Will Wlad break Joe Louis's 25 title defenses?

[edgarg]

I was on that train in response to the guy who said there are only bums in today's heavyweight division and Louis today would be the undefeated champion with three time more title defenses. And that's quite ironic when realizing that Louis fought no less than 8 fighters coming off a loss for the heavyweight title, and comparing that to Wlad who has fought a good number of undefeated challengers and not one coming off a loss streak as a champion just shows the contrast. You get my point now.

Oh yes, I get your point alright, and appreciate it. My own point was that Louis was fighting the best available opponents and was going through them at a very quick rate both because he was fighting 5-6-7 times a year and because he was so good he made them look very ordinary. No doubt some were very ordinary, but they were the best available. He actually had a few return fights based on the fact that they'd either gone the distance with him or had lasted a decent number of rounds before being KO'd. THAT's running out of opponents.

The Klitshkos are in the very same boat. Under normal circumstances, and against each other, past Klitschko opponents are very credible fighters, but against either Klitschko they look like nothing, and the Klitschkos, if they don''t KO them, and even if they do, win just about every rd. Because there are two of them the attrition is just about what it was for Joe Louis. Because there are far fewer fighters nowadays, they are being reduced to considering comparative novices, and to recycle the previously beaten opponents of the other brother.

[edgarg]

Believe it was also essentially an Army fund raiser. he fought more than one of those. Baer II and Simon II were both for the relief effort for sure. In other words, he fought some real contenders essentially for free for a greater cause than himself.

Considering the good the Klit's do outside the ring, there's something for both sides of a nice history debate to celebrate.

Yes quite right. Just want to note that Baer and Simon were both credible opponents by comparison with Davis, who couldn't have been anything but an exhibition opponent, for, as you point out, a War Fund Raising cause. Wasn't one of them Eleanor Roosevelt's Milk Fund?The local Commission obviously was not quite caught up yet to the fact that there was a War going on. Louis got the very raw end of the stick from the IRS, it was a disgrace, and reminded me in a way of the blatant official discrimination against Jack Johnson, although the IRS is just officialdom as compared with the deliberate (mis)use of a rather inappropriate law to "get" Johnson.

[nomadman]

Believe it was also essentially an Army fund raiser. he fought more than one of those. Baer II and Simon II were both for the relief effort for sure. In other words, he fought some real contenders essentially for free for a greater cause than himself.

Considering the good the Klit's do outside the ring, there's something for both sides of a nice history debate to celebrate.

Absolutely. Louis was a great man.

[nomadman]

Oh yes, I get your point alright, and appreciate it. My own point was that Louis was fighting the best available opponents and was going through them at a very quick rate both because he was fighting 5-6-7 times a year and because he was so good he made them look very ordinary. No doubt some were very ordinary, but they were the best available. He actually had a few return fights based on the fact that they'd either gone the distance with him or had lasted a decent number of rounds before being KO'd. THAT's running out of opponents.

The Klitshkos are in the very same boat. Under normal circumstances, and against each other, past Klitschko opponents are very credible fighters, but against either Klitschko they look like nothing, and the Klitschkos, if they don''t KO them, and even if they do, win just about every rd. Because there are two of them the attrition is just about what it was for Joe Louis. Because there are far fewer fighters nowadays, they are being reduced to considering comparative novices, and to recycle the previously beaten opponents of the other brother.

Agree with the majority of this. What I don't agree with is that opponents of one Klit shouldn't automatically be barred or condemned as opponents of the other. No reason why Wlad shouldn't fight Adamek, Chisora or Arreola for instance.

[chaposinaloa]

Agree with the majority of this. What I don't agree with is that opponents of one Klit shouldn't automatically be barred or condemned as opponents of the other. No reason why Wlad shouldn't fight Adamek, Chisora or Arreola for instance.

He'll break it for sure..

[JAB5239]

Just saying I have no idea because you assume all of Louis' record is wrong on Boxrec isn't really fair. What I see is no less than 8 fighters coming off a loss and getting a shot at Louis' heavyweight title, Tony Musto coming of a 2-4 record and 6-fight rookie Johnny Davis both fighting Louis. Unless these stats are proven wrong, I have a point.

I know for a fact you have no idea what you're talking about. If you did you would have known Davis was a charity even for the military. If you did you would know of those 8 fighters coming off losses Godoy was coming off a DQ loss, McCoy was coming off losses to Solly Krieger and Billy Conn...thats much more impressive than fighting a novice coming off two losses, don't you think? And Buddy Baer and Joe Walcott were coming off their own losses to Louisv and Walcott should have actually been given the decision in their first fight. But Louis did what great champion do, he gave a rematch and set the record straight...unlike Wlad. So the reality is you have no point, no historical understanding of the era and how it operated and had no idea about boxrecs incomplete records. You're welcome for the education though.

[JAB5239]

H2H? No they effing aren't! Conn was a goddamn middleweight! I don't care who you are, you don't get no credit for beating no goddman middleweight. What if Wlad beat a plumped up Andre Ward? Would you give him credit for that? Would you bollocks! You'd say it was a disgrace and an absolute mismatch. Carnera is a better win than Byrd? What planet are you smoking in your planet-sized pipe? Schmeling and Baer better wins than anyone on Wlad's resume? Baer was a clown with windmill sails for arms. Schmeling wouldn't even have been considered a heavyweight today. Don't big up Louis's wins like they were something super special. They were good wins for a good heavyweight in a weak era. That's all.

Conn was a light heavyweight and had proven himself worthy by actually beating other top 10 heavyweights before getting his shot at Louis. The icing on the cake is that he's an all time top 10 light heavy and a top 25 all time p4p fighter. and lets not forget Louis had less weight on him than Wlad did on his last two opponents and won't bother with the skill differential.

[JAB5239]

Bam!!!!!!! Ownage right here!!!

That's what I'm saying, a guy with that record fighting for a world champion against a "great" tells you a lot about that era.

As opposed to Mormeck or Hayes great heavyweight accomplishments? You guys keep ignoring the fact your "bum of the month" theory is wrong and the fact Davis was a charity event for the army.

[ironmike2012]

So let me get this straight.

HEY Thread starter let me get this straight. So basically a more cautious, less explosive, less slick, less skilled, baby junior varisty version of prime Lennox Lewis is now considered a boxing machine and a ATG?

So this makes Lennox what? Boxing God?

Lennox retired rather than rematch Vitali, who did Lennox beat? An old, washed up Tyson or Holyfield. What was his best win? He beat alot of good fighters, but not great (at the time).

[grape drink]

Lennox retired rather than rematch Vitali, who did Lennox beat? An old, washed up Tyson or Holyfield. What was his best win? He beat alot of good fighters, but not great (at the time).

His resume is sure as hell alot better than Wlads. Who did Wlad beat that was ever great?

Wlad has only beaten one real heavyweight champion, in other words he has only beaten one fighter who was ever the undisputed champion and that was Rahman. And Rahman was never that good to begin with, and when Wlad fought him he was way past it.

Lewis beat 3... 4 if you count Shannon Briggs who was the lineal champion.

Joe Louis beat 6.