Vitali KlitschkO

[hollister]

You can't be helped.

The fact the only other time he weighed above 250 was when he got starched by Rahman speaks for itself. It was refective of the shape he was in. What may only seems like a few pounds is more than that
when we're talking about that weight being his peak condition.

At 256, he was 3 pounds heavier than when Rahman knokced him out, and he admitted at that time he wasn't in very good shape.

You're outright wrong, and you don't have a leg to stand on.


Carrer high weight + the 1 year activity + being 37 = Not a primed and sharp Lennox Lewis.


I really don't see how you can't admit you're wrong.

The point is, he wasn't in peak shape, he was ripe for the taking, and he still beat Vitali.

My leg is right above your post.

I can't believe that you're such a stubborn idiot that even when faced with the facts to support my claim, you resort to statements like "the fact that the only time he was ever above 250 was when he got starched by Rahman speaks for it's self". Lewis' conditioning never became a factor in that fight. The only difference was Lewis sticking his ****ing hand out and getting hit with that right hand, that's it, no ifs ands or buts about it. He got hit, and went down. It wasn't late in the fight, the fight wasn't even a rough one. Just out of the blue, he gets hit with a right hand that KO's him, period.

[Bozo_no no]

My leg is right above your post.

I can't believe that you're such a stubborn idiot that even when faced with the facts to support my claim, you resort to statements like "the fact that the only time he was ever above 250 was when he got starched by Rahman speaks for it's self". Lewis' conditioning never became a factor in that fight. The only difference was Lewis sticking his ****ing hand out and getting hit with that right hand, that's it, no ifs ands or buts about it. He got hit, and went down. It wasn't late in the fight, the fight wasn't even a rough one. Just out of the blue, he gets hit with a right hand that KO's him, period.

What does that prove? Was Lewis 37 and coming off a year layoff when weighing 253 against Rahman?

No he wasn't.

I'm still hoping you're going to catch on, because its blatantly obvious you're outright wrong here.

A career high weight ADDED TO THE FACT he was coming off a year layoff ADDED TO THE FACT he was 37 = Not a primed sharp Lennox Lewis.

You're such a wounded Klitschko fan you think it takes some of the sting away to imagine your hero in with Lewis at his best.

It was pain stakingly obvious Lennox wasn't near to being at his best, and he still beat Vitali.

You can pretend to not understand all you want. You only look more and more desperate to hold on to one little point.

Again, Lewis wasn't near to being at his best, and he still beat Klitschko.

[Kid Achilles]

Once again, Vitali was not as his best either! He had 2 weeks to prepare himself to fight the heavyweight champion of the world. This was not a case of Vitali having all the time in the world to prepare for Lewis and Lewis having only a few weeks. Neither fighter was at their best.

Another reason that a rematch would have been apropriate.

[tracylee]

And you have no way of knowing he wouldn't have been the same fighter because he was too ****ing lazy and sorry to train consistently so that it would have been proven.

He was doing the same thing VK has been doing, fighting who was there, and avoiding the ones he didn't want to fight (Ruiz, Byrd). You're just arguing to argue. Anyone with half a brain could have seen that by looking at the last few fights he had, he was beating his opponents with about the same amount of effort, and physically as well as stylewise, looked about the same as he always had, regardless of his weight fluctuation. There was no clear indication of deterioration where his performance was concerned, because he was a fighter that would keep you at range, and if he couldn't do that, he would tie you up, or lean all over you to tire you out. That worked until he fought VK. He still won the fight, which is why it bothers me that some people act like he was ****ing Moses or something. The guy came in to fight in about the same condition he always did, but had a much rougher fight, that's it. This isn't a ****ing scientific experiment, you can just watch the mother****er fight and see what I'm saying.

Sorry Hollister...I like you just fine, and you and I have agreed and disagreed often in the past. This time I totally disagree...Lewis didnt obtain the record and status he had by merely leaning on his opponet to tire them and tying them up. Thats taking away from the talent that he did have...love him or hate him, that is so not fair. There is no way he could have been champ for as long as he was if those 2 were the only skills he possessed

[hollister]

Sorry Hollister...I like you just fine, and you and I have agreed and disagreed often in the past. This time I totally disagree...Lewis didnt obtain the record and status he had by merely leaning on his opponet to tire them and tying them up. Thats taking away from the talent that he did have...love him or hate him, that is so not fair. There is no way he could have been champ for as long as he was if those 2 were the only skills he possessed

Sorry, I didn't mean to compare him with Ruiz or anything, as there were plenty of fights where his opponents never really got close enough for that type of thing. I only meant that if you were one of the ones quick or luck enough to get inside, he wouldn't allow you to stay there and work. He'd either punch and push off, or tie you up. I have seen him lean on opponents from time to time, many larger fighters do it. I only meant to say that with his style and size, he could still have had some fights left in him, if that had been his choice.

[stepmonster]

klit is not a legitimate p4p ranker because he hasent faught a qualitly opponent, he himself is afraid to fight one as he always is dodging now that he has the belt, williams was nothing buy rock could surprise him

[stepmonster]

vitali should fight james toney, that would be a match and a half. i would love to see it go down, he would also then be fighting a quality opponent.

[hollister]

What does that prove? Was Lewis 37 and coming off a year layoff when weighing 253 against Rahman?

No he wasn't.

I'm still hoping you're going to catch on, because its blatantly obvious you're outright wrong here.

A career high weight ADDED TO THE FACT he was coming off a year layoff ADDED TO THE FACT he was 37 = Not a primed sharp Lennox Lewis.

You're such a wounded Klitschko fan you think it takes some of the sting away to imagine your hero in with Lewis at his best.

It was pain stakingly obvious Lennox wasn't near to being at his best, and he still beat Vitali.

You can pretend to not understand all you want. You only look more and more desperate to hold on to one little point.

Again, Lewis wasn't near to being at his best, and he still beat Klitschko.

You're an idiot, you know that, right? You've completely pushed my point aside, which was if Lennox had come in shape to fight, he could easily have been as sharp as he had been at any point in the last five years, at the very least. When he fought Rahman the first time, for his three preceding fights, he had weighed in at 249, 250, and 247, comprende? Now, keeping in mind what I have said over and over again "if he was in shape" who's fault was it that he took a year off, ate twinkies and completely neglected his body, HMMM? How exactly do his decisions regarding his physical fitness suggest that he was so old and rotted that he was forced into retirement? You keep missing the point purposely. I never said that VK fought a prime, conditioned Lewis (please quote me if I did), I said that in his particular case, had he trained properly he most likely would have been as effective as he had ever been in his career, as anyone who's followed him will tell you that he evolved into a complete fighter late in his career. This whole thing started because you compared his situation to Ali's and Joe Louis' retirement, which is utterly ridiculous. I'll say it again. Ali, at 37, would not have been successful even if his body was in peak condition, he he was taking medication for a thyroid problem, and spoke like he was brain-damaged, not to mention having no reflexes or pop left on his punches. He could have trained for a year straight and ate right and he still would have lost to anyone worth a ****. Lennox's situation was not by any means comparable to Ali's. Again, the difference between Ali's and Lewis' situation is that Lewis could have gotten himself back into shape, and would have been more or less as effective as he was in his prime, Ali would not have been any where close to even the 1974 version of himself, which wasn't all that impressive. Lewis layed up for a year eating twinkies, and on fight night he was still only seven pounds heavier than in his last fight? That's not that bad for a heavy. Who's clinging to one little point? And which "one little point" would you be referring to? You're the one who keeps bringing up the fact that Lewis was over 250 when he lost to Rahman, like that's what made him lose lol. Nowhere, I repeat nowhere in that fight did any extra weight beome a factor. He was a little heavy, and maybe his conditioning was somewhat lacking to be fair, but that had no bearing on the outcome of the fight whatsoever. Again, quote me if I ever said that VK fought a primed and conditioned Lewis. Again, I said that the situation was under his control, and if he had simply chosen to stay in shape like a champion should, he would have been as effective as he had been in his so-called prime. And again, he went 12 rounds with Tua at 249, 10 rounds with Mercer at 247, and 8 rounds with Tyson at 249. He also came in to fight at 250 vs. Botha, and 247 vs. Grant, so he was more than a little comfortable with the extra weight, and I really doubt the weight was anywhere near as large a factor as you're making it out to be. Again, my initial point had very little to do with the ****ing VK fight, it was more about how Lewis was not by any means past it and retired by choice, whereas Ali was in terrible shape both physically and neurologically, and needed very badly to retire, risking even more severe damage otherwise.
And please, anyone who reads this and thinks that my logic is as incomprensible as Boo Boo the Clown is making it out to be, let me know.

[Bozo_no no]

You're an idiot, you know that, right? You've completely pushed my point aside, which was if Lennox had come in shape to fight, he could easily have been as sharp as he had been at any point in the last five years, at the very least. When he fought Rahman the first time, for his three preceding fights, he had weighed in at 249, 250, and 247, comprende? Now, keeping in mind what I have said over and over again "if he was in shape" who's fault was it that he took a year off, ate twinkies and completely neglected his body, HMMM? How exactly do his decisions regarding his physical fitness suggest that he was so old and rotted that he was forced into retirement? You keep missing the point purposely. I never said that VK fought a prime, conditioned Lewis (please quote me if I did), I said that in his particular case, had he trained properly he most likely would have been as effective as he had ever been in his career, as anyone who's followed him will tell you that he evolved into a complete fighter late in his career. This whole thing started because you compared his situation to Ali's and Joe Louis' retirement, which is utterly ridiculous. I'll say it again. Ali, at 37, would not have been successful even if his body was in peak condition, he he was taking medication for a thyroid problem, and spoke like he was brain-damaged, not to mention having no reflexes or pop left on his punches. He could have trained for a year straight and ate right and he still would have lost to anyone worth a ****. Lennox's situation was not by any means comparable to Ali's. Again, the difference between Ali's and Lewis' situation is that Lewis could have gotten himself back into shape, and would have been more or less as effective as he was in his prime, Ali would not have been any where close to even the 1974 version of himself, which wasn't all that impressive. Lewis layed up for a year eating twinkies, and on fight night he was still only seven pounds heavier than in his last fight? That's not that bad for a heavy. Who's clinging to one little point? And which "one little point" would you be referring to? You're the one who keeps bringing up the fact that Lewis was over 250 when he lost to Rahman, like that's what made him lose lol. Nowhere, I repeat nowhere in that fight did any extra weight beome a factor. He was a little heavy, and maybe his conditioning was somewhat lacking to be fair, but that had no bearing on the outcome of the fight whatsoever. Again, quote me if I ever said that VK fought a primed and conditioned Lewis. Again, I said that the situation was under his control, and if he had simply chosen to stay in shape like a champion should, he would have been as effective as he had been in his so-called prime. And again, he went 12 rounds with Tua at 249, 10 rounds with Mercer at 247, and 8 rounds with Tyson at 249. He also came in to fight at 250 vs. Botha, and 247 vs. Grant, so he was more than a little comfortable with the extra weight, and I really doubt the weight was anywhere near as large a factor as you're making it out to be. Again, my initial point had very little to do with the ****ing VK fight, it was more about how Lewis was not by any means past it and retired by choice, whereas Ali was in terrible shape both physically and neurologically, and needed very badly to retire, risking even more severe damage otherwise.
And please, anyone who reads this and thinks that my logic is as incomprensible as Boo Boo the Clown is making it out to be, let me know.

You're the idiot, and you've proven that to me several times now on several different Klitschko brother related topics.

The fact you'd ramble on like that only illustrates how desperate and wounded you are in regard to Klitschko related topics.

I didn't read any of that. Just looking at it shows how fanatical you are.

I made my point about Lewis and the shape he was in for the Vitali fight so clear a two year old could understand.

Your head is so far up both their asses you don't know up from down.

Useless discussing anyting Klitschko related with you.

[hollister]

You're the idiot, and you've proven that to me several times now on several different Klitschko brother related topics.

The fact you'd ramble on like that only illustrates how desperate and wounded you are in regard to Klitschko related topics.

I didn't read any of that. Just looking at it shows how fanatical you are.

I made my point about Lewis and the shape he was in for the Vitali fight so clear a two year old could understand.

Your head is so far up both their asses you don't know up from down.

Useless discussing anyting Klitschko related with you.

That just shows how ****** and stubborn you are. Now everyone who reads that post will see how you've tried to change the original point of my post time and again. If you had taken the time to read entire posts before responding, you wouldn't look so childish and blinded by wanting to be right. I asked you for an explanation of how and why I was wrong in my point(s), and all you came up with was "No, that's not it" and "you're wrong", with no real explanation as to why. If you don't want to bother with reading my posts, that's fine, because I promise you that others will. That response, coupled with the fact that you tried to compare Lewis' situation with Ali's in the first place will only add to your ignorant, foolish image. By the way, what is "fan" short for? The fact alone that you have been willing to argue the point with me for so long leads me to believe you're a "fan" too.