prior to the weigh in and 48 hours prior to the fight.
- You are struggling with "contributing factors" when it comes to Manny but you believe Floyd when he said urine, < 1 tablespoon of blood 10 days before and a little bit of training are the "contributing factors" that warrants an IV even though we saw Floyd drinking up throughout the post weigh-in.

Funny stuff. BUSTED!!!

1. When it comes to donating blood and staying hydrated, there is great importance. This is due to the fact that your body’s functions revolve around an enormous number of cellular communications that happen, requiring things like potassium, sodium and chloride. As the day goes on, we lose hydration through sweat and urination. It is essential to replace lost hydration if you want to keep your body operating at its best.

2. Does chronic dehydration exist? Yes. There are various resources out there for you.

The Toll of Chronic Dehydration
As your body gets used to chronic dehydration, you lose your sensitivity to water deprivation and don't get thirsty when you need to.


Answered all of your questions? Now stfu.

I can answer 2+2 and respond with 22 but that does not make it the right answer. That is basically what you just did here.

How did you respond?

You laughed at me for bringing up "donating" blood then you bring it up? What? Was this to show that Manny was right since he said that he had to restrict his fluid intake and food and was dehydrated 10lbs!


urine: Of course we lose fluids thru urine and sweat. What is your point? Please do not come back and say that that is why Floyd mentioned giving urine. That's dumb!

Sweat: Man, I have a huge problem with sweat. When I cycle even in cooler weather, I get sweat in my eyes even if I use different type of headbands. So to say, I know a thing or two about sweat and dehydration.

Anyways, not sure where are you are going with all of this.




Oh back to your "chronic dehydration". What a joke!


Just saw this at another ADO's website

"Medical information to support a TUE application – Intravenous (IV) Infusion"
"NOTE: The use of IV fluid replacement following exercise to correct mild to moderate dehydration is not clinically indicated nor substantiated by the medical literature. "


So Floyd had severe dehydration? BUSTED!



Also saw this:
"What are examples where it would not be reasonable to use an infusion?
Circumstances where the condition was other than acute and/or there was an absence of significant change to the vital signs of the individual.
Examples include the treatment of dehydration without significant signs of
circulatory stress (weight loss is not considered a vital sign alone) or the use
of an IV infusion as a ‘recovery’ tool. It is worth noting that the evidence is that oral rehydration is superior to IV rehydration unless there are circulatory signs of collapse."


Hmmm, so you can stop bringing up your lame "chronic Dehydration"

but more importantly, they bring up "absence of significant change to the vital signs". Floyd's vitals were all normal. BUSTED!


Also read this:
"It goes without saying that any use of an IV infusion immediately prior to a drug test (whether blood or urine) would be considered highly suspicious and should be avoided unless absolutely necessary.It is worth remembering that an inappropriate use of an IV infusion could generate a doping violation charge against the doctor."


Yikes! It doesn't look good for Floyd. Like I said, USADA gave Floyd a get out of jail (violation) for free.... well, USADA did get something in return.



.

[travestyny]

I can answer 2+2 and respond with 22 but that does not make it the right answer. That is basically what you just did here.

How did you respond?

You laughed at me for bringing up "donating" blood then you bring it up? What? Was this to show that Manny was right since he said that he had to restrict his fluid intake and food and was dehydrated 10lbs!


urine: Of course we lose fluids thru urine and sweat. What is your point? Please do not come back and say that that is why Floyd mentioned giving urine. That's dumb!

Sweat: Man, I have a huge problem with sweat. When I cycle even in cooler weather, I get sweat in my eyes even if I use different type of headbands. So to say, I know a thing or two about sweat and dehydration.

Anyways, not sure where are you are going with all of this.




Oh back to your "chronic dehydration". What a joke!


Just saw this at another ADO's website

"Medical information to support a TUE application – Intravenous (IV) Infusion"
"NOTE: The use of IV fluid replacement following exercise to correct mild to moderate dehydration is not clinically indicated nor substantiated by the medical literature. "


So Floyd had severe dehydration? BUSTED!



Also saw this:
"What are examples where it would not be reasonable to use an infusion?
Circumstances where the condition was other than acute and/or there was an absence of significant change to the vital signs of the individual.
Examples include the treatment of dehydration without significant signs of
circulatory stress (weight loss is not considered a vital sign alone) or the use
of an IV infusion as a ‘recovery’ tool. It is worth noting that the evidence is that oral rehydration is superior to IV rehydration unless there are circulatory signs of collapse."


Hmmm, so you can stop bringing up your lame "chronic Dehydration"

but more importantly, they bring up "absence of significant change to the vital signs". Floyd's vitals were all normal. BUSTED!


Also read this:
"It goes without saying that any use of an IV infusion immediately prior to a drug test (whether blood or urine) would be considered highly suspicious and should be avoided unless absolutely necessary.It is worth remembering that an inappropriate use of an IV infusion could generate a doping violation charge against the doctor."


Yikes! It doesn't look good for Floyd. Like I said, USADA gave Floyd a get out of jail (violation) for free.... well, USADA did get something in return.



.

When are you going to give up?

1. You wanted proof that giving blood, urine, and sweating can contribute to dehydration. I gave it to you, right?

2. It's WADA's damn rule about the IV. The WADA spokesperson, when asked about the case of Floyd Mayweather, confirmed that a TUE can be given for an IV to combat dehydration.

How many times do I have to write the same thing? Give the **** up. It's over.

[ADP02]

When are you going to give up?

1. You wanted proof that giving blood, urine, and sweating can contribute to dehydration. I gave it to you, right?

2. It's WADA's damn rule about the IV. The WADA spokesperson, when asked about the case of Floyd Mayweather, confirmed that a TUE can be given for an IV to combat dehydration.

How many times do I have to write the same thing? Give the **** up. It's over.

Its because you do not get it or more than likely, do not want to get it .....

Of course, you lose fluids when you urinate, sweat and blood BUT that is NOT the criteria for getting an IV.

- Urinating. This is dumb to correlate urinating with Floyd's dehydration in that: Was Floyd urinating a lot or couldn't urinate? If urinating too much why was it that he couldn't produce 90ml of urine in a span of 6+ hours without the aid of an IV? Plus urinating usually means you are well hydrated. So no matter how you look at this, no matter how you twist it,
GIVING URINE is NOT a reason for requiring an IV. Floyd would be urinating either way in a cup or in the washroom! Very silly to even bring this up. Thanks for the laugh!

SWEAT: Floyd was not doing extensive exercises at that point in time. Speculating? Nope. Floyd said he was going to relax the last few days prior to the fight and to stay sharp go to the gym and exercise "a little bit" and "and shake out".

BLOOD: I provided you what occurs when you donate 450ml. You replenish your blood plasma within 1 to 2 days. You laughed about 2 days for Manny but Floyd only provided <1 tablespoon of blood 10 days before.
So why are you not laughing at Floyd's BS?


Dehydration can be a reason to use an IV but every site I go to keeps on validating what I say.
- For mild to moderate dehydration you must use the alternative which is in taking fluids orally NOT with an IV. If you want to quickly relieve from dehydration, drink up a lot of fluids.

Even there, every where I go, WADA, NSAC, USADA, studies ALL say the same thing.

All you need to do is drink a couple of cups of fluids per pound of SWEAT, URINE, BLOOD lost. BUSTED!!!!!

The formula is simple unless you do not want to apply it because then you would realize that Floyd was NOT severely dehydrated nor moderately dehydrated and after the weigh in and drinking fluids, I would think that Floyd was very close to FULLY rehydrated but as I said before, there was nothing stopping Floyd from eating and drinking more.

[travestyny]

Its because you do not get it or more than likely, do not want to get it .....

Of course, you lose fluids when you urinate, sweat and blood BUT that is NOT the criteria for getting an IV.

- Urinating. This is dumb to correlate urinating with Floyd's dehydration in that: Was Floyd urinating a lot or couldn't urinate? If urinating too much why was it that he couldn't produce 90ml of urine in a span of 6+ hours without the aid of an IV? Plus urinating usually means you are well hydrated. So no matter how you look at this, no matter how you twist it,
GIVING URINE is NOT a reason for requiring an IV. Floyd would be urinating either way in a cup or in the washroom! Very silly to even bring this up. Thanks for the laugh!

SWEAT: Floyd was not doing extensive exercises at that point in time. Speculating? Nope. Floyd said he was going to relax the last few days prior to the fight and to stay sharp go to the gym and exercise "a little bit" and "and shake out".

BLOOD: I provided you what occurs when you donate 450ml. You replenish your blood plasma within 1 to 2 days. You laughed about 2 days for Manny but Floyd only provided <1 tablespoon of blood 10 days before.
So why are you not laughing at Floyd's BS?


Dehydration can be a reason to use an IV but every site I go to keeps on validating what I say.
- For mild to moderate dehydration you must use the alternative which is in taking fluids orally NOT with an IV. If you want to quickly relieve from dehydration, drink up a lot of fluids.

Even there, every where I go, WADA, NSAC, USADA, studies ALL say the same thing.

All you need to do is drink a couple of cups of fluids per pound of SWEAT, URINE, BLOOD lost. BUSTED!!!!!

The formula is simple unless you do not want to apply it because then you would realize that Floyd was NOT severely dehydrated nor moderately dehydrated and after the weigh in and drinking fluids, I would think that Floyd was very close to FULLY rehydrated but as I said before, there was nothing stopping Floyd from eating and drinking more.

You are being ignorant. Your obsession is ******ed.

1. Urination --You are trying to take Ellerby's statement as if he means that urinating was the main cause of the dehydration. He clearly does not. And whether he could urinate on the day of the weigh-in has nothing to do with the fact that he was required to provide urine for the drug tests. Does urinating lead to any degree of dehydration. Your answer is yes and you even said so, so what the **** is there to discuss?

2. Sweat -- Does sweating cause any degree of dehydration. You answered yes. So what the **** else is there to discuss.

3. Blood -- I'm laughing at your info. about blood because Manny says it was the major reason that he felt weak in the ring, though he rehydrated 10lbs and it was 2 days later. Mayweather wasn't dehydrated in the ring and never stated that giving blood was the major reason for his dehydration. This is just you being desperate trying to cling to anything that was said, but you already agreed with him. Does giving blood lead to any degree of dehydration? Your answer is YES, so what else is there to discuss?

Now since you agree that all three can cause some degree of dehydration, let's move on to what you do not know in this case.

1. First of all, I need you to verify this: Does chronic dehydration exist? Yes or no? The answers is YES and I've provided you with this information. I need you to state that you are aware that it does exist. So, does chronic dehydration exist? Yes or no?

2. Are we aware of when Mayweather first began dealing with dehydration? Yes or no?

3. Do you know when Floyd Mayweather stopped running? In the video you posted, he said he is going to rest his legs, right? Why did his legs need resting if he was just going to take it easy? Again, do you know when Mayweather stopped running? Yes or no?

4. Did NSAC say Floyd did nothing wrong? Did USADA say Floyd followed all the rules? Was WADA aware of this issue? Did WADA have the information regarding the TUE? Did WADA feel a need to move in on USADA?

When you answer these questions, you will find that you have nothing. Case closed. If you want to go on, I'd appreciate it if you answer my questions. Thanks.

[DeadLikeMe]

Manny lost the most important fight of his career with the world watching

[travestyny]

That is not my argument. Manny brought up the fact that he was down dehydrating himself and due to that and restricting his food and fluids it affected him when he gave blood.

Manny rehydrated to 139lbs for the first fight.


Any idea how much he rehydrated for the second fight?