Quote: "Manny Pacquiao is great. Marquez is just as great."

[Evil Abed]

so your saying a version of pac today vs a version of marquez that fought pac before will be a an even fight?

(a version of pac today is = power in both right and left, knows how to circle opponent for counters, wiser than b4 means wasnt as careless as b4 throwing combos)

marquez outbox this version of pac today?

Pac has improved.

But not that much.

Hes been fighting a lot of sitting ducks.

The bigger slower guys make his defense look a lot better than it is,

He got pretty busted up by Clottey who landed almost everytime he thew the uppercut.(JMM's favoriate punch)

This slightly improved Pac would pose a challenge.

But JMM is the master of mid fight adjustments.

The counter punching ability of Marquez will always give Pac problems.

Much like (if it ever happens) Mayweather's counter punching will bother Pac.

[paulsinghnl]

so your saying a version of pac today vs a version of marquez that fought pac before will be a an even fight?

(a version of pac today is = power in both right and left, knows how to circle opponent for counters, wiser than b4 means wasnt as careless as b4 throwing combos)

marquez outbox this version of pac today?

it'd be a tough fight with Pacquiao probably winning it. but i think that Marquez would find a way to keep up with him. Pacquiao and Marquez the same size, pacquiao with crazy speed, both hands, foot work, Marquez with his smarts, accurate punching, lion heart.

would be a ***** good fight though, right?

[paulsinghnl]

if you are saying that the manny that fought jmm 2x before is just the same as manny now, then your logic is like the martinez that lost to margarito before is just the same as the martinez who beat pavlik.
in short no improvement?

no i don't believe so, i think Manny has gotten better physically and learnt the game a little bit better, even though he still likes to rumble. but JMM would still pose a credible threat, because of how their styles mesh together.

Like i said, would be an f-in good fight.

[viperz007]

Pac has improved.

But not that much.

Hes been fighting a lot of sitting ducks.

The bigger slower guys make his defense look a lot better than it is,

He got pretty busted up by Clottey who landed almost everytime he thew the uppercut.(JMM's favoriate punch)

This slightly improved Pac would pose a challenge.

But JMM is the master of mid fight adjustments.

The counter punching ability of Marquez will always give Pac problems.

Much like (if it ever happens) Mayweather's counter punching will bother Pac.

hmm i guess u just cant forget about that careless pac(not PRIME as u say) that fought and knockdown JMM 4-5 times but when they fight now it will be same as when they fought b4???? :///

and ya i have my own opinion about floyd vs pac too
but i aint discussing it here this aint a floyd vs pac thread ://

[viperz007]

it'd be a tough fight with Pacquiao probably winning it. but i think that Marquez would find a way to keep up with him. Pacquiao and Marquez the same size, pacquiao with crazy speed, both hands, foot work, Marquez with his smarts, accurate punching, lion heart.

would be a ***** good fight though, right?

yup it will be but it wont have same result brother

if a careless pac catch jmm with crazy angles and knockdown JMM b4 4-5 times

what would a pac who has a better power in both hands, foot work, not careless throwing his combos in other word more intelligent would do to JMM?

im seeing another clottey fight again but this one is a KO

clottey is an acurate counterpuncher and has better deffense than marquez

[straightleft]

This isn't a merit based argument, its a political one.

Marquez is clearly more skilled in every aspect, but because he has the style of a counterpuncher, especially early in his career the networks didn't consider him a moneymaker.

Pacquiao while far less skilled, has a style that is more desirable and easily sold to the general public who lets face it is more amused by violence than technical skill.


I don't see how any serious person can say Packy is more skilled when he's clearly not and needs to be matched properly to look good.

Marquez on the other hand can be matched against anyone and be a winner.

People tend to overrate skills = greatness
People tend to overrate skills > speed and power
The truth is Speed and Power >>> Skills
The truth is Pac beat Sakakul (112), Ledwaba (122) & Barrera and JMM (126) by speed and power alone coupled with granite chin. Take note, those fighter are far far more skilled than Pacquiao!
The truth is when he moved up at 130 and fought Morales, his power and speed somehow affected when he moved up in higher weight. Suddenly his speed and power are not good enogh anymore against skilled fighter like Morales. He lose so did he learned his lesson. In the second fight, its clearly you will notice the big improvement of his right hand where it was non-existence in the first fight. Morales repeatedly hit by it and knocked down while Pac fighting backward. I remember people saying back then Pac can't fight backward. Obviously Pac has improved his game and skills so much after the Morales loss. People can't see it either is blind or *****s.

[paulsinghnl]

bumping the thread up again, lets keep the discussion going.

[fcastro1]

not even close. there are some fighters that just gives other fighters trouble. bad style match up. marquez is to pacquiao what norton was to ali. that doesnt mean norton is just as great as ali. that means norton just matched up well with ali just as marquez does to pacquiao.

resume, legacy, transcendent wise, ali & pacquaio are on another level than marquez & norton.

aaron pryor beat alexis arguello twice, but you will never see a proper boxing ATG list rank pryor ahead of arguello.

great post.

[j.razor]

neither are great...

[fcastro1]

Your making a size argument now.

Pac can add the weight without losing the speed and power.

Hes a physical freak.

So Manny is a better athlete and hes naturally bigger.

Marquez is still more skilled and more intelligent.

Everything equal.

Yes Marquez could beat all those guys if he could carry the weight like Pac.

but we are trying to answer the question the ts posted. Is marquez as great as pac and you answered it yourself, he cant do the amazing things pac can do . skills doesnt determine how great you are its what you do with your overall talent and marquez is far away from pac. Not even close.