What does lineal champ mean to you?

[-Spinal-]

Oh and by not determined by beating the undisputed champion, I mean undisputed=having all 4 titles. Because that's how Davies is using it.

[Prawn Jovi]

When Pacquiao became the Lineal champion at 126 for beating Barrera, there was no title on the line whatsoever. Well at least none of the alphabet titles. The Ring title was on the line, but also the Lineal title too. So Pacquiao became The Ring and Lineal FW champion, with no ABC belt on the line.


So the lineal champion is not determined by beating the undisputed champion.



Also Floyd Mayweather became the 130 pound Lineal champion by beating Hernandez with only the WBC title on the line.


Belts are useless when determining who is The Ring or Lineal champ at a weight class.

Another example is when Castillo #1, beat Lazcano #2, for a vacant title and lineal title as well. Castillo later lost to Corrales, who lost to Casamayor, making him the lineal champ.

[Kagami Taiga]

i cant believe this thread is still going strong...lol. u would think its rocket science

[I Love Jesus!]

look just because you guys dont understand me doesnt mean im wrong. a lineal champion is not up to interpretation or debate. the word lineal has a clear definition in English. i'll highlight it.

to be a lineal champion it has to be proven beyond dispute that you are in the direct line of decent from the first original champion there is NO other meaning. end of story. I'll give you the best real boxing examples i can.


1 before Bernard Hopkins, Marvin hagler was the last undisputed middleweight champion. when he lost to Leonard and Leonard abandoned the division the lineage was broken. it was not reestablished until the middleweight tournament in 2001 when the title was unified. there was no lineal champion between Leonard and Hopkins because no fighter could show an uncontested direct line of desent until then.

Sergio Martinez is lineal now because he can show an uncontested direct line of decent to hopkins to hagler all the way back to the original champion

Roy jones was one of the greatest 175 pound champions ever and he was never the lineal champ, Zolt Esradie was. do you know why? because by beating Virgil hill he became the only fighter who could show a direct line of decent from himself to the original champion.


Andre Ward IS NOT the lineal champion. The super middleweight tournament was flawed. By leaving Lucian Bute and the IBF out of the tournament they could not establish lineage. Why? because a major and recognized sanctioning body the IBF disputes wards title. Wards title now as it stands can not show a direct line of descent to the original champion because his title is still contested by the IBF. a fight right now between Ward and Bute would establish lineage because the winner will be undisputed champion uncontested by any major sanctioning body in boxing.

If you cant understand it or don't want to believe it that's your problem. to those replying to me in this thread. Instead of being ungrateful know it alls you should have some respect for me taking my valuable time to teach you something about the sport you supposedly love.

[I Love Jesus!]

Its funny how several posters with tens of thousands of posts are arguing the same exact point with a poster with 200 posts yet he thinks he knows more then everybody even tho he's the only one arguing that point

are you really that ******? You think how much boxing knowledge someone has is determined by how many posts they have on boxing scene? So how many posts did cus damato or Eddie futch have on boxingscene. they must have like 10 million posts huh? Idiots like you are the reason serious boxing people will never come here.

[Mikhnienko]

Roy jones was one of the greatest 175 pound champions ever and he was never the lineal champ, Zolt Esradie was. do you know why? because by beating Virgil hill he became the only fighter who could show a direct line of decent from himself to the original champion.
.

Hill - Michalczewski - Gonzalez - Erdei - vacant when he moved up to CW. Erdei didn't beat Hill.

[New England]

ABC titles have nothing to do with the lineal championship.

they didnt exist in bygone decades. there was one champion

in a situation where a championship was vacated there would be a box off between the #1 and #2 contenders


there is no difference today.

i'm wondering where the hell the misunderstanding is coming from. it's pretty damn cut and dry.

[Roman Moreno]

look just because you guys dont understand me doesnt mean im wrong. a lineal champion is not up to interpretation or debate. the word lineal has a clear definition in English. i'll highlight it.

to be a lineal champion it has to be proven beyond dispute that you are in the direct line of decent from the first original champion there is NO other meaning. end of story. I'll give you the best real boxing examples i can.


1 before Bernard Hopkins, Marvin hagler was the last undisputed middleweight champion. when he lost to Leonard and Leonard abandoned the division the lineage was broken. it was not reestablished until the middleweight tournament in 2001 when the title was unified. there was no lineal champion between Leonard and Hopkins because no fighter could show an uncontested direct line of desent until then.

Sergio Martinez is lineal now because he can show an uncontested direct line of decent to hopkins to hagler all the way back to the original champion

Roy jones was one of the greatest 175 pound champions ever and he was never the lineal champ, Zolt Esradie was. do you know why? because by beating Virgil hill he became the only fighter who could show a direct line of decent from himself to the original champion.


Andre Ward IS NOT the lineal champion. The super middleweight tournament was flawed. By leaving Lucian Bute and the IBF out of the tournament they could not establish lineage. Why? because a major and recognized sanctioning body the IBF disputes wards title. Wards title now as it stands can not show a direct line of descent to the original champion because his title is still contested by the IBF. a fight right now between Ward and Bute would establish lineage because the winner will be undisputed champion uncontested by any major sanctioning body in boxing.

If you cant understand it or don't want to believe it that's your problem. to those replying to me in this thread. Instead of being ungrateful know it alls you should have some respect for me taking my valuable time to teach you something about the sport you supposedly love.

Actually Nunn and then Toney had established MW lineal championship fights between Leonard and Hopkins. Hopkins beating Trinidad established the lineal title without the WBO title on the line. You have no idea of what you're talking about.

The sanctioning bodies have no decision in lineal title.

[I Love Jesus!]

Hill - Michalczewski - Gonzalez - Erdei - vacant when he moved up to CW. Erdei didn't beat Hill.

same difference.

[IronDanHamza]

your wrong

Oh right, I forgot you have to have all the ABC Titles to be Lineal Champion