Who would you rank higher All-Time P4P; Duran, Pacquiao, or Chavez

[wazaa.]

Pacquiao-Duran-----------------------------------------------Chavez. Chavez is overrated IMO.

[Blount Brother]

Duran, Chavez, Pacquiao

[tocayito1]

even with the peds
1.duran
2.chavez
3.pacquiao
simple didnt need to think twice

[Bhopreign]

Duran over Chavez, Chavez over Pacquiao, I need a negative blood culture from Pacquiao before I could think about assessing him further.

[GoogleMe]

Roberto Duran- the greatest lightweight ever
Julio Cesar Chavez - Didn't lose in his prime
Manny Pacquiao - Not really impressed with his opposition...

[BennyST]

pacquiao is greater than all three.he would never have lost to guys like sims and laing and he would never quit either.duran was great but pac has the greater resume.


chavez was also great but a level below pac and duran

Are you sure about that? So, you think there is no possibility that Pac at 154 loses to a six foot tall, very fast counter puncher? Or what about the very large 160 pound Sims against an old, past it Pac? Maybe you don't think he would but I think there is a big chance that he loses. We'll see.

Fair enough if you think he doesn't lose to Laing and Sims. Thing is it's quite a debatable point. Pac against a six foot tall, fast, skilled counter puncher at his best weight, being 154 and a top 160 contender in a very good era for MW's when Pac was old. I think it could be easily argued either way.

However, you can't argue that Duran would lose to Morales, Singsurat and Torrecampo by decision and knockout. Or can't we do that? We can only bring up losses for other guys and not Pac because he's the GOAT and his losses don't count? Yeah, only one guys losses count.

On the same side, you say Pac doesn't lose to Laing/Sims, well I say he most definitely does lose to Sugar Ray Leonard and Iran Barkley.

Anyway, let's see what happens to Pac past his prime. Then we can talk about losses to guys like Laing/Sims etc. It makes a lot more sense when you suddenly see someone who you say "He would never lose to *insert name*. He's a bum! Pwn LAMO!" getting beaten up and knocked out by them because they are well past their best. We'll see what happens to him later.

Can you imagine all the Roy Jones fans years ago, circa 2004/2005, arguing the same utterly absurd point you are trying to now? "Hahaaa, Duran lost to Laing! There is no way Jones loses to some bum like that. Jones pwnss Duran easy!" Yeah, Jones only gets knocked out in two by guys like Danny Green. See how easy it is to do things like that?

That's what morons like you will be bringing up in many years to come when arguing against Jones being great compared to someone else. "Jones lost to some bum by brutal KO in the first round!" Yeah....

So, while Pac's career is still going, we can talk about Duran's decision losses to Sims and Laing in his thirties, past his prime, in his seventh/eighth weight division to guys who had four/five inches and many years on him and compare them to Pac's knock out losses to Singsurat and Torrecampo when he was twenty years old and a world champion in the case of Singsurat. Maybe we can compare them to something a bit more reasonable later on after he retires.

To Mr Copeland: Yeah, ok. I don't agree at all but I see where you're coming from. But if you are going to say Robinson is up the top on your P4P list when he was only 'elite' in two divisions, and ignore other guys who were elite in more, it kind of kills that theory. P4P/ATG takes into account everything. Back when they were fighting jumping weight divisions was only to get the bigger money or when you had run out of opponents. Today it is so easy and there are so many titles it's not really comparable.

What is elite anyway? A world champion? Dominating a division? Robinson was WW and MW champ. Why is he so high on your P4P list when you talk about it being about how many divisions you are elite in? By your theory, Pac should be way above him. Duran was also 'elite' in two divisions like Robinson. Dominated LW for a decade and was the only guy to beat the man at 147 for the world title, among his other world titles.

Or does Duran's weight jumping across ten divisions not equal the same as other fighters? I can't figure this out. That theory just doesn't work. Well, it works very well if you want Pac to be GOAT. What happens to someone like Harry Greb, Benny Leonard, Willie Pep?

You have Joan Guzman above them in terms of your P4P list? After all, he's a three division champ and they were only one. So is he greater on your P4P list but not your ATG list?

If you want to talk about jumping weights, that is one of Duran's greatest accomplishments and greater than Robinson's and most others too so he should be higher than them on your P4P list. According to your theory Duran should be above Robinson. He moved up many more divisions more successfully. Fighting between Bantamweight and Supermiddleweight. A good way to tell P4P ability is when someone is actually a lot smaller than the guys they are fighting in higher divisions yet can still beat them. If you are the same size, it doesn't really show your true P4P greatness.

What about Barney Ross? He also jumped weight very successfully and was the first three division simultaneous champion before Armstrong. Of course, this also means you should have Tommy Hearns up there among the top five or ten as he jumped more weight than most too. From WW to CW with titles along the way. Oscar and Mayweather should also be above Robinson.

Like I said, if you have Pac up the top above Duran etc. on your P4P list, then Mayweather, and Oscar should also be above....although he actually moved up more divisions than all and this was in the fight day weigh in era. None of it makes any sense mate. But, I guess if that's how you see it....

[BennyST]

With this evidence? Pacquiao by far.

Just winning one fight or a paper title in an era with pre fight day weigh ins and five or so titles in each division make you the elite and best in each division does it?

[-Lowkey-]

Duran by a country mile its not close at all