Comments Thread For: De La Hoya: There is No Doubt Mayweather Beats Pacquiao

[ThePrince]

Where has Pac, or anyone in his camp, directly denied the 7 day revalation by Kontz?

When they revealed they agreed to all of demands. Is it really that hard to understand?

And you still haven't addressed why you take the word, at face value, of 'Kontz' who has proven recently he has no clue what goes on in negotiations. But when MANNY PACQUIAO, the man in question, HIMSELF says HE agreed you don't believe it.

And once you try to fumble your way through that, you'll be sure to let me know why HBO, Golden Boy, Haymon, and Mayweather himself have not contradicted, not even once, Manny's claim that he agreed to all of Floyd's testing demands. Richard Schaefer went so far as to back up what Pac said.

Please elucidate the situation for me, must be something I'm missing.

[hitking]

When they revealed they agreed to all of demands. Is it really that hard to understand?

And you still haven't addressed why you take the word, at face value, of 'Kontz' who has proven recently he has no clue what goes on in negotiations. But when MANNY PACQUIAO, the man in question, HIMSELF says HE agreed you don't believe it.

And once you try to fumble your way through that, you'll be sure to let me know why HBO, Golden Boy, Haymon, and Mayweather himself have not contradicted, not even once, Manny's claim that he agreed to all of Floyd's testing demands. Richard Schaefer went so far as to back up what Pac said.

Please elucidate the situation for me, must be something I'm missing.

Unless I missed something, which I doubt considering I visit multiple boxing related sites daily. Since the Kontz revalation, I haven't heard anyone from the Pacquaio camp deny they asked for 7 days, or saying anything outside of the predictable, "Mayweather's our priority, but if he doesn't want to fight, Mosley is next" nonsense. Since Margarito, they haven't said **** about Mayweather, any negotiations, or any agreed upon demands. So I don't understand what you're trying to get across outside of stuff that was said before Kontz had that slip, all of which I've heard and read before.

[Supreme75]

My bad, I kinda missed your question bro. If not Pac, my next logical opponent for Mayweather is obviously Martinez, who is the only fighter on the planet south of the super middleweight division that I would pick to beat Money. Actually, the fight fan in me wants to see Mayweather-Martinez a helluva lot more than I want to see Mayweather-Pacquaio because I think its a more competitive fight. Funny thing is, I'd pick Pac to beat Martinez. Boxing is a crazy ass sport.

I would love to see Mayweather fight Martinez, but see that's point. I don't think he has the balls to step in there with a big, strong, fast, southpaw, who just knocked out Paul Williams (another fighter Floyd won't touch).

In fact, I think like you, that Pac would be an easier fight for him than Martinez, but that might not ever happen either, so now we are back to the drawing board. Dude has no other options, but dangerous ones.

[hitking]

See all they're (Floyd fans) interested in is blaming Pac. They just
pick and choose whatever suits their arguments. They completely
deny what came out straight from the horse's mouth. They'd rather
believe Konzc than Pac himself.

The clear difference between Team Pac and Team Floyd is Team Pac
always have a ready alternative, a plan B. Team Floyd has none. Pac
is getting ****ted on for fighting, Floyd gets a pass for inactivity.

In other words, if you keep on reiterating Pac's fault, you gotta present
alternatives for Floyd. You have none. That clearly says you can't move
on past this Pac thing, yet you defend roadblocks which clearly says
you're not really interested in the fight. Which is which?

Personally, I'm not defending either. I've clearly stated I think both are full of **** and equally to blame for their fight not happening, which is why I'm being attacked by hardcore Mayweather and Pacquaio fans alike.

[hitking]

I would love to see Mayweather fight Martinez, but see that's point. I don't think he has the balls to step in there with a big, strong, fast, southpaw, who just knocked out Paul Williams (another fighter Floyd won't touch).

In fact, I think like you, that Pac would be an easier fight for him than Martinez, but that might not ever happen either, so now we are back to the drawing board. Dude has no other options, but dangerous ones.

First of all, after seeing Paul Williams laying on the ground looking like he'd just taken a .45 bullet to the head, I have no interest in seeign Mayweather fight him. That would be doing the same thing I'm critical of Pacquaio for, and that's fighting guys coming off loses.

Secondly, I think you need to step away from the, "Floyd has no balls" stance. The guy has won major titles in five divisions, which means at some point he was fighting bigger opponents.

Lastly, I think it has less to do with Mayweather not wanting to fight certain guys and more to do with him not wanting to fight period. I mean, he's been talking retirement since the Baldomir fight. Personally, I feel the only reason he fought after that was because he finally got DLH. And I think the only reason he came back was because he needed money. The guy made like $65M for JMM and Mosley. That's what he wanted to do, and now he's on the shelf again. When he goes broke again, he'll be back.

[hitking]

Come on the criticism of Pac for actually fighting, regardless of how you rate his opponents is bordering on the ridiculous. At least he fights and goes throough the pain barrier. When he says Margarito was his toughest fight does anyone seriously doubt him?

He gets criticised for fighting Margarito? Margarito has had a lot of fights and as far as i know no one has ever been criticised for fighting Margarito. Commened yes, criticized....categorically no!!!!! Cotto never got criticized for fighting Margarito at 147, yet Pac does for 150?

Pac is setting precedents left right and centre. Criticized for fighting!

Its not always WHO you fight, its when you fight them. Fighting Margarito immediately after he made Cotto scream No Mas was a big deal. Fighting him after he lost every second of every round before having his brain sent into orbit against Mosley, not so much. Especially considering he had no relevant wins between the Mosley and Pacquaio fights. I mean seriously, fighting Paul Williams a couple months ago was a big deal. But after seeing him KTFO eyes wide open, he doesn't have the same shine.

[ThePrince]

Unless I missed something, which I doubt considering I visit multiple boxing related sites daily. Since the Kontz revalation, I haven't heard anyone from the Pacquaio camp deny they asked for 7 days, or saying anything outside of the predictable, "Mayweather's our priority, but if he doesn't want to fight, Mosley is next" nonsense. Since Margarito, they haven't said **** about Mayweather, any negotiations, or any agreed upon demands. So I don't understand what you're trying to get across outside of stuff that was said before Kontz had that slip, all of which I've heard and read before.

Pacquiao-Margarito Episode 1 where 'Kontz' made his Clottey catchweightesque 'revelation' premiered October 23, 2010... the footage was shot sometime before that, it's anyone's guess outside of the HBO staff when it was filmed.

From November 12, 2010 (the day before Margarito):

Pacquiao: [Pauses] Um, no. I feel like I don’t need Mayweather to make my career. I fought the best and anyone willing to face me. I want it, and feel the fans deserve the Mayweather fight. I want to prove to everyone that it wasn’t me who didn’t want the fight. That’s why I made the concession to take anything [blood tests] he wants at any time. Even during the fight before the sixth round if he wanted! What else can I do? I hope we get the fight done soon. Let’s get it on.

And that's just one of many.

But again, you haven't answered why you take the word of 'kontz', one of the scummiest characters in Boxing who's already shown he has no knowledge of or hand in negotiations besides thinking he's Manny's 'adviser'... But when MANNY PACQUIAO, the man in question, HIMSELF says HE agreed to everything, you don't believe it.

Explain to me why that is, it's not asking for too much is it?

[hitking]

Pacquiao-Margarito Episode 1 where 'Kontz' made his Clottey catchweightesque 'revelation' premiered October 23, 2010... the footage was shot sometime before that, it's anyone's guess outside of the HBO staff when it was filmed.

From November 12, 2010 (the day before Margarito):

Pacquiao: [Pauses] Um, no. I feel like I don’t need Mayweather to make my career. I fought the best and anyone willing to face me. I want it, and feel the fans deserve the Mayweather fight. I want to prove to everyone that it wasn’t me who didn’t want the fight. That’s why I made the concession to take anything [blood tests] he wants at any time. Even during the fight before the sixth round if he wanted! What else can I do? I hope we get the fight done soon. Let’s get it on.

And that's just one of many.

But again, you haven't answered why you take the word of 'kontz', one of the scummiest characters in Boxing who's already shown he has no knowledge of or hand in negotiations besides thinking he's Manny's 'adviser'... But when MANNY PACQUIAO, the man in question, HIMSELF says HE agreed to everything, you don't believe it.

Explain to me why that is, it's not asking for too much is it?

I can't believe I'm debating about something I couldn't care less about. Anyways. I'm glad you bring up Kotnz, and his relationship, or lack thereof, with everyone in Pac's camp. They pretty much come out and rebuke everything he says, but not this.

As for you, you haven't produced video, like you said you would, of Pac making his "sixth round" quote.

Playing devil's advocate. Why is it that when people are critical of Pac's choice of opponents, diehard Pac fans like yourself point to Pac not being apart of his own negotiations and he just fights whomever his people put in front of him. But, when it comes to this testing nonsense, he's 100% in the loop of everything that's going on?

[730]

Personally, I can't say who is telling the truth about the testing because the stories from both camps are conflicting & the media reports lack consistency as well. The last I heard was that Pacquiao agreed to the testing as long as there is a 7-day cut-off, which in my opinion defeats the purpose because the testing would then cease to be "random." Now if they agree to a cut-off date, then fine. Otherwise, mentions of a cut-off date are moot because USADA testing is random.

Furthermore, a video of Manny or Floyd stating what they did or didn't agree to proves ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. A recorded statement does not prove that the words coming out of the person's mouth are true or accurate......they only prove that the person said the things stated in the recording. Anyone who would believe any & everything someone said is extremely naive. I don't care if it's your favorite person in the world......no one is immune to lying, being lied to or giving inaccurate accounts of events....especially when it serves their best interest. The only video that could prove who is giving the accurate story would be a video recording of the actual negotiations themseves. Anything else is subject to speculation & rightfully so.

It all boils down to who's story you believe. Pacquiao fans are not gonna buy Floyd's story & Mayweather fans are not gonna buy Manny's story. Who you believe shouldn't be decided by who your favorite is or who you like the most....it should be determined by who makes the most sense. One can only do that succesfully by being objective & not having an emotional investment in who is right or wrong.

All these videos prove nothing because they are not videos of the actual negotiations. Having said that, where would your frame of reference come from regarding who is telling the truth, unless you were there for the negotiations? Therefore, you're just regurgitating something you heard in hopes that it's a matter of fact. I can post a video of Rafael Palmeiro waving his finger at a Congressional Hearing stating that he never used steroids. I can post a video of Bill Clinton waving his finger at a White House Press Conference stating that he never had sexual relations with Monica Lewinsky. Both recordings are nothing more than videos of prominent public figures telling lies. The video did not prove that either were telling the truth. It just proved that they made those statements. Now when the truth came out, those same videos made them guys look & feel rather idiotic, I presume. The same may happen to the parties involved in the whole Manny vs. Floyd debates.

Believe what you want, but don't be so naive as to believe any &/or everything you see, read or hear. Base your beliefs off of someone presenting you with sensible information that makes more sense than the alternative story that you're being fed. And even then.....unless you have proof to validate the story you are prone to believe....the truth probably lays somewhere in the middle. That's why, unless I have no choice but to make a judgement call based on logic & reason, I go with validated facts.

[Supreme75]

Lastly, I think it has less to do with Mayweather not wanting to fight certain guys and more to do with him not wanting to fight period.

We will see. So when he comes back and makes a fight with anyone BUT Pac, Martinez, Cotto, Williams, or even Margarito, we'll know what the truth is.

The guy said it himself, "I'm a prize fighter, I fight for a prize duh". So these are the only money making fights IMO and he is nowhere to be found. His next move will tell us a lot. I personally think he has backed himself into a corner.