who among suspected PED user got away the most: Pacquaio, Mayweather or Marquez?

[ADP02]

Ok, let me slow this down for you before you hurt yourself. Read very carefully.

1. In Floyd's situation, he was in a match where he swept the first 4 rounds on all three judges scorecards and then complained of his shoulder injury. It was massaged. He turned southpaw. Are you seriously trying to prove that he had no injury. That's a joke and you know it.

2. You are holding on to this claim (that you said was 2 occasions, but magically one occasion has disappeared) that when he was talking about how he injured the arm, he was referring to the same arm that was injured. Ok. I have no problem with you thinking you caught him in some kind of lie. Now, refer to point #1 and realize that you are being idiotic.

3. That Floyd may not have had surgery doesn't help you. We know that Pac was diagnosed with his doctor as having a full thickness rotator cuff tear. Now, refer to my past posts about him NOT doing what Floyd did in the ring to demonstrate his shoulder injury, how his sparring partner said he didn't notice any injury, how I listed (was it at least 12?) sites that said swimming should not be done even 3 months after surgery, how there is video of him swimming, how there is video of him playing basketball, how there is a picture of him with his arm over his head ONE MONTH after surgery, how there is video of him using the right at the time where you claimed he had to spar only left handed, how there is video of him going heavy on the heavybag at the time where you said he had to spar only left handed. Damn, this is getting long. You must feel ****** by now, no? Oh yea, there's more. How HE said that he didn't go to rehab but you said he must have meant his scar was healed (LMAO). How Freddie said he was joking about being healed by GOD, but it doesn't makes sense for Freddie to say the pious Manny jokes about God, how Freddie said he called the rehab specialist in the Phils but admits that he rarely even calls Pacquaio. lol. This is getting really long now. Oh yea, that Manny lied about when the injury first occurred. That Manny said he didn't have an injury before the fight. You know what, my hand is beginning to hurt. I'm going to try to cut this off right here.

4. Never any quotation from Floyd that he had surgery. However, if he did, I posted the protocol for surgery that shows he would have been ready to go, whether you believe his team should have taken that diagnosis for granted or not.

You have nothing, as usual. The mounds of anecdotal, visual, video evidence that I have far trumps the bull**** you try to return fire with. One of us provided solid facts, and one of us talked about his son in a kiddie pool.

1. So Floyd knew before hearing the scores that he was doing enough to convince the judges that he is beating the champ Castillo and the fight was over for you?? Not much happened early on by either fighter. Ledderman and so did others have the scores differently and Castillo was coming on more and more. Plus Floyd realized that Castillo can easily take Floyd's punches so it was going to be a long night .... and it was!!!

You used the your so called evidence against Manny BUT nothing really points to Manny not having surgery. Here Floyd says its one of the worst pain ever experienced yet he does not even remember which arm he had it for? I guess it wasn't much of anything if you cannot remember which arm!!!

2. So now you need 2 videos? How about 3? .... here you have Floyd and his team consistently indicating its the right shoulder that gave him problems over a decade ago. I thought it was supposed to be one of the most painful things ever but I guess he lied, exaggerated.

"The right shoulder .... I've had this injury almost 10 years, even more" What about the left Floyd?



Floyd vs Castillo I - Floyd indicates the right shoulder! lol!



1:00 mark Floyd vs Castillo I - Roger indicates the right shoulder! lol!



3. Manny took time off, sparred left handed only then eventually tried with his right. Manny didn't put all those drugs on the pre-fight form just for show. He used it and that is how he got thru the latter part of his training camp!

What you write about Manny is exactly my point. You talk differently when its about Manny. You said Manny thru still with his right. BUT did you see Floyd?
Mayweather vs Castillo I: Mayweather threw 297 jabs.
Mayweather vs Castillo II: Mayweather threw only 235 jabs.
Mayweather vs Judah: only threw 109 jabs.
Mayweather vs Hatton: Only threw 72 jabs.
Mayweather vs stationary Baldomir: 200 jabs

So Floyd throws more jabs when he is hurt? 297 jabs and complains he couldn't move his arm?



4. Video states he had surgery on his right shoulder :-)
No way would he have been able to announce and get the go-ahead to train at that point in time. Instead he would just be starting his weight training program to strengthen the shoulder.


5. I have nothing? Here is more nothing then lol!!!
"What nobody knows at the time is two days before the fight Mayweather injured his left shoulder while working on the heavy bag. His physician diagnoses a strained rotator cuff and Mayweather keeps quiet about it but speaks disparagingly about Castillo, predicting an easy win. "

A) So even after the injury Floyd thought it was still going to be an easy victory but when he got in the ring and saw that Castillo took Floyd's punches very well and was not going to be a push over as he thought it would be then he got concerned.
B) So the physician diagnosed a strained rotator cuff while Floyd and his team call it a torn rotator cuff.


So like I said before, you say, for Manny its all a lie, an exaggeration and so on. With Floyd you talk differently even though the statements are all there that he lied, exaggerated and so on.

So yes, you are talking differently.


.

[ADP02]

So not only do you have your head so far up Pac's a$$ you can't see straight, but you are also drinking from Arum's kool-aid. Hmm. You should do some research on Bobby Boy. See what you find out.

I gave you Floyd's own statements (QUOTES) yet you deflect with Bob Arum.

[travestyny]

1:00 mark Floyd vs Castillo I - Roger indicates the right shoulder! lol!

Wait wait wait. Hold up right here. I just need to point out your desperation before I even look over all of the other nonsense you wrote.

Are you saying now that Roger indicates Floyd messed up his right shoulder in that video because he says Floyd had a messed up rotator cuff and points to his shoulder???

Thank you for this. This shows how desperate you are.

Actually, this is beyond desperation. Stop embarrassing yourself!

[travestyny]

1. So Floyd knew before hearing the scores that he was doing enough to convince the judges that he is beating the champ Castillo and the fight was over for you?? Not much happened early on by either fighter. Ledderman and so did others have the scores differently and Castillo was coming on more and more. Plus Floyd realized that Castillo can easily take Floyd's punches so it was going to be a long night .... and it was!!!

1. Question: How many of the first 4 rounds did Lederman give to Mayweather?

2. At what point did Mayweather complain of the injury?

3. Are you really trying to argue that Floyd realizing that someone can take his punches led to him faking an injury at that time in the fight?

Not only is this ridiculous, but it's disrespectful to the greatest boxer of our generation. The difference between you and me is you're not a boxing fan. You're a Pacquiao fan and a straight up Mayweather hater. You hate that he beat your idol fair square so you make up a bunch of speculation and disregard any evidence about your idol's cheating ways. You have no credibility what so ever. .

You used the your so called evidence against Manny BUT nothing really points to Manny not having surgery. Here Floyd says its one of the worst pain ever experienced yet he does not even remember which arm he had it for? I guess it wasn't much of anything if you cannot remember which arm!!!

I don't ever recall saying he never had surgery. I don't know if he did, but I do believe he had surgery . The difference between you and me is that I'm not a blind fan boy who believes he had a full thickness rotator cuff tear. Not at all, and tthe evidence proves that clearly. Only you can have photographic, video, testimonial evidence of this fraud and try to justify it. Your desperation is astounding. "He was talking about his scar being healed by the sea water." "When he said swimming in the ocean, he meant water exercises to heal his shoulder." "My son plays in the pool so maybe that's all Manny did." I'm happy we kept this going because it has provided a good laugh, that's for sure.

"The right shoulder .... I've had this injury almost 10 years, even more" What about the left Floyd?

I sent you that video, fool. I also told you it had nothing to do with Castillo. How are you even trying to link the two? More desperation.

Floyd vs Castillo I - Floyd indicates the right shoulder! lol!

Did he say it was his right shoulder? He showed how he threw a punch. Keep reaching. Your desperation is sad.

1:00 mark Floyd vs Castillo I - Roger indicates the right shoulder! lol!

This one really got me. You're officially as bad as Spoon. I can really tell now this Pacquaio loss hurt you deeply. I feel sorry for you.

3. Manny took time off, sparred left handed only then eventually tried with his right. Manny didn't put all those drugs on the pre-fight form just for show. He used it and that is how he got thru the latter part of his training camp!

Are you ready to admit that you were wrong about him sparring against sparring partners with only the left? You never addressed the information I found out about that. I wonder why. If all he had to do was take drugs, why was he sparring WITH ROACH with one hand? He was fine at media day and before media day. I posted the videos to prove it.

What you write about Manny is exactly my point. You talk differently when its about Manny.

Why is it different? One claimed to have a full thickness rotator cuff injury, and half of another tendon torn, and the other never said what kind of tear it was. One complained about the injury during the fight, another didn't. One didn't go to rehab, didn't follow common rehab protocol..etc. etc. Nice job responding to the mound of things I typed out to you. You know you're full of ****.

4. Video states he had surgery on his right shoulder :-)
No way would he have been able to announce and get the go-ahead to train at that point in time. Instead he would just be starting his weight training program to strengthen the shoulder.

IF there was a surgery (which is a big if because there has been no proof that there was one), I provided the evidence that he would be back in time for the fight. Have you provided evidence that Pac could be swimming one month post surgery for a full thickness rotator cuff tear. NOPE!

5. I have nothing? Here is more nothing then lol!!!
"What nobody knows at the time is two days before the fight Mayweather injured his left shoulder while working on the heavy bag. His physician diagnoses a strained rotator cuff and Mayweather keeps quiet about it but speaks disparagingly about Castillo, predicting an easy win. "

His doctor said it was a strained shoulder. What's your point? Is it that he lied and said it was torn? Was there a partial tear? Was it torn enough to require surgery? Was there a surgery? All of this is irrelevant to me because you can clearly see in the video that he claims to have a hurt shoulder DURING the fight. And I'm very happy that Merchant mentioned it because if he didn't, you'd really be calling bull**** whether it were true or not. With Merchant confirming what was going on, all you can do is say he made it up to get out of a fight that he was winning. That's idiocy, and not in his nature. Point blank, period. Believe what you want about Mayweather, but he is no quitter. Add in that he was winning the fight at the point that he let the injury be know, and you seem like a straight moron for even considering he faked the injury.

A) So even after the injury Floyd thought it was still going to be an easy victory but when he got in the ring and saw that Castillo took Floyd's punches very well and was not going to be a push over as he thought it would be then he got concerned.
B) So the physician diagnosed a strained rotator cuff while Floyd and his team call it a torn rotator cuff.

Wait, so now you're saying there really was a shoulder injury? You are all over the place.

So like I said before, you say, for Manny its all a lie, an exaggeration and so on. With Floyd you talk differently even though the statements are all there that he lied, exaggerated and so on.

So yes, you are talking differently.
.

I can't say he exaggerated anything because I've never heard him say anything other than it was a torn rotator cuff. If he said it was a full-thickness tear, I would gladly call bull****. I'm highly doubtful that there was a surgery, but I've never heard him claim there was one. What I do know is what I see in the video of the fight, and he was clearly affected by it. That is A LOT more than we can say about Pacquiao. The evidence is overwhelming, yet you believe it was on the up and up and try to half assed accuse mayweather of faking the injury, but then say he had an injury, but not as bad as he let on. If you think that about Mayweather, what the hell do you think of Pac, because I've seen you say in other places that he truly was one armed since it was a full-thickness tear...yet he was clearly less affected than Mayweather was. What you gotta say about that?

Damn. I'm serious. You are as bad as Spoon man. Now I realize Zorouku was right. This is a waste of time because your super man crush love of Pac makes you an idiot.

[ADP02]

1. How many of the first 4 rounds did Lederman give to Mayweather?

2. At what point did Mayweather complain of the injury?

3. Are you really trying to argue that Floyd realizing that someone can take his punches led to him faking an injury at that time in the fight?

You're a Pacquiao fan and a straight up Mayweather hater.

1. Castillo was traditionally a slow starter and Floyd's punches were not doing much of anything plus the rounds were close non-eventful rounds. Floyd realized that this guy was no push over.

2. Manny went to see a renowned doctor, let USADA know about the meds prescribed by the doctor, NSAC knew BEFORE the fight. Unlike with Floyd, a real doctor stated that Manny went to see him beforehand, prescribed him meds and performed surgery on Manny. Yet that was not enough for you. For Floyd, all you needed was that he said his shoulder was bothering him and that is good enough for you. Starting to get my point?

3. Pretty much what you said about Manny? Your versions are way worse. Are you a hater?

Fair and square? PLEASE!
Floyd used an illegal method which was not warranted. Manny couldn't use a legal substance.
Thanks to Floyd fans letting me know :-), Manny was seriously injured and basically fighting with one arm.
- round 3. How did they give that to Floyd? Manny had to dominate a round to get the round. Floyd coasted and the Vegas judges gave it to Floyd.

Not at all, and tthe evidence proves that clearly. Only you can have photographic, video, testimonial evidence of this fraud and try to justify it. Your desperation is astounding. "He was talking about his scar being healed by the sea water." "When he said swimming in the ocean, he meant water exercises to heal his shoulder."

You had said that only Manny fans can be dumb enough to believe that he was injured. Something like that.
I told you that I cannot know what Manny meant and gave you possibilities. You are sticking with one as if I said that I knew exactly what Manny meant even though I said it again and again, I do not.
My point was that you are not an expert and said many times, I am not either. Neither of us examined Manny nor do you have solid proof from an expert saying Manny was not injured or whatever. You based it on being a bad internet detective and doctor when you viewed a picture, a video and Manny saying he swam which I told you, CAN MEAN ANYTHING!!! Not hard to understand.

Did he say it was his right shoulder? He showed how he threw a punch. Keep reaching. Your desperation is sad.

None of those videos mentions left arm. Floyd and his team keeps on indicating that its the right arm. How bad could it have been then?
This is better than your picture, video throwing with his opposite arm and so on. Floyd describes it in detail except he indicates that it was his right arm. So you are telling me that he remembered everything in detail except the most important part. Which arm he injured!!!

This one really got me. You're officially as bad as Spoon. I can really tell now this Pacquaio loss hurt you deeply. I feel sorry for you.

Yet you kept on blasting about Manny even though you have no idea ... all speculation. I kept on telling you, when you post your thoughts, first think its Floyd. Then your mind would be a lot more creative. You still believe that it was possible to have surgery and soon after announce Floyd's fight in August? Yet you cannot see where you may have it all wrong with Manny? That really got to me! :-)

Are you ready to admit that you were wrong about him sparring against sparring partners with only the left? You never addressed the information I found out about that. I wonder why. If all he had to do was take drugs, why was he sparring WITH ROACH with one hand? He was fine at media day and before media day. I posted the videos to prove it.

Nice deflection as that was not the point. The point was that Manny said he got hurt and it was the same time that we heard Manny took time off from his workouts. One of the speculations was that he got hurt but now we know what he hurt. Then he comes back and uses only his left hand? Renowned doctor backs up the story.
Again, think Floyd. If Floyd told NSAC that he was injured just before the fight, you would have said, Floyd said it EVEN BEFORE THE FREAKING FIGHT!!! What do you not get?

You are still waiting for no-name Floyd's doctor to come out for Floyd's injury, Floyd's extreme dehydration. See the difference?

Why is it different? One claimed to have a full thickness rotator cuff injury, and half of another tendon torn, and the other never said what kind of tear it was. One complained about the injury during the fight, another didn't. One didn't go to rehab, didn't follow common rehab protocol..etc. etc. Nice job responding to the mound of things I typed out to you. You know you're full of ****.

Why is it different?
Physician did not say it was torn but Floyd and Roger said it was. Su****ious?
August 10 date had to be announced soon after surgery. How can Floyd be sure when he should still be doing rehab at that point? Suspciious?
Floyd/Rogers videos keep on saying its the right shoulder but Floyd said the torn rotator cuff to the left was one of the most painful things he has had. Then how do you forget??? Su****ious?

While with Manny, you use only comments that fit your speculation.

Why is what a renowned doctor says not important to you? Other doctors confirm. Still not good enough for you. Floyd's words? Good enough for you except when it makes him look bad. Example, why did he use a prohibited method? Floyd said why but you know that hurts Floyd's case so you need to hear from that no name doctor. Not different?

IF there was a surgery I provided the evidence that he would be back in time for the fight. Have you provided evidence that Pac could be swimming one month post surgery for a full thickness rotator cuff tear. NOPE!

When protecting Floyd's poor performance, Floyd fans said there was and that link that I provided to you says that Floyd did but the funny part is that you have the answer even if Floyd had surgery instead of saying, "yup, that makes no sense since Floyd was still doing rehab"

Swimming: Pac said that but again, you are the one that needs to provide me what Manny did that was impossible. I asked you that but you made it into a joke because you have nothing!!!

When you are in therapy, you can use the same equipment, environment to do your rehab but what you do at month 1 is different than what you do at month 3 and so on.

Different here as well: Manny says swimming and you think Manny was preparing for the Olympics. Floyd indicates right shoulder, you say "but did Floyd say right shoulder?" Well did Manny say what kind of swimming he was doing?

His doctor said it was a strained shoulder. What's your point? Is it that he lied and said it was torn? Was there a partial tear? Was it torn enough to require surgery? Was there a surgery? All of this is irrelevant to me because you can clearly see in the video that he claims to have a hurt shoulder DURING the fight. And I'm very happy that Merchant mentioned it because if he didn't, you'd really be calling bull**** whether it were true or not. With Merchant confirming what was going on, all you can do is say he made it up to get out of a fight that he was winning.

Difference: "You are happy Merchant said it".
Well, what you just wrote is what you posted many times about Manny.
- Manny's S & C confirms that Manny told them after round 4 but what did you say?
- NSAC confirmed that Manny told them BEFORE the fight about the injury. What did you say?
- Meds were on the pre-fight form, what did you say?
- USADA confirms Manny requested if meds were legal for the fight BEFORE the fight. What did you say?
- Manny's doctor confirms there was an injury and surgery and the degree of the injury, what did you say?
Some sparring partners confirms about the injury, what did you say? All had to know? Did Foreman, Jim Lampley, Ledderman have to know about the injury to convince you? Did Merchant really know 100% or just heard it?

You said that Manny most probably had an injury but exaggerated. That is the big hoopla of yours in all of this.

For Floyd, you said if Floyd and Roger said it was torn while physician said it was not, "All of this is irrelevant to me" Why so different?

I can't say he exaggerated anything because I've never heard him say anything other than it was a torn rotator cuff.

We really only have Floyd's own words. Ask Castillo how clear it was. lol!

Floyd and his team says torn, the physician says strained. So yes one can say Floyd exaggerated. Especially since he was ready to discuss August 10 date when he was supposedly doing rehab!
Manny said full thickness rotator cuff .... oh wait, Manny never said that! Still Manny exaggerated you say. Only Manny's doctor said it and you have a problem with his doctor. Who do you think knew best, you or him?


Nice deflections. You need to start realizing that you talk very differently when it comes to Manny vs Floyd. I gave you plenty of examples in this post that you cannot say you did not say and there are a lot more. That is why I called you "new" travestyny, remember? :-)


Finally, why would Manny have to make the injury so severe that he would have no chance to come back to fight Floyd when Floyd I would have fought Manny, due to the big money, instead of Berto as #49? Zero logic!

[Spoon23]

1. So Floyd knew before hearing the scores that he was doing enough to convince the judges that he is beating the champ Castillo and the fight was over for you?? Not much happened early on by either fighter. Ledderman and so did others have the scores differently and Castillo was coming on more and more. Plus Floyd realized that Castillo can easily take Floyd's punches so it was going to be a long night .... and it was!!!

You used the your so called evidence against Manny BUT nothing really points to Manny not having surgery. Here Floyd says its one of the worst pain ever experienced yet he does not even remember which arm he had it for? I guess it wasn't much of anything if you cannot remember which arm!!!

2. So now you need 2 videos? How about 3? .... here you have Floyd and his team consistently indicating its the right shoulder that gave him problems over a decade ago. I thought it was supposed to be one of the most painful things ever but I guess he lied, exaggerated.

"The right shoulder .... I've had this injury almost 10 years, even more" What about the left Floyd?



Floyd vs Castillo I - Floyd indicates the right shoulder! lol!



1:00 mark Floyd vs Castillo I - Roger indicates the right shoulder! lol!



3. Manny took time off, sparred left handed only then eventually tried with his right. Manny didn't put all those drugs on the pre-fight form just for show. He used it and that is how he got thru the latter part of his training camp!

What you write about Manny is exactly my point. You talk differently when its about Manny. You said Manny thru still with his right. BUT did you see Floyd?
Mayweather vs Castillo I: Mayweather threw 297 jabs.
Mayweather vs Castillo II: Mayweather threw only 235 jabs.
Mayweather vs Judah: only threw 109 jabs.
Mayweather vs Hatton: Only threw 72 jabs.
Mayweather vs stationary Baldomir: 200 jabs

So Floyd throws more jabs when he is hurt? 297 jabs and complains he couldn't move his arm?



4. Video states he had surgery on his right shoulder :-)
No way would he have been able to announce and get the go-ahead to train at that point in time. Instead he would just be starting his weight training program to strengthen the shoulder.


5. I have nothing? Here is more nothing then lol!!!
"What nobody knows at the time is two days before the fight Mayweather injured his left shoulder while working on the heavy bag. His physician diagnoses a strained rotator cuff and Mayweather keeps quiet about it but speaks disparagingly about Castillo, predicting an easy win. "

A) So even after the injury Floyd thought it was still going to be an easy victory but when he got in the ring and saw that Castillo took Floyd's punches very well and was not going to be a push over as he thought it would be then he got concerned.
B) So the physician diagnosed a strained rotator cuff while Floyd and his team call it a torn rotator cuff.


So like I said before, you say, for Manny its all a lie, an exaggeration and so on. With Floyd you talk differently even though the statements are all there that he lied, exaggerated and so on.

So yes, you are talking differently.


.

ADP02, trashes TravestNY once again lmao

# poll is still a landslide victory for Froid lmao

[ADP02]

ADP02, trashes TravestNY once again lmao

# poll is still a landslide victory for Froid lmao

and for the piece de la resistance, check out where Manny was when he was waving his flag. LA, California. When? Before the Floyd fight! Not a month after surgery!

http://www.boxingscene.com/forums/sh...3#post16714243

[Spoon23]

and for the piece de la resistance, check out where Manny was when he was waving his flag. LA, California. When? Before the Floyd fight! Not a month after surgery!

http://www.boxingscene.com/forums/sh...3#post16714243

Yeah he got iced in that one. TravestNY down with the count. What's new though. That guy doesn't know he's been beat over and over lmao

[travestyny]

and for the piece de la resistance, check out where Manny was when he was waving his flag. LA, California. When? Before the Floyd fight! Not a month after surgery!

http://www.boxingscene.com/forums/sh...3#post16714243

I think you are right about that. I'm going to admit that I'm wrong there.

This has gone on long enough, so I have a very simple way for us to end this. Let me know what you think.

Let's set up new threads here at boxing scene. You set up one about Floyd's shoulder injury, and I'll set up one about Manny's shoulder injury. We'll add a public poll to both. In these threads, we will reveal all of the evidence that we've gathered on these two situations. We'll let boxingscene decide which one of these injuries seems legit, and which does not. I think that is the only way that this is going to end.

Do you agree?

[ADP02]

I think you are right about that. I'm going to admit that I'm wrong there.

This has gone on long enough, so I have a very simple way for us to end this. Let me know what you think.

Let's set up new threads here at boxing scene. You set up one about Floyd's shoulder injury, and I'll set up one about Manny's shoulder injury. We'll add a public poll to both. In these threads, we will reveal all of the evidence that we've gathered on these two situations. We'll let boxingscene decide which one of these injuries seems legit, and which does not. I think that is the only way that this is going to end.

Do you agree?

Even after I showed you that you were wrong about that picture you are still with Manny's shoulder injury is fake?

- Due to the surgery done, Manny couldn't come back that year to fight Floyd. Manny came back one year after surgery. Travestyny: Its a fake injury.

- Floyd was ready to announce soon after surgery his next fight with Castillo in August 10. Travestyny: Its possible.