Shaver's Punching Power Is Completely Overrated.

[nomadman]

Tua and Tyson I could see an argument for but not really wladamir and definitely not vitali. Shavers does take a few shots to put the guy out completely buts that cause they usually cover up after tasting the leather once from a wild shot, where as wladamir usually works and then unloads cleaner shots. And don't bring that he doesn't load his punches fully BS, that's his own fault and shouldn't be used in arguments.

It's harder to make a case for Wlad since he holds back a lot of the time, and yes, I do think that's a legitimate argument because he has the type of knockouts to prove that it's not just smoke and air. When taken at his best you can see that he's capable of putting someone's lights out with one shot, as he's done on several occasions (Chambers, Thompson, Brock, Shufford). But there's no doubt that Wlad is a boxer first and a KO fighter second, and because of that he rarely puts himself into a shot if it compromises his balance or his defence. So whilst it's his fault for not getting guys out of there sooner, it can't really be used to downplay his evident punching power. I don't consider him in the upper echelon, but he's not that far below.

With Vitali I agree with you. Vit's an accumulation puncher, and despite his high KO percentage (a misleading stat) he doesn't really belong in a discussion like this. I will say though, that pre-retirement he used to have beastly strength. There was a moment in the Danny Williams fight where he literally lifted the 260lb Williams clean off his feet with a clubbing punch to the side of the head. I remember watching that at the time and doing a little double take. Here's the pic.



In fact all through that fight Vitali treated Danny like a ragdoll, knocking him to one side then knocking him back the other side. Once more let me reiterate that this was a 260lb stocky man getting handled as if he weighed no more than half that amount. Pretty crazy stuff.

And yeah I understand raw strength is different from punching power, but it factors in at some level, especially when you have as much raw strength as someone like Foreman and maybe even Vitali did, who really don't have much else to account for their power, Foreman especially.

Briggs is talking cr@p too, you really think he would speak the truth after a beat down like that? He was just trying to make it sound like he still had something to give to boxing. Lewis TKO him and George went the distance and lost but really did he land as many punches as vitali did? No way! Briggs talks ****, to prove me point do you remember what he said the next day after saying vitali hits harder than foreman or Lewis? He made up an excuse saying he hurt his hand in the first round and if it wasnt for that he would have knocked vitali out, and then he said he wanted a rematch.

I have no problem with people doubting Briggs's word. But if you're going to doubt one man's word on the basis that it was at odds with what actually happened (perfectly reasonable), then you need to do the same for every other fighter who did likewise, Holmes, Berbick, Botha, all of them who claimed that someone who never knocked them out punched harder than someone who did.

[nomadman]

Yeah Briggs is talking **** lmao. Lewis took a prime Briggs out in 5 rounds over 12 years ago when he actually had mobility and was in shape, meanwhile Vitali couldn't take him out in 12 rounds and Briggs is WAY past his prime, easily one of the most shot fighters I've ever seen in the history of boxing. Even in the Ibragimov fight which had taken place 3 years prior Briggs was already gassed in like the 3rd or 4th round of the fight despite only throwing around a total of 100 punches the entire 12 rounds, he was and has been grossly out of shape for a while.

If you want to pick holes in fighters' statements then about 70% of any argument for Shavers dissolves into thin air.

[nomadman]

I'd say that it's absolutely ridiculous and implausible to say that Shavers was a "feather-fist" while it's arguable whether he was the hardest puncher of all time or not. But he was definitely one of them.

Yes, I agree with the bold. But I'm disappointed at the generally repetitive and unconvinging arguments of the pro-Shavers crowd who, beyond endlessly regurgitating quote after quote, really don't appear to have much else to fall back on.

[Sugarj]

Shannon Briggs is less brain damaged than Muhammad Ali. And he said Vitali punched harder than Foreman and Lennox.

I'll take his opinion over a Parkinsons ridden Ali.

Ali said that before Parkinsons in a 1977/78 BBC program. Its on You Tube.

Larry Holmes said that he'd never been hit harder than Earnie Shavers hit him too.

I think its beyond dispute that Shavers was one of the truely hardest right hand punchers ever. Vitali has got heavy hands, but I've never thought of him as possessing power in the Foreman, Baer, Shavers or Tyson sense.

As for Shannon Briggs bless him, the punches that finished him off against Lennox Lewis looked more concussive and had better results than those from Vitali. Boxers often say things to flatter themselves, I suppose it looks better to have gone 12 rounds with Vitali at 39 years old than it does 5 rounds at 27 with Lewis......and then claim that Vitali punched harder.

[nomadman]

Ali said that before Parkinsons in a 1977/78 BBC program. Its on You Tube.

Larry Holmes said that he'd never been hit harder than Earnie Shavers hit him too.

I think its beyond dispute that Shavers was one of the truely hardest right hand punchers ever. Vitali has got heavy hands, but I've never thought of him as possessing power in the Foreman, Baer, Shavers or Tyson sense.

As for Shannon Briggs bless him, the punches that finished him off against Lennox Lewis looked more concussive and had better results than those from Vitali. Boxers often say things to flatter themselves, I suppose it looks better to have gone 12 rounds with Vitali at 39 years old than it does 5 rounds at 27 with Lewis......and then claim that Vitali punched harder.

Case in point.

Sorry bro, but this is exactly the sort of thing I'm talking about. Take one fighter's word to support your argument, dismiss another's.

Shavers was undisputably one of the hardest right hand punchers ever? I've been dis*****g it plenty in this thread, and I've been waiting for someone to convince me otherwise.

Quotes don't cut it I'm afraid.

[etlux]

lennox lewis's right hand was harder than shavers.

[etlux]

the hand that annihilated hasbeen rahman's career was harder than anything shavers threw or landed in his career

[nomadman]

the hand that annihilated hasbeen rahman's career was harder than anything shavers threw or landed in his career

I agree, but then Lewis was one of the hardest punchers in history and that was one of the very best punches he ever landed.

[Gordon Gekko]

Wlad is up first and Haye has a 50% chance of landing something over 12 rounds on that chin. Haye has legit 1 punch KO power in both hands. Wlad can do the same of course but I truly believe Haye is going to be on the outside of jab until he decides to bumrush and back out. rinse and repeat.


Let's say he clean KO's Wlad. takes another year off. Vitali is turning 40 in July and by the time he gets Haye in the ring he'll be 41.


LMAO


What happens if Haye pulls this off? ATG top 20? Above Holyfield and Spinks. Top 10 HW of all time?

So Haye's power > Shavers' power?

[joseph5620]

Case in point.

Sorry bro, but this is exactly the sort of thing I'm talking about. Take one fighter's word to support your argument, dismiss another's.

Shavers was undisputably one of the hardest right hand punchers ever? I've been dis*****g it plenty in this thread, and I've been waiting for someone to convince me otherwise.

Quotes don't cut it I'm afraid.

The opinions of fighters who took Shavers punches are far more credible than you.