Ruiz hall of shame

[ObtuseBoxer]

We will start with Johns first bid at the WBA title.
1. 2000-08 lost to a shot 37 and 10 month old Holyfield by UD
2. 2001-03 A win over a 38 year old shot Holy.
3. 2001-12 a DRAW to a very shot Holy..who was 39 years old.
4. 2002-07 a win by DQ in a very close fight.
5. 2003-03 a loss to a former middleweight ( 2x only in history)
6. 2003-12 a win over Rahman ( one fight and he is given back his belt).
7. 2004-04 a win over Oquendo who is 2-2 in his last 4.
8.2004-11 a win over Golota ( 114-111, 114-111, 113-112) Ruiz is knocked down 2x in the second and deducted 1 pt in the 4 th...114-111 ??????
9. 2005-04 a UD loss to Toney...then changed to NC...
This is the record of a champ?.....It is no wonder the public is ignoring the heavyweight division with losers like Ruiz as the title holders.

[The Pretender]

Ruiz the true champ and future hall of famer. Go Ruiz!

[neils7147933]

We will start with Johns first bid at the WBA title.
1. 2000-08 lost to a shot 37 and 10 month old Holyfield by UD
2. 2001-03 A win over a 38 year old shot Holy.
3. 2001-12 a DRAW to a very shot Holy..who was 39 years old.
4. 2002-07 a win by DQ in a very close fight.
5. 2003-03 a loss to a former middleweight ( 2x only in history)
6. 2003-12 a win over Rahman ( one fight and he is given back his belt).
7. 2004-04 a win over Oquendo who is 2-2 in his last 4.
8.2004-11 a win over Golota ( 114-111, 114-111, 113-112) Ruiz is knocked down 2x in the second and deducted 1 pt in the 4 th...114-111 ??????
9. 2005-04 a UD loss to Toney...then changed to NC...
This is the record of a champ?.....It is no wonder the public is ignoring the heavyweight division with losers like Ruiz as the title holders.

.


You can very easily make all 4 champions' recent resume look bad. The fact that you included wins on his hall of shame shows that you don't have a whole lot to back you up, but there's not a heavyweight champion with a flawless record. Byrd has a dubious decision over Oquendo, a draw with Golota, and an almost-lost to McCline. Brewster has a loss to Cliff Etienne and a should-have lost to Kali Meehan. Vitali's too most "impressive" fights were two TKO losses that his fans rationalize, but are nevertheless losses. His last three fights have been against slow, out of shape guys who thought the best way to fight him was to stand in front of him and let him land at will.

We could make a list of all the other "top" guys's flaws right now, too. Monte Barrett, Jameel McCline, Lance Whitaker, James Toney, Wlad Klitschko, Andrew Golota, Hasim Rahman - all have some not-so-impressive marks on their record.

And the undefeateds, Joe Mesi, Calvin Brock, Sam Peter, Nicolay Valuev, Audley Harrison - have A LOT to prove.

It's become a little too trendy to trash Ruiz lately. People who dis him on threads have become caricatures of others who have done it before. And then when The Pretender takes the extreme other side, people call for his banning.

We get it - the majority love Wlad and hate Ruiz. They like Vitali but most think Tyson is shot. Okay, move onto another topic...

[ObtuseBoxer]

You must love to play the devils advocate.....pretender...but Im looking for some real opinions...sorry

[ObtuseBoxer]

neils I didnt think I needed to spoon feed the obvious but I will for you. Ruiz has fought 9 times for, or to hold the WBA titil and out of 9 fights he has only won 4 ( he lost to Golota )....as for the other belt holders only 1 has a "true" record and thats VK. We shall see if VK is a real champ but its clear Byrd and esp. Ruiz are not.

[The Pretender]

You must love to play the devils advocate.....pretender...but Im looking for some real opinions...sorry

You need to listen to Neils. And all you need is to read my "15 Reasons" thread to learn what a great champ Ruiz is.

[ObtuseBoxer]

Too funny one thread on Ruiz and Im in the red.....Who knew he was so loved....I'll pass on the boring Devils advocate thread.

[neils7147933]

The "obvious" wasn't so obvious to me. Not only did Golota only win two rounds on my card, but he should have been penalized at least once for fouling, which he wasn't - and another two points for deliberately hitting Ruiz once he was down. He was lucky he was given 12 rounds to win the fight.

You'll end up in the red if you're close-minded and ****y with your opinions, especially when they are up for debate.

Vitali's list of opponents is only 3rd best of the 4 champions. It's superior to Brewster's, but not to Byrd's or Ruiz's. Vitali's best win of his career was probably Corrie Sanders - not exactly a legacy-maker there.

Top wins for Ruiz:

Andrew Golota
Fres Oquendo
Hasim Rahman
Kirk Johnson
Evander Holyfield
Tony Tucker

Byrd's best wins:

Jameel McCline
Fres Oquendo
Evander Holyfield
Vitali Klitschko
David Tua
Phil Jackson

Vitali's best wins

Danny Williams
Corrie Sanders
Kirk Johnson
Larry Donald
Herbie Hide
Vaughn Bean

Brewster's best wins

Wlad Klitschko
Kali Meehan



Much as I think he gets too much love on this site, the best heavyweight resume in terms of quality opponents beaten right now is someone without a belt - Wlad Klitschko:

Jameel McCline
Frans Botha
Ray Mercer
Chris Byrd
Monte Barrett
Axel Schulz

Point is, no one stands out right now in the heavyweight division. Why pick on one when all the top contenders are weak in terms of quality wins?

[joeboxer]

none of the champs are worth watching.

Vitali is hurt.

Rhaman is lazy.

Ruiz is boring.

Bryd hardly ever fights.

Brewster/ hardly ever fights/ isn't that good/ and doesn't have a real belt.

Tyson is shot.

Holyfield is shot.

Bowe is shot.

Golota has the heart of a pansy.

Or how about the new comers.

Nicolai Valuev
Sam Peter
Brock Whatever
Sergei Whatever
They are all worse than Wlad.

Wlad sucks right now / plus he will never fight his brother.

[ObtuseBoxer]

Ruiz and Byrd are both lame and thats a fact...But to attack me for one thread is just a joke. I never said the heavyweight division was great except Ruiz. The fact is Ruiz is destroying the heavyweight division with his extreme cheating and judges giving him the win when we all know he lost.Byrd is another thread...Out of 9 title fights and only 4 true wins, that puts Ruiz as the #1 paper champ! VK is the only possible champ in this division...and Im no VK fan but he is all we have so far.