-
-
Well first of all let me say that I don't think VK is a bum. Even if he had a more aggressive style (think Kovalev) and dispatched his opponents quickly the fact of the matter is that the heavyweight division is not very good.
You mention the "States". Interestingly enough my favorite fighters are not from the States. Most come from the eastern block: Lomanchenko, Prodovnikov, GGG, Kovalev or elsewhere Martinez (now retired I hope), Pac, Donaire so that fact the the Ks are Ukrainian has nothing to do with it.
A great era has a couple top quality fighters (HOF and ATG) in their prime at the same time and a lot of quality "B" competition. Today we have one K and we don't even have quality B competition. Now we know that Ks can beat this level - witness VK destruction of Chris Byrd before the shoulder injury. (As a side note VK's rep was hurt by quitting. He should have ran the last 3 rounds, jabbed. He could have lost the last 3 rounds and won the fight.)
The lack of quality opposition is not VK or WKs fault. It just is.
I think the following are better, absolutely better than any heavyweight in the last 10 yrs not named VK, WK or David Haye.
(not in any order, just off the top of my head)
Rid**** Bowe
Evander Holyfield
Lennox Lewis
David Tua
Mike Tyson (past prime but still dangerous)
Shannon Briggs
Razor Ruddock
Tommy Morrison
Ray Mercer
Oliver McCall
Frank Bruno
Old George Foreman
Michel Moorer
Andrew Golata
and the following would probably have swept through every heavyweight not named VK, WK or David Haye.
Chris Byrd
Hasim Rahman
Oleg Maskaev
John Ruiz
Ike Ibeabuchi
It's not WKs fault that there is nobody there and that the few that are think that coming in with 20-30 pounds of fat will help them in a boxing match. The extra weight from fat might help in wrestling (sumo) or in American football but it doesn't help in boxing.Comment
-
Frazier had a great bob and weave. Watch his fights against Ali and see how many punches he slipped; watch how fast he is coming in and out. You think he couldn't hit LL or WK upside the head? You think he wouldn't rake their midsection with hooks?
I'm not saying Frazier is a sure win over LL, or VK or WK, not at all. But I think he most definitely could win. Look how much trouble LL had with Mercer, now think if Mercer came in without 20+ pounds of fat and was faster, more agile (because of less weight) more endurance (because of less weight). I think Mercer could have won that fight. For the same reason I think Frazier could have won that fight as I think Frazier was a better boxer than Mercer.Comment
-
Great thread TS, Wladimir is a legend a top ten heavyweight.Comment
-
The fight game was way different back then. The holding that VK did in the last few fights would have cost him points (if not a DQ). Secondly they trained for endurance and speed not standing up straight and not moving. Foreman was the only one (and yes he did very well).
Arreola would have come in at 205-210, same with Ray Mercer.
For better or worse training has changed - extra weight does not mean being a better boxer. Look how much trouble an older Holyfield gave to a prime Lennox Lewis.Comment
-
lol stop jokingComment
-
Can't blame Wlad or Vitali for the lack of talent at HW. They defeated everyone put against them in the last 10 years.
2 best HW of this era easily....Comment
-
Why do people keep saying "one of the greatest". He IS the greatest ever heavyweight.
If he continues this form with the resume the thread starter showed he may have one of the atg KO percentages.
He might end up with the most title defences.
He might end up with the most title fights.
When you look at a heavyweight from a purely statistical point of view there is no one close to him.
Plus he may have more to come. Like unifying the Heavyweight division for the first time 100 percent by holding ALL of the main belts.
He truely is a Elite Athlete.Comment
-
1. Quality of opposition counts. Look at the Lomachenko-Russell fight. If Russell had 10 more wins over mediocre opposition would that make him a better fighter or simply a fighter used to mediocre opposition?
2. Most title fights maybe. And that's a big plus. But see point number 1.
3. Re unifying the division. Dude. That's what separates the fighters from before the 1980s with the present. The split happened in the 1960s but really didn't take root until the 1980s.
Example: When Liston became champion he had already cleared out the division. To get a title shot back then you, for the most part, had to have gone through the gauntlet. Now adays you have a Roy Jones Jr, a Calzaghe, a Mayweather, a Stevenson who has belts but haven't solidified the division. It's a sad state of affairs.Comment
Tweet
Comment