Carl Froch vs George Groves IBF SMW Title & Undercards Prediction Discussion Thread

[Weebler I]

I disagree. Froch look shook from a jab in round 3. and was hurt in round 6 - much more than Groves was at all in the fight. having rewatched it once more, I'm horrified that such a bad stoppage can take place in a world title fight.

He does have immense punch resistance. But it wouldn't surprise me if he was stopped in his next couple of fights. Groves took something away from him. I'm sure of it.

Well I re-watched in its entirety. He winced in R.3, if we're thinking of the same jab, but he wasn't "hurt". In round 6 he shipped a lot of punches but wasn't hurt then either. Nobody knows if it has taken anything out of him but he took similar beatings v Taylor and Kessler 1 and came back strong. I do fear for his cerebral function in later life tho.

R.1 - 10-8 Groves
R.2 - 10-9 Froch (v.close)
R.3 - 10-9 Froch
R.4 - 10-9 Groves
R.5 - 10-9 Froch
R.6 - 10-9 Groves
R.7 - 10-9 Groves
R.8 - 10-9 Froch

76-75 Groves (I think), could see 77-74 Groves.

I've watched it twice since. First with sound on then with it off. The commentary team were very excited by the KD and spent the restof the fight telling the viewers how they thought the fight was going rather than calling it as it was - not really faulting them it's easy to get caught up in the excitement.

OK. On fight night I gave 2, 6 and 8 to Froch, the rest to Groves.

Second time around, I gave 2, 5 and 8 to Froch.

I stuck with that on the silent viewing but also realised there was actually a reasonable case for 3 as well for Froch.

In short. The only indisputable rounds for Groves IMO were 1 (10-8), 4 and 7.

For Froch only 8 was indisputable.

Rewatching without the commentary teams over excited exaggerations (with no sound) it became apparent that Groves never had Froch in any significant danger after the first round KD. He managed to wobble Carl for a fraction of a second in 5 or 6 but had the favour returned. Groves was not landing many significant shots in any round and Froch in 2,3,5 and 6 could be seen to be landing a similar amount but perhaps with more effect (his physical pushing around and close in flurries were also a factor).

In short, whilst I'm happy with my initial 77-74 scorecard, I actually can easily see the 76-75 that 2 judges gave to so much approbation.

From rnd 6 onwards Groves was showing significant signs of fatigue, his arms start hanging looser and he frequently has his mouth open to breath.

The 9th round stoppage was still bad, but watching closely gives more insight into the stoppage. The ref had been watching the exchanges for about 30 seconds prior to stoppage looking increasingly concerned. Groves had been slumping on Froch in the exchange prior to the one that initiated the stoppage in the opposite corner for several seconds at a time. Whilst in my judgement he was just snatching a rest rather than badly hurt, it seems the ref thought otherwise (and it is further evidence anyway of just how tired Groves was becoming). Nonetheless when they broke Groves still appeared steady and quick on his feet for a couple of seconds before getting caught a second time on the ropes. To me it seems that ref, who'd already been close to the point of stopping it decided enough was enough when the final exchange drove Groves into the ropes and left him swinging badly wide.

From my POV the stoppage still wasn't justified, but a close rewatching of the refs action and body language showed that he had been concerned (perhaps overly so) for at least half a minute before the stoppage, rather the just having made a spontaneous flash decision.

Anyhows. I know I'm gonna get a ton of flack, (specially for my scores) but I've watched (and rewatched) it with as open a mind as I can, and I'm calling it as I see it.

Agree with much of that.

Jim Watt kept mentioning Froch's pre-fight attitude but he gave himself away as partial when he said something to the effect of "we're glad Groves has recovered". The lead commentator wasn't so bad.

[LacedUp]

Well I re-watched in its entirety. He winced in R.3, if we're thinking of the same jab, but he wasn't "hurt". In round 6 he shipped a lot of punches but wasn't hurt then either. Nobody knows if it has taken anything out of him but he took similar beatings v Taylor and Kessler 1 and came back strong. I do fear for his cerebral function in later life tho.

R.1 - 10-8 Groves
R.2 - 10-9 Froch (v.close)
R.3 - 10-9 Froch
R.4 - 10-9 Groves
R.5 - 10-9 Froch
R.6 - 10-9 Groves
R.7 - 10-9 Groves
R.8 - 10-9 Froch

76-75 Groves (I think), could see 77-74 Groves.

I honestly can't see how you could score round 2 and 3 to Froch. Those were clear Groves rounds. He landed the far cleaner shots, and all of his jabs were going in - add to that he pressed the action. Froch pawed with his jab, landed nothing significant and looked shaky on his legs in those rounds.

R 5 & 8 were both close, but could be persuaded to give them to Froch. But he didn't win more rounds than those.

Two of the scorecards were disgraceful.

[Rome-By-Ko]

That first paragraph didn't even make sense. Groves landed the far cleaner, better, harder punches throughout the whole fight.

the bradley-pacquiao fight.



I disagree. Froch look shook from a jab in round 3. and was hurt in round 6 - much more than Groves was at all in the fight. having rewatched it once more, I'm horrified that such a bad stoppage can take place in a world title fight.

He does have immense punch resistance. But it wouldn't surprise me if he was stopped in his next couple of fights. Groves took something away from him. I'm sure of it.

Even tho Groves was badly hurt(far more then Froch) and stopped?? Not to mention I believe Froch was more busy and leading in some Rds..I had Groves winning, he was not ahead by more then 1 or 2 Rds..

[LacedUp]

Even tho Groves was badly hurt(far more then Froch) and stopped?? Not to mention I believe Froch was more busy and leading in some Rds..I had Groves winning, he was not ahead by more then 1 or 2 Rds..

Come on man, stop being silly. Who are you trying to fool? Groves far more hurt than Froch....

Groves put Froch on his back! and Froch did a silly dance. How can Groves, still throwing and dodging punches, be more hurt than that?

Froch won a maximum of 2 rounds.

[CraigM]

Im a Froch fan, rewatched the fight twice now and saw it live. Here is my Take

Groves Froch
1 10 8
2 10 9
3 10 9
4 10 9
5 9 10
6 10 9
7 9 10
8 9 10

Groves 3 point up.

Froch was winning the 9th.

IMO Groves gave everything in the 6th and had nothing left.

Only one way this fight was going to end was Froch stopping Groves.

Howard Foster should have let the fight go on and Give The Cobra the clear Stoppage.

Froch does not deserve all the comments that are flying about at the moment, he has just beaten a very good young hungry skilled fighter and again showed a great chin, stamina and heart.

A rematch will be the same, Groves winning the early rounds with Froch wearing him down in the second half and forcing the stoppage.

I'd have George winning the 7th but like the rest of your scorecard, as a Froch fan what are your feelings on him refusing to shake hands straight after the fight and some of his comments in the post fight interview?

See i'm a Groves fan myself, and thought some of the things he said to get under Carl's skin was a bit petty but I also felt like he was seen as an outcast because he wasn't the matchroom fighter and had to switch camps so played up on it a bit.

[adietheforestfa]

I'd have George winning the 7th but like the rest of your scorecard, as a Froch fan what are your feelings on him refusing to shake hands straight after the fight and some of his comments in the post fight interview?

See i'm a Groves fan myself, and thought some of the things he said to get under Carl's skin was a bit petty but I also felt like he was seen as an outcast because he wasn't the matchroom fighter and had to switch camps so played up on it a bit.

Froch gave George lots of Credit in the interview i heard, He is never going to say he was going to loose if the fight wasnt stopped. George faught very well, I thought he would win the early rounds, didnt see the knockdown coming though, it was a fantastic punch and Carl deserves credit for Getting up. George was in serious trouble in the 9th, but the ref did a disservice to Froch for not letting him finish off Groves IMO. Froch always gets better the longer the fight goes and would suit the old 15 round fights perfectly.

And yes he should have shook hands straight away, but you dont know what was being said in the ring, GGs trainer was mouthing off a bit!!

Also I have always been a Groves fan, and loved it when he beat Degale.

I would like to see GG fight Degale again as GG has improved a great deal since thier fight where Degale has not impressed me at all recently.

[CraigM]

Froch gave George lots of Credit in the interview i heard, He is never going to say he was going to loose if the fight wasnt stopped. George faught very well, I thought he would win the early rounds, didnt see the knockdown coming though, it was a fantastic punch and Carl deserves credit for Getting up. George was in serious trouble in the 9th, but the ref did a disservice to Froch for not letting him finish off Groves IMO. Froch always gets better the longer the fight goes and would suit the old 15 round fights perfectly.

And yes he should have shook hands straight away, but you dont know what was being said in the ring, GGs trainer was mouthing off a bit!!

Also I have always been a Groves fan, and loved it when he beat Degale.

I would like to see GG fight Degale again as GG has improved a great deal since thier fight where Degale has not impressed me at all recently.

Good post!

Admittedly I think Groves would've weathered the storm but I can see where you are coming from.

[Dirk Diggler UK]

Well then if you wanna be PC,I had it 4-4 with a extra point for Groves for a KD..

Good lord. Once again you show a complete inability to score a fight.

Stop watching boxing.

[Rome-By-Ko]

Good lord. Once again you show a complete inability to score a fight.

Stop watching boxing.

Actually I think I should look into becoming a judge, my cards are usually right on point with most judges scores..Like usual tho,Dirk knows best,go with the popular opinion..Don't mean it's the right one..

[Dirk Diggler UK]

Actually I think I should look into becoming a judge, my cards are usually right on point with most judges scores..Like usual tho,Dirk knows best,go with the popular opinion..Don't mean it's the right one..

Yeah you would be right up there with CJ Ross.

Anyone who thinks Froch was level in rounds with Groves needs their head examined.