Loeffer explains to everyone what really happened with ward

[doninlouisiana]

I wish they would fight so Golovkin could put an end to all the BS, Ward has fought 2 weight drained fighters in what 3 YEARS? Come on, GGG would blast his ass out in less than 5 rds, even with the running and holding. Ward's claim to fame was long ago in the Super Six where almost all of the fighters involved are done or retired. Ward is not even top 20 now and has one of the smallest fan bases in the sport.

[mathed]

Ward is fighting a beast named Paul Smith tomorrow night. Let him attempt to survive this bloody battle first before speaking of other potential opponents.

[HeroBando]

-Roc Nation signed Miguel Cotto Promotions to a partnership deal, securing them three bouts from Miguel Cotto, but also putting a lot of money in with Cotto's promotional company, which will be focused on concerts/events in Puerto Rico and likely won't get pushed until after Cotto's done fighting. (People hear the rumored '$50m for three fights' and lose their heads).

-Not even rumors have been put forward for what Ward's contract with Roc Nation looks like (Settling the GoossenTutor deal with them being more than happy with the outcome likely ate into whatever the package for Ward ended up being). Beyond that, Andre Ward is only 31 and with minimal wear on his body (under 150 amateur fights, nearly three years out of the ring as a pro [adding up the promotional dispute layoff and his injury breaks], and is physically dedicated to boxing), Ward can easily end up with 10 fights before he turns 36.

Without any idea of how either deal is actually structured, how can you flatly say that either deal is a guaranteed money loser?

How is a, let's assume, 10-fight deal with Andre Ward a guaranteed money loser even at $50m (If Ward can get through two fights this year, he'd head into 2016 as the p4p best fighter in the sport, a winnable fight against Golovkin in the que, and being the type of clean-cut and marketable guy that the sport is likely to turn to with Floyd riding off into the sunset. Ward does what most people expect him to do against HBO's boogeyman and, as long as he stays active, he likely emerges as a bankable star with 7-8 fights still waiting on the deal)? $5m per Ward fight (TV money, live gate/site fee, event sponsorship) isn't all that ridiculous an idea when you think about it.

Even the Cotto deal deserves another look; the concert details will likely cover a significant amount of that money, but Roc Nation still has three fights with the sport's third/fourth biggest star to leverage and establish their company as a boxing powerhouse (having Cotto as their trump card puts HBO and every fighter/promoter not with PBC over a barrell; if Cotto is somehow able to actually beat Canelo, Roc Nation is holding HBO up for ransom).

Nothing's a sure thing, but Roc Nation is taking the calculated risk in those situations.

Why is K2 doing different? Golovkin needs a big fight to finally get that chance to become a true star; what better way to do that then knocking off the second best p4p fighter on the planet? K2 may lose some money on the fight (HBO putting up a good amount of money for the US rights, K2 selling the fight internationally, and a Golovkin-sized take on the live gate are all decent-sized revenue streams), but they have the chance to emerge with a true PPV attraction on the deal.

Why does every promoter but Roc Nation have to make guaranteed money on every fight card? Makes no damn sense.

K2 hasnt put any money into GGG. Not long ago he headlined HBO for 400k. K2 bid 7m for stadium selling Wlad defense against #1 contender, undefeated Povetkin. Fight ended up in Russia, at war with Wlad's Ukraine. 7m might not even be enough for Ward GGG. Ridiculous all around. Only Roc Nation might do something like that, though not in this case, it appears.

And no way GGG is PPV if he beats Ward, it just doesn't work like that. Did Tarver go PPV for KOing the much better known, much more proven RJJ?

[Scipio2009]

Prior to Ward/Kessler, Kessler had been on primetime premium more times than Ward, with his fights vs Calzaghe and Andrade. Ward was a Shobox/ESPN fighter at that point. His Showtime debut was Shelby Pudwill as co-feature with Kessler/Perdomo. The S6 concept was actually brought to Showtime by Sauerland, Kessler's promoter. The fact remains, Ward has no problem with other guys coming to his hometown. And regardless of the fact that Andre one-sided Froch 3.5 years ago, Froch is still the clear bread winner with Ward having no other lucrative options. The differences between Nottingham & London are trite.

So Ward, having already defeated the "clear breadwinner" in dominant fashion, is supposed to travel to Froch's literal hometown for the rematch, for what seemingly sounds like short money. lol

Because Froch isn't going to sit for a 75/25 split of the take (which is what I'd imagine Froch would get as the challenger for a mandatory fight). I doubt that Froch would even go for giving Ward 60/40.

you give folks enough rope and they hang themselves.

[i'm a fun haver]

So Ward, having already defeated the "clear breadwinner" in dominant fashion, is supposed to travel to Froch's literal hometown for the rematch, for what seemingly sounds like short money. lol

Because Froch isn't going to sit for a 75/25 split of the take (which is what I'd imagine Froch would get as the challenger for a mandatory fight). I doubt that Froch would even go for giving Ward 60/40.

you give folks enough rope and they hang themselves.

Yes, if Ward wants that fight. That's what he has to do.
Why is Ward chasing a rematch against a guy he already beat?

[Barcham]

I saw this quoted and just had to respond to it...

How is a, let's assume, 10-fight deal with Andre Ward a guaranteed money loser even at $50m (If Ward can get through two fights this year, he'd head into 2016 as the p4p best fighter in the sport, a winnable fight against Golovkin in the que, and being the type of clean-cut and marketable guy that the sport is likely to turn to with Floyd riding off into the sunset. Ward does what most people expect him to do against HBO's boogeyman and, as long as he stays active, he likely emerges as a bankable star with 7-8 fights still waiting on the deal)? $5m per Ward fight (TV money, live gate/site fee, event sponsorship) isn't all that ridiculous an idea when you think about it.

Two fights against empty tomato cans is going to put Ward on top of the P4P list? Seriously???? HAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Sorry, that won't even put him close to the top 20. He fights TWICE and that puts him about everyone who has been fighting quality opponents for the past 2 years while he was playing in court? The only way that happens is if he beats Kovalev and Stevenson in his next two fights and Beterbiev in his third.

Ward has never been marketable in the past, not even coming straight out of the Super Six. What will make him marketable now? There isn't a boxer who is marketable in the mainstream world today. Not one. The guy is dull and boring with zero personality. There is nothing to market there.

TV money? From where? The fight on BET tomorrow is a TIME BUY. No money coming back there. Not much from the live gate either because they are giving away tickets for free. Ward is not a marketable product. Never has been, is not now and a couple of fights against bottom rung competition is not going to move him up either.

[Scipio2009]

K2 hasnt put any money into GGG. Not long ago he headlined HBO for 400k. K2 bid 7m for stadium selling Wlad defense against #1 contender, undefeated Povetkin. Fight ended up in Russia, at war with Wlad's Ukraine. 7m might not even be enough for Ward GGG. Ridiculous all around. Only Roc Nation might do something like that, though not in this case, it appears.

And no way GGG is PPV if he beats Ward, it just doesn't work like that. Did Tarver go PPV for KOing the much better known, much more proven RJJ?

If K2, according to your own words, hasn't invested any money in Golovkin, why should Cotto or Canelo, or any other name fighter at the moment, ever consider fighting Golovkin, since he's not bringing anything on his own end?

[sidenote: The fight ended up in Russia because Povetkin's promoter (i believe) wanted the fight in Russia and was willing to pony up for it, to the tune of nearly triple the K2 offer; since they believed in their guy, they put up the money and took the shot]

[Scipio2009]

I saw this quoted and just had to respond to it...



Two fights against empty tomato cans is going to put Ward on top of the P4P list? Seriously???? HAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Sorry, that won't even put him close to the top 20. He fights TWICE and that puts him about everyone who has been fighting quality opponents for the past 2 years while he was playing in court? The only way that happens is if he beats Kovalev and Stevenson in his next two fights and Beterbiev in his third.

Ward has never been marketable in the past, not even coming straight out of the Super Six. What will make him marketable now? There isn't a boxer who is marketable in the mainstream world today. Not one. The guy is dull and boring with zero personality. There is nothing to market there.

TV money? From where? The fight on BET tomorrow is a TIME BUY. No money coming back there. Not much from the live gate either because they are giving away tickets for free. Ward is not a marketable product. Never has been, is not now and a couple of fights against bottom rung competition is not going to move him up either.

Ward lost his place on every pound for pound list due to inactivity, and nothing more. If Ward smashes Paul Smith today and then smashes whomever he fights in his likely 168 title defense before the year is out, he goes right back into the top 5.

If Ward comes back and shows himself to still be the same Andre Ward that near every list had a #2 (and some even going as far as putting him 1B), you couldn't honestly name five fighters who would be able to hang with that. Floyd, Klitschko (for the simple fact that he is still heavyweight champion), and maybe Kovalev (his performance against old-man Hopkins), If Ward shows himself to be on form, those are the only names that you could honestly put ahead of his.

Beyond that, the things that make him marketable now are the same things that made him marketable before; only difference now is that he's got a team with the financial wherewithal and connections to truly market him, as long as he can stay active going forward.

Ward is America's last Olympic boxing gold medalist, is a clean-cut family man, doesn't come to the picture with any out-of-the-ring issues, doesn't have his face busted in, can fight his backside off, is a charming and engaging interview, and is a pious man without openly beating everyone over the head with it (S.O.G. nickname, withstanding).

Whether it's sitting in to talk sports on CSN Bay Area or ESPN, sitting down to do The View/talk show, sitting for interviews with hip hop/top 40 radio stations, or any other avenue you can think of, if Ward gets a chance to talk and engage with people, he shines brightly. Hate if you want.

The BET deal is a time-buy, yes; such a setup allows for RNS to keep the revenue from whatever ads run during the telecast, while also selling the rights to the fight internationally (as was already sold to Sky Sports in the UK and other deals).

And honestly, I'm not even willing to go into the live gate discussion any longer, for the simple fact that no amount of evidence will alter the story you want to tell (Oracle Arena seats 20,000 people; though Ward having already generated over $700k in revenue for the Dawson fight never gets mentioned).

Believe whatever you want to believe

[aldo5408]

I wish they would fight so Golovkin could put an end to all the BS, Ward has fought 2 weight drained fighters in what 3 YEARS? Come on, GGG would blast his ass out in less than 5 rds, even with the running and holding. Ward's claim to fame was long ago in the Super Six where almost all of the fighters involved are done or retired. Ward is not even top 20 now and has one of the smallest fan bases in the sport.

smith is not weight drained he fought at 166 and now he's 176