pacman's increase in power (no flamers in here please)...

[Kilrain]

He punched hella hard at the lighter weights too, the fact that he doesn't have to drain himself to make weight anymore means his power is maintained, he's added muscle and strength as he's rose through the weights whereas a lot of fighters in the past i.e. Duran, Henry Armstrong etc. have moved up in weight but their bodyfat level has rose and then they're not naturally gonna be as powerful anymore. Pac's frame is unique. He still barely has any bodyfat on him. As he's got more muscle on him now than he had at 126, where he had to sweat hard to make weight, it's obvious that his power's gonna be greater. People are getting in fits, it stems from the Mayweather's jealous bismerching of Manny's name. Remember he crushed prime Barrera in 2003- raw power at 126. Crushed Morales at 130. Put on 5 lbs of muscle. Crushed Diaz. Jumped to 147 and beat Oscar with speed and constant punches and Oscar was done. Cotto's always had a suspect jaw, he stopped him which wasn't a surprise considering how busy, quick, strong and powerful Pac is. People are acting like it's insane and Pac must be using PED's. It's nonsense

[lfc19titles]

Hmm, actually, I think he has actually gotten slower, but still faster than most WWs. Of course he's gonna punch harder, he weighs more now, duh.

No 147lber has hit him on the sweet spots yet. Sure, Cotto was getting some good shots in, but, if you look at those situations, none of 'em were clearly on the side jaw or temple.

look at clottey, look at the damage he did to pacs face, thats why i think pac will beat floyd but lose to mosley if they fought.

pac was getting bruised up with just small punches from clottey who was in a shell. that fight proved to the world pac isnt superman, he didnt come close to knocking out clottey but somehow made pac look like he had been gang ****d by 5 *****s at the end of the fight

[Born2Live]

He's kept his speed but still think his power has decreased slightly coming up in weight.

[Kilrain]

Hmm, actually, I think he has actually gotten slower, but still faster than most WWs. Of course he's gonna punch harder, he weighs more now, duh.

No 147lber has hit him on the sweet spots yet. Sure, Cotto was getting some good shots in, but, if you look at those situations, none of 'em were clearly on the side jaw or temple.

He's been getting tagged behind the ears, and mostly around the eye, cheekbone area.

Cotto hit him with several right hands and a couple left hooks, clean, to the jaw. Pac just walked through them like he once walked through Erik Morales's vaunted right hand

[STREET CLEANER]

first of all compare his FIGHT NIGHT WEIGHT to floyds....pac used to drain himself loads to make 130 and lower. floyd has actually gained MORE weight than pac over the years if you compare from when they started.

hit anyone on a sweet spot and it will hurt big time, thats the secret behind pacs ko rate, he has fantastic power punching accuracy. also he has slowed down but is still the uickest welter, he used to much quicker at 130 and less.

That is the same Pac that made Morales come down twice to 130?

[MidnightBliss]

i am not accusing pacman of anything here, i swear! but i was reading something in a newspaper the other day and one part of the whole argument that pacman uses steroids seems to be this issue of him moving up in weight and his ko rate rising rather than falling. to me, this done sound somewhat strange. my question is this; how many fighters have gone up in weight and actually raised their ko rate like pacman has? can anyone name them? im 24 years old, and before the rise of really fast internet i was primarily a fan of british boxing, my point being that my knowledge of american boxing is not as entensive as my knowledge of british boxing. i cant think of any british boxers of note who have gone through the divisions and actually gained power. maybe there are some american based fighters that have?

once again, can i please point out that im not saying pacman is taking steroids. its just that all this talk about his increase in power as he has gone through the divisions made me wonder if other fighters have done the same in the past... please do not call me a *****

Good question...

But as some of the posters have stated, its not his actual power that causes problems, its his work rate. It seems as though he has an endless supply of stamina, the Clottey fight for eg. he never stopped punching for 12 rounds... also David Diaz quoted after their fight "It was really his power that bothered me but his speed, he was so ****ing fast man"

[lfc19titles]

That is the same Pac that made Morales come down twice to 130?

yup, pac was exposed if he fought higher, at that time pac would have been killed by someone like mosley or cotto. so roach kept him drained giving hima power edge over the guys he fought, until he developed him enough to risk him at a higher weight.

just look at his ring weight for his last 10 fights, will answer everything for you

[STREET CLEANER]

Actually his technic got improved over the years and he kept the volume punching with speed

[PensionKiller]

i am not accusing pacman of anything here, i swear! but i was reading something in a newspaper the other day and one part of the whole argument that pacman uses steroids seems to be this issue of him moving up in weight and his ko rate rising rather than falling. to me, this done sound somewhat strange. my question is this; how many fighters have gone up in weight and actually raised their ko rate like pacman has? can anyone name them? im 24 years old, and before the rise of really fast internet i was primarily a fan of british boxing, my point being that my knowledge of american boxing is not as entensive as my knowledge of british boxing. i cant think of any british boxers of note who have gone through the divisions and actually gained power. maybe there are some american based fighters that have?

once again, can i please point out that im not saying pacman is taking steroids. its just that all this talk about his increase in power as he has gone through the divisions made me wonder if other fighters have done the same in the past... please do not call me a *****

“Boxing has got a philosophy that all boxers should weigh as light as possible, amateur and pro. The rational is that you boil down and then carb up to make yourself stronger than your opponent on the night. In reality, the diet is a starvation diet and it destroys the strength, power and endurance of the athlete, a lot of boxers fight at a weight that they are just not naturally comfortable at,” he opined.

“Boxing people know a lot about boxing but don’t know as much about the human body as they think they do. People may not like bodybuilding but bodybuilders are experts at weight management. Someone like [Joan] Guzman is a lovely human man, an innocent guy from a poor background with a wife and kids, so I was prepared to help him out and feel the same way about all my boxers.

“Boxers take a lot out of themselves and then can’t put it all back in. A lot of people are around the athletes and they are only there to promote themselves. You and I both know that people could say that I took the Guzman fight in order to promote Kerry Kayes, why would I need to do that? I work with the British cycling team, Team Sky cycling team, I’ve worked with Blackburn Rovers and other Premiership teams, the England football team has bought our products – I don’t need to cling onto a sport or an athlete, I could retire tomorrow.”

However, the former EFBB bodybuilding champion feels that there are a few green shoots of recovery breaking their way through the dry desert landscape of boxing. “The BBBoC, in fairness, are moving things forward because they make you fill in an assistant trainer’s license - funnily enough I’ve got just my form to reapply and will keep hold of my license just in case, never say never - and when your licence runs out you have to go on a full-day course where they teach nutrition and first aid, amongst other things,” mused Kayes.

“If I can be big-headed, in my twelve years or so in this sport I have shown to a lot of other trainers and promoters that you do need a third man in the team. It was traditionally a boxer and a trainer but you are now finding that there is a conditioner/nutritionalist as well – I’d like to think I contributed to that. I once read an interview with [Frank Warren Promotion’s matchmaker] Dean Powell in which he was asked about the changes he has seen in the sport, he actually mentioned me as someone who has helped make people aware of the human body and who has helped to make boxers better athletes, and I’m proud of that.”

Still, it has been a Sisyphean struggle, from time immemorial fighters have looked for an advantage over their foes, far too many boxers have maintained a false economy when it comes to their fighting weight. Strangely, men such as Marvin Hagler, who fought his whole career at middleweight and dominated the 160lb division, are criticised for not jumping up and down in weight in search of paper titles, some boxers still cannot accept that greatness lies in knowing the limitations of your frame and working with, rather than against, you own physiology.

“Maybe Marvin Hagler comfortably stayed at the same weight throughout his career because he didn’t boil himself down falsely at the beginning of his career,” laughed Kayes when discussing the benefits of finding your optimum weight class early in your career.

“Look at Manny Pacquiao. There are rumours flying about Manny that are totally untrue in my opinion. I think it is simply a case that the guy who conditions Manny, Alex Ariza, is very, very good at his job. It is sad that people don’t just acknowledge this fact and think there must be something sinister to Manny’s recent form. Alex got hold of Pacquiao after Manny had stopped boiling down in weight and Alex is now working with a fighter that is close to where his body should be, and you can see the results for yourself.

“Some boxers fight at the same weight they fought at when they were sixteen. How can you do that? How can you falsely stop your body maturing? I believe that if an investigative journalist in England looked into the way some amateur boxers boil down at an age where they should be coming into puberty then you’d see how bad things are. People are looking to coaches to give advice to their children and I’ve heard horrific stories about coaches in the past advising their fighters not to drink water, which is the basic substance of life! You can do without food for days but try doing without water for just a few days.”

Kayes shook his head. I’d grown up with the same myths about weight making and we laughed as we went through them. Once upon a time the main view of weight making was, ‘Don’t drink any water, don’t eat any food, skip in a sauna, take these laxatives, go for a **** and then crawl onto the scales – if you don’t make the weight then you are lazy and you’ll need to train harder next time’. Kayes hopes that times are changing; he left us with one last thought.

“There is a place for nutritionalists within the sport of boxing, definitely,” he concurred.

http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=26884

This guy works with Guzman, has done with Hatton, Rampage Jackson and lots of other sports stars.

[Kryptonian]

Simple answer: Pac puts on muscle strength and size during training camp, whereas other fighter’s lose it.

If you have more muscle on your body you will naturally be able to punch harder, and punch faster. You will also be able to take a punch a lot better and even if you get wobbled by a punch your legs will be strong enough to hold you up. His work rate is absolutely phenomenal, but he is technically better with a high degree of accuracy. The reason his stamina and power are so crazy is because he does not have to drain himself ever to make weight. He actually puts on weight, size and strength during training camp the Klitchko’s do this too. If your fighting guys that are coming down in weight, draining themselves they are going to lose strength, power, and speed, because when losing weight you will also lose a certain degree of muscle mass as well as water and fat.

I will give you an example, Floyd Mayweather fights at 147lb he drains himself to make that weight, although he is highly conditioned athlete, his body is probably not functioning at its maximum optimal capacity. Say he trained just as hard and didn’t have to drain water weight and eat less calories, he would be faster, stronger and more athletic as a 157lber. Pac on the other hand is eating 7000 calories a day just to get to 145lb and his body is functioning at 100% of maximum.