At what point do we stop using the "GGG is being ducked" excuse?

[The Gambler1981]

Kovalev was real lucky. He was on the verge of being in an even worse spot than Golovkin is now. Thankfully, Hopkins stepped up.

That is kind of the difference Kovalev has caught breaks while Golovkin hasn't.

[ИATAS]

Kovalev was real lucky. He was on the verge of being in an even worse spot than Golovkin is now. Thankfully, Hopkins stepped up.

Right. If Haymon made Hopkins vs Stevenson which was the original plan, Kovalev would still be fighting top 15 guys looking for a name and be in the exact same boat. Pascal would likely be fighting Stevenson if Stevenson beat Hopkins of course.

[King_]

With all that said..... If he is truly being ducked, which he is, I don't understand why his handlers/HBO don't have people doing what I suggested they do on twitter. I know it sounds ****** but, "piss off" one of the duckers, make them look foolish in front of their fans, and who knows? They make an emotional decision, call up their handlers and say "Take the GGG fight."


I don't see how this can hurt.

[Dirk Diggler UK]

I think you also have to give Kovalev and Duva some credit for being willing to take pretty short money to fight Hopkins

Golovkin's people don't seem to be willing to do the same with him. They're happy for him to fight overmatched opponents because it still draws well on HBO.

[King_]

The "Golovkin Model" is exactly the Kovalev model. Kathy Duva in fact said they were copying Golovkin. Fight frequently, fight the top guys available until a big fight comes. Fortunately for Kovalev Hopkins was man enough to fight him (but even then it only happened because Haymon stalled on Hopkins-Stevenson and Hopkins was about to be stripped of a title) and now Pascal as well.

I really don't like the idea of Hopkins vs Golovkin at this point being that Bhop is 50 now, he's coming off his worst defeat in his career and it would have to be at like 170 or so. With Kovalev, Hopkins was a unified title holder and was on a winning streak. It was beneficial for Kovalev to fight him because he wanted his belts in addition to his name. For GGG at this point, I guess it's a name but after that loss and age 50? It's not much incentive, GGG wouldn't get the recognition Kovalev did for beating dominating Hopkins if he could (he won't be nominated for fighter of the year if he KO'd Hopkins at this point or dominated him). But I suppose if they only care about the name and that's it, it's something.

Kovalev was real lucky. He was on the verge of being in an even worse spot than Golovkin is now. Thankfully, Hopkins stepped up.

I think you also have to give Kovalev and Duva some credit for being willing to take pretty short money to fight Hopkins

Golovkin's people don't seem to be willing to do the same with him. They're happy for him to fight overmatched opponents because it still draws well on HBO.

On top of that..... they traveled to Wales to Cleverly's backyard to get their title shot. Hopkins definitely did him a huge favor by saying FU to Adonis and taking the fight..... But I agree with your last sentence. When I made this thread, it feels like it's at the point that HBO/his handlers are milking him because he's going to sell no matter what. Duva and Klimas themselves said while they were following the Golovkin model- they were literally having him fight for peanuts (because they were so confident in him)because they had no other options. Golovkin has options now. But HBO/K2 is content with stretching out these last 2.5 years with the same model.

At what point do you make a change? For almost 3 years we've been saying "They'll be forced to fight him." It's been 3 years almost.

Natas and Bojangles made good points that made me step back a bit- but I still feel like they're milking him.

[ИATAS]

With all that said..... If he is truly being ducked, which he is, I don't understand why his handlers/HBO don't have people doing what I suggested they do on twitter. I know it sounds ****** but, "piss off" one of the duckers, make them look foolish in front of their fans, and who knows? They make an emotional decision, call up their handlers and say "Take the GGG fight."



I don't see how this can hurt.

That kind of stuff doesn't work for Cotto, it certainly doesn't work for Quillin (who gets mocked on twitter all the time). But yeah they can certainly try to add more pressure on social media (I think Sanchez already does, he's constantly giving interviews about everyone in the world is ducking GGG) like u said it doesn't hurt to try.

[The Gambler1981]

To really put pressure on guys Golovkin has to be able to talk, I know people laugh and think he is funny but he needs to be able to get his point across clearly.

He needs a much better frontman than what he has now, he is the sort of guy that needs an Arum or Don King or even Schaeffer.

[ИATAS]

On top of that..... they traveled to Wales to Cleverly's backyard to get their title shot. Hopkins definitely did him a huge favor by saying FU to Adonis and taking the fight..... But I agree with your last sentence. When I made this thread, it feels like it's at the point that HBO/his handlers are milking him because he's going to sell no matter what. Duva and Klimas themselves said while they were following the Golovkin model- they were literally having him fight for peanuts (because they were so confident in him)because they had no other options. Golovkin has options now. But HBO/K2 is content with stretching out these last 2.5 years with the same model.

At what point do you make a change? For almost 3 years we've been saying "They'll be forced to fight him." It's been 3 years almost.

Natas and Bojangles made good points that made me step back a bit- but I still feel like they're milking him.

He had to travel for Murray who isn't allowed into the US because of his criminal past. I'm sure if there was a title holder available overseas they'd take it, but there isn't even a Nathan Cleverly available. The title holders are Andy Lee (fighting Quillin, winner fights Saunders), WBA "regular" champ Danny Jacobs (looks like Haymon is pushing him on the PBC series), and vacant IBF (Ndam vs Lemieux). Am I missing anyone? Oh yeah Cotto, who we've covered. Basically right now, GGG is stuck with what's available. Even at 168 it's the same scenario at the present time (that could open up later in the year of course).

Basically GGG has two options:

1. Stay the course. Fight best available and hope he gets unification and/or big fight soon.

2. Abandon 160 and campaign at 168. Try to push for Chavez (Haymon), Froch (retirement looming) and eventually Ward. It's like the same scenario at 160 tbh.

He's basically screwed for the time being. Eventually the fights will come, whether it's 160 or 168. Can't force it until then though.

[Bullrider]

With all that said..... If he is truly being ducked, which he is, I don't understand why his handlers/HBO don't have people doing what I suggested they do on twitter. I know it sounds ****** but, "piss off" one of the duckers, make them look foolish in front of their fans, and who knows? They make an emotional decision, call up their handlers and say "Take the GGG fight."

I don't see how this can hurt.

It won't make sense. If you call out fighters, you run the risk of being called a beggar, thus lose some of that A-side power in the negotiating table. You have to accept whatever crap the one you call out dictates.

Quillin, obviously would want astronomical sums of money for a Golovkin fight to take place, as an example, if you call him out.

[jas]

Until it's not true anymore

/thread