The reason people think Pac is using PEDs is because hes retained his power right?

[Easy-E]

Lesser fighters than Pacquiao hurt Hatton and Cotto. Juan Lazcano? If he can hurt Hatton it's not surprising that Manny can one-punch KO his ass. Cotto was beaten by speed, not by power. Beaten to the punch all night. The knockdowns didn't look like particularly brutal punches, they were just expertly timed.

Yeah I am playing devils advocate here. No one has done that to Hatton, and Pac was not able to do that even to lesser fighters. He has always been a speed/accumulation puncher.
And the first Cotto kd I agree with but not the second. That was a brutal punch.
I have never seen Cotto has hurt as he was against Manny. Not vs Marg or Torres.

[Doctor_Tenma]

so,

in retrospect,

Manny Pacquiao was a HUGE, HUGE flyweight?

Right.

Seeing as how Manny was going up more than 10 pounds after weigh in at SFW fights, that would also have made him a HUGE SFW,

right?


Just want to clarify.

No, Pacquiao looked really really good against David Diaz. I never thought he would move up for 135 because he looked good. Your comparing an averaged size LW/ Jr WW to a HUGE HUGE WW in Thomas Hearns, so the comparison is an ugly one. Your best bet is Roberto Duran but even Duran performaed worst and worst as he moved up.

[crold1]

Also it is about body weight percentage as opposed to overall weight.

It's also worth noting that Pac, according to HBO unofficial weights, has been entering the ring as a Jr. Welter/Welterweight for most of the last four years. It's not like he weighed 130 on the scale and only added a few pounds before fight time in 05. His height, reach, and fight time weights are comparable to Ross, McLarnin, and many other great but smaller Welters (not that I'm calling Pac a great Welter just yet). The PED thing doesn't factor that in at all.

[-MAKAVELLI-]

Yeah I am playing devils advocate here. No one has done that to Hatton, and Pac was not able to do that even to lesser fighters. He has always been a speed/accumulation puncher.
And the first Cotto kd I agree with but not the second. That was a brutal punch.
I have never seen Cotto has hurt as he was against Manny. Not vs Marg or Torres.

torres or marg didn't have the handspeed to plant a perfect uppercut...but this is all moot...he's on roids...

[Ray*]

The steriods acusation is ******ed IMO, and any serious person cant take it too serious but at the sametime i cant vouch for a man that i dont know what he does behind a close day.

[Easy-E]

torres or marg didn't have the handspeed to plant a perfect uppercut...but this is all moot...he's on roids...

I mean its not all about handspeed as opposed to raw power that other guys have, that have landed on Cotto.
And I would never accuse Manny of roiding unless there was hard evidence.

[S A M U R A I]

Yeah I am playing devils advocate here. No one has done that to Hatton, and Pac was not able to do that even to lesser fighters. He has always been a speed/accumulation puncher.
And the first Cotto kd I agree with but not the second. That was a brutal punch.
I have never seen Cotto has hurt as he was against Manny. Not vs Marg or Torres.

But Pacquiao KO'd a ton of fighters at lower weights!

If he was weakening his body by draining too much in the past, then why wouldn't be be more powerful when he's not draining, like right now? If you punch correctly, you get your weight behind your shots, right? Now that Pacquiao is a little heavier, he hits harder. It's really simple to see how he's gotten more powerful, or should I say, he's now able to utilize his full power, which was always there but not being 100% tapped into due to weakening the body and draining right down. Maybe his technique became better too? Very possible. The more you do something, generally the better you get at it.



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[Vasyl’s dad]

No, Pacquiao looked really really good against David Diaz. I never thought he would move up for 135 because he looked good. Your comparing an averaged size LW/ Jr WW to a HUGE HUGE WW in Thomas Hearns, so the comparison is an ugly one. Your best bet is Roberto Duran but even Duran performaed worst and worst as he moved up.

The comparison is only ugly to you because it negates everything you guys think about Pacquiao, a punchers natural abilities and how being at a smaller weight takes away from these guys.


and lets not skew facts here, Pac has had only 4 fights above 130, you're trying to make it appear as if hes spent a large portion of his career at 135 and up.

So call it what it is if you're going to say Hearns was a HUGE ww.

Pac was a HUGE flyweight.

[Vasyl’s dad]

The steriods acusation is ******ed IMO, and any serious person cant take it too serious but at the sametime i cant vouch for a man that i dont know what he does behind a close day.

So then, you can't vouch for any fighter, right?

[Doctor_Tenma]

The comparison is only ugly to you because it negates everything you guys think about Pacquiao, a punchers natural abilities and how being at a smaller weight takes away from these guys.


and lets not skew facts here, Pac has had only 4 fights above 130, you're trying to make it appear as if hes spent a large portion of his career at 135 and up.

So call it what it is if you're going to say Hearns was a HUGE ww.

Pac was a HUGE flyweight.

Pacquiao was 16 at 106 as was Mayweather. Guys usually stop growing at the ages of 20-23. There are LWs and Jr WWs bigger then Pacquiao.