Lennox beats Vlad all day

[Mitchell Kane]

Klitschko fans love to talk about rematches....except when it comes to Vitali rematching Chris Byrd, or Wladimir rematching Corrie Sanders or Ross Purrity.

Criticize Lewis for not rematching a WIN, and yet saying nothing about Vitali or Wladimir rematching LOSSES.

Lewis won the fight and retired.

Vitali and Wladimir kept fighting, but had to have their brother to avenge their losses.

[Banderivets]

It's all the same Klitschko haters in all Klitschko threads, the same bunch in these threads...and then they complain about fanboys....well you all are just as bad.


I give Lennox 65% winning chance against Wlad. Everybody forgets that his chin was only slightly better than that of Wlads. He was far from invincible, watch his fights, and just like Wlad he has been in trouble and went on to win, but he had his issues, he had his flaws.

Mind you, I rank Lennox #1 H2H of all time. But the fact remains that he was just as vulnerable to big shots as Wlad is, so you can't discount Wlad sparking him out at any point. Lennox got hit, he got hit a lot more then Wlad gets hit today. I still give Lennox the edge.

Vitaliy, was all wrong style wise for Lennox. No one WOULD EVER KO Vitaliy, he was Chuvalo Jr. He could possibly outpoint Lennox over a span of a fight. He only took the fight on two weeks notice and could not have possibly done proper preparation at that point in his career for one of the greatest heavyweights of all time in 2 weeks. He was more at odds given the prep time than Lennox. Lennox had more career experience at that level.

End of discussion.

Whoever disagrees is a blind hater.

End of discussion.

[PainfromUkraine]

You call the debate boring, and yet immediately start one lol. One thing that is alarming to me is when you say "if you take away the cuts". That's kind of like saying "if you take away Terry Norris's chin problems, he'd be unbeaten in his prime". Not only does that not make sense because of the fact that these are qualities that you cannot just "take away", but yes, fighters tend to get cut when they are hit in the face repeatedly with power shots from a puncher. In addition, i think you (and a lot of others) fail to remember what was going on before the stoppage, and only remember the close scorecard in which Vitali WAS leading. But if you remember, in the last round, Lennox was starting to lay some damage on Vitali (who was noticeably fading at that point) and actually won the round before the stoppage. So I'm not exactly where you get the notion that Vitali (who was already in training and in shape anyway) would get the better of a prime Lennox in a series, i truly don't. Lennox was half a55ed training for a farewell bout against Kirk Johnson and was out of shape, and still ended up winning the fight fairly against a young, hungry challenger and was damaging him in the last round. If both fought at their best, you'd have to think it would be easier for Lennox, who was the more fluid boxer, better feet, faster etc. I think it would be helpful for you to take a closer look at the facts surrounding that fight.

I am not starting a debate. I don't even want to go into this long discussion but people keep replying to what I said so out of courtesy I reply back. Seems a lot of people are getting mad at my opinion for some reason...the problem with you and others is that you take YOUR opinions and make it seem like it's a fact. No, taking away cuts IN ONE INSTANCE, (that type of cut which very rarely happens and is really a freak of circumstances - you must remember it was the cut above the eye that caused the stoppage, the rest were superficial cuts that would have allowed the fight to go on) is nothing like saying 'but if someone had a better chin'. You are generally unlucky to get cut. People have been beaten badly and not sustained any cuts.

Furthermore, I agree Vitali was 'in training' but he had just as much time to prepare SPECIFICALLY for Lennox as vice versa, it's not like he devoted his career to basically training for a Lewis fight when he had other opponents in hand that he had to focus on. The notion he was hugely better prepared is a nonsense. Yes, of course Lennox was not in his best physical form, or the peak of his powers, but to say he was some shot shell of himself just because he was a couple of pounds heavy is also a nonsense. Sure, he wasn't at his best, but I think it's also not correct that Vitali was "in his prime". I think it was equal in terms of Vitali being at least 1 year from his prime (bare in mind he turned pro late and had never fought anyone really top world class in comparison to ATG Lewis) and Lewis being 1 year past prime.

You say Vitali was "noticeably fading" - I'd ask you to rewatch the 6th round, I did a couple of times recently, and objectively tell me - how did Lewis look better than Vitali in that round, or win that round clearly? I tried to be objective as possible and I really don't see how Lewis did enough to clearly win that. He looked exhausted throughout that round and apart from THAT uppercut which he landed, he did not land anything else of note and in my view Vitali outworked him. If anything that should tell you something, I think if Lewis had any energy that uppercut might have ended the fight. It was a very scrappy round marred by clinching, and while I agree Lewis clearly scored the most noteworthy and clean punch, that's not enough to win a round in my view...VK landed some decent jabs and straight rights, while Lewis apart from that uppercut and a few other decent short punches while in the clinch didn't do much except telegraph slow punches. Klitschko was pushing him around the ring, which should tell you he still had strength and energy.

Anyway, we once again come to the same conclusion, some people on here don't seem to be realising - I am not arguing or dis*****g how that fight ended - Lewis won. Just in my opinion, with both fighters at their peaks (funnily enough 38 year old Vitali was better defensively IMO) if they were to fight a series, let's say even 3 fights, Vitali would win 2. I'm not arguing even who's better, I just feel IN MY OPINION, without any circumstances to mar the fight, like cuts, Vitali's style is bad for Lennox and he can beat him.

I don't get why that's hard to accept for some people or why they are getting mad - I'm not arguing against other people's opinions - if you think Lewis would win 3/3, that's your right and if you have your reasons, that's perfectly fine! Some people getting too mad over differing opinions...boxing fans will never agree so let's just agree to disagree!

[Banderivets]

Don't bother man, this has been beat to death on this forum. Haters gonna hate.

There is no point in trying to have an intelligent discussion with the lot of them. They have a hard on for Wlad and no mater what you say it will not go away.

You tell them "Lennox wins, but lets look at this scenario" and all you get back is the video of that goat spitting.

Klitschko haters on BS



This is not the forum to have intelligent discussions half the time, its all about nuthugging and hating on here.

[billeau2]

One of the guys here still carries that Vitali=GOAT statement of mine around as his signature.

I think it's yoz.

I stand by it.

Under any random circumstance, I don't think I could bet against him.

He just punched the living crap out of every single opponent he faced.

And the wild shoot outs!! Awesome. I actually loved his style, it was terrific to watch.

Yu and Welty should get a room for a while.....you can hang up pictures of Vitali getting his face smashed, have a good cry then smack lips. If nothing else it would get you out of the basement for a while.

[slicksouthpaw16]

I am not starting a debate. I don't even want to go into this long discussion but people keep replying to what I said so out of courtesy I reply back. Seems a lot of people are getting mad at my opinion for some reason...the problem with you and others is that you take YOUR opinions and make it seem like it's a fact. No, taking away cuts IN ONE INSTANCE, (that type of cut which very rarely happens and is really a freak of circumstances - you must remember it was the cut above the eye that caused the stoppage, the rest were superficial cuts that would have allowed the fight to go on) is nothing like saying 'but if someone had a better chin'. You are generally unlucky to get cut. People have been beaten badly and not sustained any cuts.

The underlined bold part made me chuckle, as you did the same thing as before. First, you can explain to me how you can just "take away" about 5 deep facial cuts (that required 60 stitches) and act like they didn't happen. In addition, they weren't in just "one instance", they happened over several rounds of even more power punches. All these cuts shows that they weren't just some freak accident, they were due to PUNCHES, ALL OF THEM. I'm not sure how long you have been following the sport for, but at some point, you (hopefully) realize that fighters are protected from themselves for a reason. I brought up the Norris chin issue simply because like Vitali's cuts, if you take away Norris chin problems, many feel like he would not have lost to Simon Brown in the first fight. What do they have in common? They are both laughable excuses that fans often use to make excuses for their favorite fighters. Bad chins and cuts are all apart of boxing and there is no "taking them away".

Furthermore, I agree Vitali was 'in training' but he had just as much time to prepare SPECIFICALLY for Lennox as vice versa, it's not like he devoted his career to basically training for a Lewis fight when he had other opponents in hand that he had to focus on. The notion he was hugely better prepared is a nonsense. Yes, of course Lennox was not in his best physical form, or the peak of his powers, but to say he was some shot shell of himself just because he was a couple of pounds heavy is also a nonsense. Sure, he wasn't at his best, but I think it's also not correct that Vitali was "in his prime". I think it was equal in terms of Vitali being at least 1 year from his prime (bare in mind he turned pro late and had never fought anyone really top world class in comparison to ATG Lewis) and Lewis being 1 year past prime.

I think you would also agree that the advantage was clearly in Vitali's favor, based on these circumstances. It was NO WHERE NEAR EQUAL. A young, hungry lion that is in shape already vs an out of shape, unmotivated champion that just had an opponent switch? The only thing that was "equal" was the fact that both took the fight on short notice, and Vitali knew a lot more about Lennox than vice versa. Vitali had already been champion even before Lewis so he wasn't just some fringe contender. Make sure your facts are straight.

You say Vitali was "noticeably fading" - I'd ask you to rewatch the 6th round, I did a couple of times recently, and objectively tell me - how did Lewis look better than Vitali in that round, or win that round clearly? I tried to be objective as possible and I really don't see how Lewis did enough to clearly win that. He looked exhausted throughout that round and apart from THAT uppercut which he landed, he did not land anything else of note and in my view Vitali outworked him. If anything that should tell you something, I think if Lewis had any energy that uppercut might have ended the fight. It was a very scrappy round marred by clinching, and while I agree Lewis clearly scored the most noteworthy and clean punch, that's not enough to win a round in my view...VK landed some decent jabs and straight rights, while Lewis apart from that uppercut and a few other decent short punches while in the clinch didn't do much except telegraph slow punches. Klitschko was pushing him around the ring, which should tell you he still had strength and energy.

Lewis landed the uppercut sometime around the 2 minute mark, and outworked him for the rest of the round with Vitali initiating all of the clinches. Also, at the 15 second mark Lewis landed another right hand, in which Vitali looked like he was out on his feet and nearly drug Lennox to the floor. I suggest you go back and watch the last round only with the suggested times.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alzu9t1CmRM

[Mitchell Kane]

Yes, of course Lennox was not in his best physical form, or the peak of his powers, but to say he was some shot shell of himself just because he was a couple of pounds heavy is also a nonsense.

There's a difference between being a 31 years old coming in off a 7 month layoff and having 3 fights in the prior 18 months...and being 37 years old at a career-high weight coming off a 12 month layoff and having one fight in the last 19 months.

Even being younger, more active and in better condition, Vitali couldn't beat Lewis.

I think it was equal in terms of Vitali being at least 1 year from his prime

Vitali only fought for another year and a half left before "retiring".

According to you, Vitali only had one fight in his "prime"...against Danny Williams.

That's about the shortest prime ever.

[niceyboo3]

Man your delusional. The guy just told you it was FOUR cuts and gave a link to what the doctor said. Vitali could have been seriously hurt If he continued and no one wants to see that, I care more about your guy then you do. Give it up, Lewis carved him up, it was not pretty.

This right here is Ether.

[Nay_Sayer]

Hence why I said over a 10 fight period

Dude, the lineage in your sig is WAY off...

[Nay_Sayer]

If a Pulev jab hurt Wlad, imagine a Lewis jab followed by a ramrod right hand.

Lights out.

^This

/Thread