I rewatched Berto/Collazo on HBO last night

[LEFTYGUNZZ]

Yeah but Berto holds a lot even when he isn't hurt, not saying it's a bad thing to do from his perspective because it throws his opponent's rhythm off but it doesn't make for pleasant viewing and it gets excessive.

While I agree with you on this topic as a whole Silencers I think the early point deduction was good for the fight in general but may have been a bit harsh as Berto was clearly hurt at the time of the deduction by that left hand. He still had to clear his head. For me I think holding should only be tolerated if it is done while a fighter is hurt or when he needs to gain better position on his opponent. To break up a rythem is a good thing but the fighter should not hold on until told to break. Grabbing on for a second or two and then stepping back and letting your hands go can be more effective then giving you and your opponent a rest....Lefty

[Silencers]

While I agree with you on this topic as a whole Silencers I think the early point deduction was good for the fight in general but may have been a bit harsh as Berto was clearly hurt at the time of the deduction by that left hand. He still had to clear his head. For me I think holding should only be tolerated if it is done while a fighter is hurt or when he needs to gain better position on his opponent. To break up a rythem is a good thing but the fighter should not hold on until told to break. Grabbing on for a second or two and then stepping back and letting your hands go can be more effective then giving you and your opponent a rest....Lefty

I'm not just basing it on the early parts of the Collazo fight but with the Urango fight as well where he was allowed to hold for long periods without getting warned harshly for it, he wasn't hurt in that fight. It totally ruined the rhythm of the fight. I have nothing wrong with clinches, I have a problem with them when it gets excessive, Berto seems to get excessive with it.

[any craic lad?]

I think collazo won a close fight but i got respect for both collazo is still underrated like a lot of people will argue he beat hatton he had badly stunned in the last and this the pre mayweather hatton ok he lost badly to mosley but he hurt his hand badly in the second round and at worst berto just beat him.

[Boxer1590]

Very close & competitive fight, could have gone wither way.

I was impressed by Berto's digging down deep in that fight especially the way he pulled out the last round.

I was also impressed by Collazo's inside fighting skills. I think it was the third round, Collazo showed some serious inside fighting skills.

A lot of people say Berto made that fight harder than he should have been, but I disagree. Collazo made that fight hard for him. Collazo was giving Berto a lot of trouble boxing from the outside and also on the inside, that's why Berto didn't really know exactly what to do in that fight. He would probably perform much better if they had a rematch though, I think he learned a lot from that fight.

[LEFTYGUNZZ]

I'm not just basing it on the early parts of the Collazo fight but with the Urango fight as well where he was allowed to hold for long periods without getting warned harshly for it, he wasn't hurt in that fight. It totally ruined the rhythm of the fight. I have nothing wrong with clinches, I have a problem with them when it gets excessive, Berto seems to get excessive with it.

In respect to this thread I was strictly talking about the Collazo fight. I agre with you 100% about the Urango fight I even made a thread about it

Berto dancing and holding his way in a snoozefest

The same would need to be said about Andre Ward when he fought Edison Miranda too Silencers....I also made a thread about that fight....

Ward Held, Elbow'd and Shoved His Way To Victory...

These two threads were posted by myself back when the fights happened I was not given too much thought back then but I am bringing them up to the light now...Check them out let me knw if I was off base about those fights now...Lefty

[The_Demon]

hatton beat collazo more convincingly than berto did imo

[Silencers]

In respect to this thread I was strictly talking about the Collazo fight. I agre with you 100% about the Urango fight I even made a thread about it

Berto dancing and holding his way in a snoozefest

The same would need to be said about Andre Ward when he fought Edison Miranda too Silencers....I also made a thread about that fight....

Ward Held, Elbow'd and Shoved His Way To Victory...

These two threads were posted by myself back when the fights happened I was not given too much thought back then but I am bringing them up to the light now...Check them out let me knw if I was off base about those fights now...Lefty

You weren't, Ward did a lot of clinching and wrestling against Miranda and so did Berto against Urango.

[LEFTYGUNZZ]

You weren't, Ward did a lot of clinching and wrestling against Miranda and so did Berto against Urango.

Go to my thread about holding and lets get this in over there more on the topic of that thread. I don't want to steal this TS thread Silencers...Lefty

[Bushbaby]

I rewatched that fight a couple days ago too,all it did was make me mad!!Berto had a point deducted,it was a bad call,but with that said,for Berto to still win,that means Collazo only won 4 rounds!!No way,Collazo controlled most of that fight rather handily!!U look at that fight however u look at it,it was either only the 6th or 7th & the 12th that Berto ever really controlled,no way Collazo only won at most 4 rounds,none!!

[savorduhflavor]

I thought Berto won a pretty clear decision.

Lederman's scoring was asinine. There was one round, I forget which one, where Berto landed like 21 out of 27 power shots to Collazo's 8 out of 20 someting, and Lederma gave the round to Berto.

Berto clearly won the fight IMO, and I hate Berto.