Removing race to help the Klitschko fans understand (HWD)

[Vadrigar.]

I stand corrected, I was off by 8 pounds, sue me. Point is "Big George" wasn't all that big if he was 220 and ONLY 4lbs heavier than Ali.

No it's due to the fact that heavyweights nowadays are fat slobs, who can't be bothered to get in shape.

George foreman was the most feared man at the time before Ali fought him.

NO one said, "oh **** he weighs 400 pounds he is the badest man in the heavyweight division"

Punching power can be manifested in any weight class and can even overlap in some.

Famous example is tommy hearns.

[knn]

Since when did Sonny Liston, Floyd Patterson, and Zora Folley become "bums?

I never claimed that. Let me get this straight if I wrote something unclear:
Neither Liston, nor Patterson, nor Folley are bums. They are far from it.

They didn't go the distance with Ali. The fact that you are trying to rewrite history by telling lies speaks for itself.

And the lies would be what exactly?

And Ali was 200 plus pounds for a long time before he "slowed down" due to age and nearly 4 years of inactivity.

But again you are comparing apples and oranges. You are comparing Eddie Chamber's speed after 30+ real heavyweight fights (both opponents 200+ lbs) with Ali after only 8 real heavyweight fights. I don't care how fast Ali was as a sub-cruiser (Olympics).

How slow was 210 Ali against Liston?

Normally fast. I didn't note anything special. Most of the time he was running away anyway.

[Vadrigar.]

I never claimed that. Let me get this straight if I wrote something unclear:
Neither Liston, nor Patterson, nor Folley are bums. They are far from it.


And the lies would be what exactly?


But again you are comparing apples and oranges. You are comparing Eddie Chamber's speed after 30+ real heavyweight fights (both opponents 200+ lbs) with Ali after only 8 real heavyweight fights. I don't care how fast Ali was as a sub-cruiser (Olympics).


Normally fast. I didn't note anything special. Most of the time he was running away anyway.

[Calilloyd]

I stand corrected, I was off by 8 pounds, sue me. Point is "Big George" wasn't all that big if he was 220 and ONLY 4lbs heavier than Ali.

Yeah, you were way off which was my point. If you don't know about something you shouldnt talk about it. And Ali was not considered a small heavyweight at the time.

[Calilloyd]

I never claimed that. Let me get this straight if I wrote something unclear:
Neither Liston, nor Patterson, nor Folley are bums. They are far from it.


And the lies would be what exactly?


But again you are comparing apples and oranges. You are comparing Eddie Chamber's speed after 30+ real heavyweight fights (both opponents 200+ lbs) with Ali after only 8 real heavyweight fights. I don't care how fast Ali was as a sub-cruiser (Olympics).


Normally fast. I didn't note anything special. Most of the time he was running away anyway.

So Ali just had "normal" handspeed, nothing "special" against Liston? Okay. I'm done. Not going to waste time arguing with a moron.

[knn]

So Ali just had "normal" handspeed, nothing "special" against Liston? Okay. I'm done. Not going to waste time arguing with a moron.

I didn't see anything extremely fast.

Hey wait a second, are you maybe watching the version with a slight speedup (Charlie-Chaplin'esque fast forward )? Hahaha, no wonder you think Ali was fast.

[T-97]

I didn't see anything extremely fast.

Hey wait a second, are you maybe watching the version with a slight speedup (Charlie-Chaplin'esque fast forward )? Hahaha, no wonder you think Ali was fast.

I'm not getting into the whole debate on resume, and who weighed what and what shoes they wore and all that ****e. But are you seriously questioning Ali's speed?

I'd say there are certain things that go without saying, one of which being Ali was a very fast Heavyweight.

[Calilloyd]

I'm not getting into the whole debate on resume, and who weighed what and what shoes they wore and all that ****e. But are you seriously questioning Ali's speed?

I'd say there are certain things that go without saying, one of which being Ali was a very fast Heavyweight.

That guy is too ignorant for me to debate with. His comments are extremely ******. He's just trolling like a fly buzzing around someone's food.

[WladIsTheChamp]

No it's due to the fact that heavyweights nowadays are fat slobs, who can't be bothered to get in shape.

George foreman was the most feared man at the time before Ali fought him.

NO one said, "oh **** he weighs 400 pounds he is the badest man in the heavyweight division"

Punching power can be manifested in any weight class and can even overlap in some.

Famous example is tommy hearns.

Tommy Hearns NEVER fought anyone that was heavier than him by 4 pounds and he never fought anyone that was a 200lb HW, let alone a 247lbs Wlad K.
Oh, and The Hitman did not have such a great KO ratio either, 70% against 165 lbs guys doesn't bode well for him if he ever had to fight someone a solid 220-230 lbs. Weight is not everything but it does count for a lot, especially for all weights under 200. A good big man will always beat a good little man, no matter how much you want to believe in this mythical Ali figure coming in and knocking out both Klitschkos on the same night. There is a reason why they rule the HW division - size and skill. It's going to take another Lewis caliber opponent to take them both down and Lewis is a top 5 ATG, so I wouldn't hold my breath for one like him showing up anytime soon.

[Joeyzagz]

You make several mistakes there.


FIRST: You claim that an athletic heavyweight is better than a chubby heavyweight. This is a completely unproven statement like "an athletic weight lifter is better than a chubby one".

Technology and athletics improve over time. An average computer today is faster than the most advanced computer of the 1960's. In every athletic sport you will see guys bigger, faster, stronger than they were in the 1960's. The current HWs should be as athletic, or blowing the old guys out of the water, but they actually look WORSE. Eddie Chambers is 6'1 209 lbs and still looks fat. Chris Arreola is an overweight sllob in his 20's.

My point is that throughout history, the best Amerrican HW could step to any athlete in the world and be respected. .


Ted Williams is one of the greatest power hitters of all time and his fore arms look like toothpicks compared to Marciano who wasnt the biggest guy in the world. Barry Bonds has the same trainer as Eddie Chambers and I guarantee you Barry's got larger arms...Heavyweights have gone from respected athletes in the United states to absolute nobodies.