Is Joe Frazier really an ATG?

[Syf]

You cant blame frazier for losing to the greatest heavyweight to ever lace em up. Or to the gargantuan beast foreman when he was in his prime.

how competetive he was with ali and even winning against him cements his legacy. You are treading ground that is sacred to boxing history. Take off your shoes.

[4Corners]

Yes......this is a question???

I will admit that had Ali not been forced into a 3 1/2 year retirement, which basically killed his absolute prime, Joe would never have beaten Ali in the late 60's. But.....that's NOT what happened.

His biggest win was obviously Ali in 1971. Even though Ali wasn't in his absolute prime, he was still undefeated and a great fighter. He'd had two fight back, where he stopped two top HW contenders. Joe deserves full credit for beating the greatest HW ever, and one of the greatest fighters ever.

On top of that, he beat other top HW contenders from his era. Mathis, Bonavena, Quarry, Foster, Ellis, Bugner, etc.

Those solid wins, on top of the massive Ali win. He deserves the recognition he gets.

[4Corners]

He's similar to Marquez in terms of resume, and nearly everyone here calls Marquez an ATG and HOF.

Marquez has the big Pacquiao win, or wins depending on what you believe about the first 3 fights. But the rest of his wins pale in comparison to the Pacquiao fights. Still, he has enough solid wins aside from the big one to be considered an ATG.

[sugarsmosley]

ATG heavyweight yes. However, some might say he's not among the 10 greatest heavies ever. So it comes down to subjective evaluation, as it often does with the 'ATG' talk being thrown around loosely.

I think he is in the top 10 greatest heavies...... albeit the lower part maybe 9 or 10

[Furn]

Fought in a tough era and only lost to 2 guys. Foreman and Ali.

[J-champ]

Yes he is an all time great!

[Someone88]

Yes Frazier is among the greats in Boxing.

[MisterHardtop]

Don't get me wrong I respect the guy for his toughness and heart but is he really an all time great?

He's known for getting absolutely destroyed by George Foreman and for losing a trilogy to Muhammad Ali, probably the greatest HW of all times.

I know he did beat Ali once but that's it, he lost to "The Greatest" two times. Of course it's not a shame to lose a fight to Muhammad Ali.

But, lets be honest here, winning one fight against coming back from 4 year break Ali is not enough to be considered an ATG.

Maybe this is a sign of the changing times, maybe I'm getting too old haha but when I was growing up in the 70s, Frazier was the greatest heavyweight not named Muhammad Ali, every boxing article I ever read had him ranked favourably against guys like Ali, Louis, Marciano and co. But I guess times change and looking back at his career now, it may seem like his only stand out victory was Ali but if you were alive when Frazier was active in his run as champion, you'd know that Mathis, Ellis, Bonavena and Foster were great names to have on your list of vanquished foes.

Now, those names may not mean as much but these were the best heavyweights around at the time and Frazier battered most of them. Foster is one of the greatest light heavyweights ever and in that era is was common for the champs of the two highest divisions to fight one another. In my eyes, Frazier is without a doubt an ATG. But time changes opinions and new generations have new heroes. Who knows, many of you looking back at today's era may claim that no future fighter can hold a flame to the likes of Pacquiao or Roy Jones or Bernard Hopkins or Wladimir Klitschko or Floyd Mayweather etc.

[- Ram Raid -]

Maybe this is a sign of the changing times, maybe I'm getting too old haha but when I was growing up in the 70s, Frazier was the greatest heavyweight not named Muhammad Ali, every boxing article I ever read had him ranked favourably against guys like Ali, Louis, Marciano and co. But I guess times change and looking back at his career now, it may seem like his only stand out victory was Ali but if you were alive when Frazier was active in his run as champion, you'd know that Mathis, Ellis, Bonavena and Foster were great names to have on your list of vanquished foes.

Now, those names may not mean as much but these were the best heavyweights around at the time and Frazier battered most of them. Foster is one of the greatest light heavyweights ever and in that era is was common for the champs of the two highest divisions to fight one another. In my eyes, Frazier is without a doubt an ATG. But time changes opinions and new generations have new heroes. Who knows, many of you looking back at today's era may claim that no future fighter can hold a flame to the likes of Pacquiao or Roy Jones or Bernard Hopkins or Wladimir Klitschko or Floyd Mayweather etc.

Or conversely if he just wasn't being a ****. . . . Oh, ohh, hang on , I think we missed Chuvalo and Quarry.

[MisterHardtop]

Or conversely if he just wasn't being a ****. . . . Oh, ohh, hang on , I think we missed Chuvalo and Quarry.

Great names to add to the list, also I'd add in Jones, I know he was almost shot by then but Frazier was still a novice yet he beat Jones up, this is the same guy who gave a young Ali fits and wobbled hi ma couple times as well.