Is Roach the most overrated trainer of all time?

[Bastian Loc]

I made a thread like this like a year ago and people said i was crazy for calling him a better matchmaker more then a trainer

You were right bro.

I can't say Pac made him cuz I knew who Roach was before I knew who Pac was...

I remember Roach training Virgil Hill...

I give you that Futch trained Hill and Roach was the assistant. But, Hill won his first world title when Roach became his head trainer...

And, I remember reading somewhere that Roach would work with Hill more so than what What Futch would. And, that is why Hill had Roach being his head trainer.

Stop trolling man. Go to the wildcard 5 days a week and see what a great trainer he is.

[ThePunchingBag]

Amir's been boxing since the age of 8 and was successful before he got with Roach.

Roach didn't have anything to do with him being where he is. He's just piggy backing on it.

Yeah forget about Khan's own comments of Roach.

Khan doesn't need Roach.

He'd be doing the same with Ronnie Shields.

[Bastian Loc]

But to say Pac hasn't improved and is still a crude slugger, really?

Watch the MAB fight and then go watch Cotto, Clottey, and Marg......his defense is vastly improved even if it isn't great it is finally good and always getting better.

His punching technique is much better, as is his timing and spacing.

Its about opposition, not improvement.

If I pitted you against a double end bag, you'd probably flame out and lose a wide u.d.

If I pitted you against a heavy bag, you'd probably look like George Foreman.

You'll see if the Fraud fight happens. Fraud will make him look totally amateur.

Even in the Margarito fight, he was totally off balance with his amateur flurries at times.

Margarito just couldn't capitalize on it.

[Walt Liquor]

Don't get sardonic.

You know most of that stuff is political regarding "boxers that want him to train them".

And the improvement in pac has more to do with facing comeforward brawlers and no boxers.

Its an illusion.

David Diaz
Hatton
Cotto
Oscar(dead)
Margarito
Clottey.

No classy boxers there unless I'm missing something.
Its like this 90% carefully selected opposition, 10% improvement.
Match him up against anyone who could box like JMM or Floyd and he looks like a 1 handed amateur again.
I'd even pick Khan to clown him.

I'll get sardonic when you make dumb threads like this. Yes, you are missing something. Cotto is a classy boxer.

As far as you picking khan to clown manny, let's just say you don't have a rep around here as an expert fight prognosticator and this is just another example of why. This desparation thread isn't helping either.


There's no classier boxer than jmm and PAC won maybe 2 rds vs him the first time, and 5-6 the second time. If you can't recognize the difference in pac's rhythm, timing, arsenal, gameplanning, and execution then I don't know what to tell you.

Manny's never going to be a master boxer, but his style is refining to a point where he's a problem for anyone and everyone.

[Spray_resistant]

Its about opposition, not improvement.

If I pitted you against a double end bag, you'd probably flame out and lose a wide u.d.

If I pitted you against a heavy bag, you'd probably look like George Foreman.

You'll see if the Fraud fight happens. Fraud will make him look totally amateur.

Even in the Margarito fight, he was totally off balance with his amateur flurries at times.

Margarito just couldn't capitalize on it.

Everyone knows that fight could have gone either way and I was in the bag's hometown but I guess we can't make fact based arguments about Pac until he faces that vacationing ballroom dancer or someone of that caliber of dancer.

[Chups]

4 trainer of the year awards.......if he sucks then the others are dirt.

[PEBBLES!]

Don't get sardonic.

You know most of that stuff is political regarding "boxers that want him to train them".

And the improvement in pac has more to do with facing comeforward brawlers and no boxers.

Its an illusion.

David Diaz
Hatton
Cotto
Oscar(dead)
Margarito
Clottey.


No classy boxers there unless I'm missing something.


Its like this 90% carefully selected opposition, 10% improvement.


Match him up against anyone who could box like JMM or Floyd and he looks like a 1 handed amateur again.


I'd even pick Khan to clown him.

Killer post right here ^^^^


That's the truth, and you all know it.

[STRUGG]

naaaaaah......floyd senior is way overrated though...................

[FloydTBE]

i would say hes overated

[Walt Liquor]

Now you're just trolling. Fortune was a hw pro himself, he didn't need Roach to learn about boxing.


you're THIS close to going on iggy.


stop being annoying.

You're officially being ******. Roach was a boxer too.

Have you ever heard and interview or read anything fortune has said about learning from Freddie. Obviously not.

If any boxer could train...well never mind, if you don't know it already or are choosing to ignore it then you're just useless.

Futch was busy with other fighters and Freddie did pretty much all the work with him. But I'm sure you already know that since you train at the wild card 5 days a week and can tell Freddie sucks as a trainer.

If you put me on iggy, you're the biggest bit ch that ever logged on to boxingscene.