What Does It Take To Become Greatest Boxer of All Time ?

[HardSpar]

Beat the best at their best. And yeah the luck side of it is having great fighters around you to fight. If for instance you retire, when a division starts to heat up, then come back when it's cooled down, or behave like a diva to get in ring advantages over the opponent, or blatantly duck fighters and wait fighters out, whilst cheating without allowing them to cheat to make it an even playing field, then you cannot be considered the best.

[benjyyy]

I think for the fighter its about finding their ceiling as a champion. With the greats they took on extraordinary challenges and in some cases failed and others succeeded. I'll give you two examples Ray Leonard fighting Hagler was extraordinary even more so when you consider the circumstances. Sugar Ray Robinson fighting for the light heavyweight title was an extraordinary attempt, in the first case Leonard won and enhanced his legacy greatly, in Ray Robinson's case he lost but the attempt is glorified today because it was a daring attempt to say the least and even in loss enhanced his legacy greatly. In both cases though the said fighters exposed their ceiling, it didn't matter the result per se, but they pushed themselves to a situation where people doubted them and their ability to accomplish the task or even survive it. You can throw Ali-Foreman into this equation.

I think Floyd Mayweather has just fallen short even though I think he has as much talent as any of the aforementioned fighters. I think he has as much physical talent as I've seen, apart from maybe Roy Jones. But he has never tried to find his ceiling for me. I don't think he is built that way, he measures risk vs reward always, its hard to criticise him for that, the only time you can is when he starts to call himself the best ever. At that point you can criticise him, because he has consistently not tried to seek the hardest challenges for best opponents. Also and the most important thing - even though he has had some close fights and a debatable win (Castillo I) he certainly hasn't tried to find his ceiling.

This sums it up perfectly

[ModernTalking]

According to Floyd you use IV and you become the greatest.

[Chrismart]

Some bitterness towards SRR here. Take SRR out of the equation and Floyd still isn't the best. Nothing SRR accomplished has anything to do with Floyd and vice versa.

The guys ahead of Floyd are there because of the risks they took, the fights they took, the fights they won and the manner in which they fought.

If a guy comes along and does the same and is successful with it, he will be considered up there. The new breed of fighters who take a zero loss, careful planning approach will have to do a lot more. The fact there are 4 champions per division doesn't help.

PPV's and popularity should never be a factor in ranking a fighter.

[boxinghead530]

Man you need to have everything lined up perfectly these days to compete for the #1 spot all time. You need the obvious. Talent & motivation. You need right team. Good trainers & handlers early on to get a great amateur career that'll set you up for the greatest pro career of all time. You need the right promotional team & TV channel deal. These days being with the right promotional entity is more important than its ever been. It can put you in play or outta play for those key fights you need. And you need a TV channel deal later on when you start getting big that can help build up your hype & those big fights that'll make you bigger. I think the structure is hard to setup these days. From the structure I think there are a lot of roads that could get a fighter in that number #1 spot. A long reign, multiple titles in multiple divisions, lotsa wins, lotsa KO's, big ratings, big PPV's, etc & so on, but that structure is the key part & is work & a fair amount of luck these days to put together.

?????? Wtf you talking about? Damn you are rambling.

These days it's so hard to be the absolute greatest of all time because the competition is watered down IMO. But if you want an honest shot, all you have to do is fight and beat the absolute best. Don't duck anyone, take on the very best guys at every step of your journey and win and win with longevity. And fight guys in their prime. Don't leave any stone unturned as far as opponents. If you retire you don't want to have a list of opponent you should have fought. And guys you do fight, fight them at their best. So the formula had nothing to do with TV, ratings or number you do. It's about who you fight, when you fought them and don't have any misses/ducks. Fight only the very best each and every time out at every stage of your career.

[New England]

accomplishments and ability thata re greater than that of ray robinson, the best boxer of all time.


robinson had all time great speed, power, and chin. he wasn't all that hard to hit, considering that he's considered the best fighter ever, but he made up for it with one of the best chins ever, and fight stopping power in both hands. he threw combinations, too. 5, 8 shots at once.

he fought in 200 fights. 1400 rounds.

stopped once, in a bid at 175 against an all time great named joey maxim. he actually collapsed from heat exhaustion. the ref had to be replaced midwayy through the fight. i think it was 100 degrees in the arena, and they used to smoke cigars in the crowd


he lost once at WW, against a MW named jake lamotta, an all time great himself. he beat lamotta 5 times in retaliation


at MW and in the 50's, robinson was vulnerable. he had slowed down some from the dozens of fights at WW. he idd, however, win the title 5 separate times, and beat a slew of all of famers along the way.



so, yeah. guys woul dhave to start fighting 200 times again

[New England]

become the greatest WW of all time, a top 3 MW of all time, and then do this for the HW championship of the world





can you imagine floyd mayweather fighting andre ward?

[Mr.MojoRisin']

I think to be the TBE, a fighter has to do what people say is impossible. For SRR, he stopped Jake Lamotta TKO in a very brutal fight. For Muhammad Ali, he Ko'd Foreman and Liston when everyone thought he was going to get knocked tf out.

A fighter has to constantly take risks and be willing to fight anyone at anytime for any amount of money. Today, fighters get paid millions for a fight but still say "the money isn't there". In my opinion, just to get paid hundreds of thousands for a fight is a blessing.

No fighter that is based on how much they get paid will ever be the TBE. It may be prize fighting but the prize is just a bonus.

[VG_Addict]

There is a HUGE difference. Ali fought and defeated 4 olympic gold medalists, as well as having one himself.

Floyd Patterson, Joe Frazier, George Foreman, Leon Spinks.

Floyds opponents have rarely even had a notable amateur background. Not surprisingly, he avoided most of them that did.

Kostya Tszyu - 2 x World Amateur Champion
Erislandy Lara - World Amateur Champion, favorite for olympics, but defected.
Joel Casamayor - Olympic Gold Medalist
Amir Khan - Olympic Silver Medalist

Floyd's fights all look the same, because he fights fighter that fight the same over and over again.

Seriously, when is the last time you saw Floyd in the ring with a legitimately skilled slick boxer? Maybe the Cotto fight? He's done a good job of not hand picking that one's that have been around.

And to say it's because of marketability. That is no longer a valid argument after the selection of Berto. A fight that people that was someone trolling when rumors started to spread.

Who cares if a fighter hasn't fought fighters with amateur backgrounds?

[UNBIASED BOXING]

Don't forget WHEN he fought these people, and out of 200 fights he could only pick 6 legit foes, who weren't near his level to begin with, these guys got famous cuz they BEAT or gave Robinson tough fights, without Robinson nobody would know much about these guys. I don't think any of these people were ever ranked P4P.

You wanna compare names for names, Floyd got Chicinito Hernandez in his 18th fight, Diego Corrales (P4P #5), Castillo, Judah, Baldomir, Dela Hoya, Hatton (undefeated and P4P rated), Marquez (P4P #2), Mosley (P4P #3), Cotto, Guerrero (P4P rated), Canelo (P4P rated), Maidana, Pacquiao (P4P #2).

Different eras, different conditions, comparisons are invalid, both were great in their own eras and that's the best any fighter could do, is to be the absolute best of their era and they were, all time rankings are a joke especially when fighters from the 40s get compared from fighters of today.

Please don't mention Marquez. Marquez moved up two divisions, had his first fight there against Floyd, and had a catchweight that Floyd did not even attempt to make. Seriously. He moved up from Lightweight just to fight Floyd at 144 (again, Floyd didn't even try to make this catch weight).

Mosley was a decent win, but it happened too late. Mosley was already declining...

Canelo was a catch weight fight at 152. Canelo barely makes the 154 margin because he drains himself so hard--- making 152 was horrible for him. Although I still think he lacks, when was he ever P4P rated?

Pacquiao... I'd give him a lot more credit if this was several years ago. I think Floyd would have won, but this fight was a different Pacquiao. The fight should have happened before he got KO'd by Marquez. Plus, 140 or lower would have been a better fight for Pacquiao (although maybe not for Floyd). Or hell, him and Floyd at an even lower weight would have been awesome to see (because we all know Floyd's best weight class was not at welterweight).

ODLH is another fight that happened too late. The end of ODLH's career and decline as a fighter.


Compare this to say, Sugar Ray Leonard, or Ali. There are no wins in Floyd's career that trumps/compare to Sugar Ray Leonard's win over the greatest Welterweight of all-time, Thomas Hearns, or Ali's win over Foreman.