Greatest Welterweight?

[New England]

I know this wasn't directed to me, but thank you for spending the time to type this! I feel like i learned something haha.

i almost got my books out.


we've got a section dedicated to history. if you want to discuss fighters in the historic context then you'll do best there.

[pugilistprophet1994]

i almost got my books out.


we've got a section dedicated to history. if you want to discuss fighters in the historic context then you'll do best there.

Haha, i'll have to check it out. I didn't know all that about Robinson, I'm gonna stick with Leonard as the greatest but Robinson is up there. Def top 3.

[TX_BOXNG]

ive seen a couple of fights of sugar ray robinson n documentaries on espn classic ive recorded a couple n dude was amazing, energy, footwork, combos, stamina, he fought very frequently n with great strength every fight, ray leonard another great

[CubanGuyNYC]

Reading the posts in this thread made me once again think of something that boxing and baseball (among other sports) have in common: fans can offer an educated opinion on the greatest athletes without ever having seen them in action.

I simply don't know enough about boxing history to offer an opinion about the greatest welterweights of all time and back it up. However, there has been so much written about men like Robinson and Armstrong, so many informed opinions, that it' possible to know quite a bit about a fighter without ever having seen them fight.

I, myself, have seen very limited footage of "Sugar" Ray fighting. (From what I understand, there's little or no extent footage of him at WW.) Yet, upon viewing, his abilities are pretty evident. Looking at his accomplishments, his resume, his statistics and the loads of acclaim bestowed upon him, by people far more knowledgeable about boxing than all of us, is hard to argue against.

I know much more about baseball than boxing. I've seen "Babe" Ruth play in various film elements. He didn't appear very impressive by today's standards. His swing looked almost amateurish. Yet, I would list him as perhaps the greatest baseball player of all time. Everything that needs to be known about the man can be found in print. Although it's advisable to watch some footage, there's truly no need to have ever seen him in action. The same can be said, I'll argue, for "Sugar" Ray.

[CubanGuyNYC]

I'm old enough to remember watching "Sugar" Ray Leonard win gold at the 1976 Olympics. I was a kid, but I'd been watching boxing for a couple of years by then. (In those days there were many more fights on free T.V.) Even to a child, it was obvious that Leonard was a special talent. Since then, the only welterweight I've ever laid eyes on that could be mentioned in the same breath as "Sugar" is Tommy Hearns. But Leonard was better.

[jvsnypes]

I have never seen Robinson or Armstrong fight. But the greatest ww I've ever seen is Ray Leonard. I think he is the most complete fighter I've ever seen.

[RubenSonny]

Trinidad
Robinson
Leonard

Jheez, you really are ******ed.

[Kagami Taiga]

ok. i am sorry if i offended

black and white = ATG?

its larryx bro. lol, stop arguing with him. lmao

[george benton]

ok. i am sorry if i offended

black and white = ATG?

[jvsnypes]

based on their accomplishments, young one. must i really go through them with you being so rude in your inquiry?

armstrong has the most defenses of the WW championship. 17 or 18 defenses if i remember correctly, and he holds the record for stoppages in title fights at the weight. he owned it while defending the LW and FW titles, and came close to winning a title at MW, drawing with ceferino garcia. he was blessed with one of the best engines ever in boxing. his chin is among the greatest as well. despite not having the traditional knockout punch, he was

robinson lost one fight to jake lamotta (a MW,) during his tenure as a WW, and he beat him in their other four or five fights. he's got multiple victories over kid gavilan, another man regarded as one of history's greatest WW. he won 94 fights in a row at or around WW, fighting mostly top contenders and former champions.
he's regarded as the best P4P fighter of all time and he's a natural WW. he had speed, bone breaking power in both hands, a granite chin, and at WW he was large at almost six feet tall with a longer reach. if he had a flaw it was that he was such a savage that he left himself open to be hit. he made up for it with that chin of his.



are you insinuating that i dont know what they accomplished and that i'm just regurgitating information i've heard? that i'm not qualified to speculate on the top welterweights of all time? i'll guess that's what you're trying to do.


you've been here for how long?
and you know me how?

I have nothing but respect for guys that have followed the sport and know its history. I have seen footage of Robinson, actually I have a dvd on him and some of his fights at MW. I can see what the hype was all about back then, the man was a beast. But styles make fights. And with all his gifts, I cannot see him beating Leonard in a 15 round fight. Leonard matches him in hand and foot speed. He also has power in both hands. He also had a granite chin. I think they are equal in all those catogories. What separates the 2 are defense and basic fundamental boxing skills. Robinson got tagged by some flatfooted guys that were slow. Leonard would have hit them with flashy combos and would use his legs to get to safety. Can you honestly imagine Robinson getting hit with clean punches like that by Hearns? I don't think Robinson beats Hearns at WW. Not only did Leonard absorb Hearns viscious blows, he ended up pounding him. I can't speak about Armstrong because I've never seen any of his fights. And I've never seen Robinson at WW. But based on his style, I see him having problems with fighters that can match his speed. During his time, I'm sure there weren't many. If so, we would be talking about them too. Leonard to me is not only the best WW of all time, but maybe the most complete fighter ever. There is only 1 Roberto Duran. Arguebly the greatest LW ever. There's only 1 "Hit Man" Hearns. Arguebly the best 1 punch KO artist ever. There's only 1 Marvelous Marvin Hagler. Arguebly the greatest MW ever. Who beat them??? There's no arguement about that. Sugar Ray Leonard.