Is Ali a bit overrated ?

[Vadrigar.]

And I think being a bigger draw can sometimes make you over-rated. He was second best in his era in my eyes as he never had the kind of handicap Frazier had. to be able to fight blind in one eye and hold the title Frazier clinches it....just

Ali said after that Manila fight he wanted to throw in the towel but Frazier's corner beat him to it.

Ali never said that.

[omarinbox]

Ali's corner were getting ready to throw in the towel and Frazier's corner beat them to it.

I do think he is the GOAT for bringing brains to the ring but he is, very slightly, over-rated as a boxer.

[Vadrigar.]

I see you are conveniently ignoring the fact that you disputed that Ali had ever fought someone as light as 177lbs in your earlier post. I guess you realized how ****** it is to argue something that anyone can quickly check to be true or untrue. You stated that I made up the fact that Ali fought light hws and barely cruisers (180lbs) when he was a full blown HW, I pointed to boxrec so you can check the veracity of my statements, you conveniently changed the argument to "picking" and some random bull****...nice job.

The is no random bull**** in my argument. Weight does not really mean anything when looking at Ali's resume because he didn't cherry pick the opponents.

Most of his opponents were of comparable weight and some were heavier than him.

the weights are in a random and jumbled up pattern. So this dosent prove anything.

[Vadrigar.]

Ali's corner were getting ready to throw in the towel and Frazier's corner beat them to it.

I do think he is the GOAT for bringing brains to the ring but he is, very slightly, over-rated as a boxer.

Ali's corner never got ready for throwing in the towel.

No way he is overrated as a boxer. You can't really overrate Ali because he belongs in the GOAT status for his achievements.

[WladIsTheChamp]

It was clear who's side God was on, in that fight.

Cleveland Williams could be one of the hardest punchers ever.

But anyway, the MANNER in which Ali fought that fight was just mind blowing.

You are seriously crazy. Are you saying Ali needed god's help to beat a man who was SHOT in the stomach a couple of months before the fight and who had his large intestine removed, who was basically a walking dead man, who was 12 years older than Ali, who was already beaten 5 times? Big puncher? Are you serious? Cleveland Williams had a 63% KO ratio, I would not call someone like that a big puncher.

Ali, way overrated, but his record and fame puts him firmly in the top 10 boxers of all time. H2H in any fantasy matchup, he barely makes 20 HWs of all time, he is beatable by many, many current and past fighters. Those time machine arguments are lame though, we can only compare fighters to their available competition.

[Vadrigar.]

You are seriously crazy. Are you saying Ali needed god's help to beat a man who was SHOT in the stomach a couple of months before the fight and who had his large intestine removed, who was basically a walking dead man, who was 12 years older than Ali, who was already beaten 5 times? Big puncher? Are you serious? Cleveland Williams had a 63% KO ratio, I would not call someone like that a big puncher.

Ali, way overrated, but his record and fame puts him firmly in the top 10 boxers of all time. H2H in any fantasy matchup, he barely makes 20 HWs of all time, he is beatable by many, many current and past fighters. Those time machine arguments are lame though, we can only compare fighters to their available competition.

"You are seriously crazy. Are you saying Ali needed god's help to beat a man who was SHOT in the stomach a couple of months before the fight and who had his large intestine removed, who was basically a walking dead man, who was 12 years older than Ali, who was already beaten 5 times? Big puncher? Are you serious? Cleveland Williams had a 63% KO ratio, I would not call someone like that a big puncher. " - Again I already told you. It's not the fact that he beat him which is important. It is the manner in which it was executed.

Cleveland Williams was a big puncher. It has been well documented.

"Ali, way overrated, but his record and fame puts him firmly in the top 10 boxers of all time. H2H in any fantasy matchup, he barely makes 20 HWs of all time, he is beatable by many, many current and past fighters. Those time machine arguments are lame though, we can only compare fighters to their available competition." -He belongs in the top three boxers of all time. In a fantasy match up He makes the number 1 heavyweight easily. No one could beat him.

[omarinbox]

He belongs in the top three boxers of all time. In a fantasy match up He makes the number 1 heavyweight easily. No one could beat him.

Joe Frazier beat him.

[WladIsTheChamp]

The is no random bull**** in my argument. Weight does not really mean anything when looking at Ali's resume because he didn't cherry pick the opponents.

Most of his opponents were of comparable weight and some were heavier than him.

the weights are in a random and jumbled up pattern. So this dosent prove anything.

So the fact that he was heavier than his opponent 43 out of 61 times is random according to you? You are still ignoring your lack of historical facts and statistics I see. Let me repeat - you stated that I made up the fact that Ali beat a bunch of guys weighing between 177lbs and 185lbs when he weighed in a comfortable 196lbs -220lbs. I came back with "look it up on boxrec". You came back with: "the weights are in a random and jumbled up pattern. So this dosent prove anything"? Huh? What? You do realize that you are ignoring my argument and going of on a tangent leading to a total non sequitor conclusion, right?

[omarinbox]

He pumped Liston's ass. You gonna say Liston was light?

Everyone at the time thought this crazy kid called Clay was gonna get downed and when he beart him they backed Liston in the rematch.

Then there was Foreman and he screwed his brain up and knocked him out. You saying Foreman was light?

Numb Nuts!

[Vadrigar.]

Joe Frazier beat him.

three year lay off. I'm talking about prime4prime.